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help with chord width/pitch for blade w/ S822/S823 | 13 comments (13 topical, editorial)
Re: help with chord width/pitch (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by SparWeb (sparweb at ANTISPAM_hotmail_com) on Tue Oct 9th, 2007 at 01:31:36 PM MST
(User Info)

I'm going to set aside my INTENSE curiosity regarding the logistics of procuring materials, acquiring skilled labour, building suitable facilities, and distributing parts, etc, considering the available infrastructure in Kabul!  You are ambitious!
I suppose you're involved with an NGO.

Hugh Piggot has already published manuals geared specifically for your task.  Several designs can be chosen, and scaled according to your needs, too.

To answer your specific question (briefly), the blades of a wind turbine need to be producing lift at a reasonable angle of attack.  Looking at the tip of a wind turbine blade, it should be traveling around the axis at, for example 6 m/s in a wind of 1 m/s.  But half-way down the span of the blade, that's only moving at 3 m/s in the same wind.  If the airfoil at the tip is inclined at its optimal angle of attack, then it won't be half-way down, unless there is some twist to make up for the slower rotational velocity as you get closer to the axis.

Glauert was an aerodynamicist from the early half of the 1900's who figured out an awful lot of the aerodynamics that we consider "obvious" today.  A "Glauert twist distribution" probably means a twist that conserves the angle of attack through the span of the blade, however Mr. Glauert was subtle enough to have also been aware of tip effects, and maybe adjusted twist at the tip to account for that, too.

I don't know why the researchers in the studies you posted would have recommended an S823 airfoil for such small wind turbines (as low as 1kW).  Say the wind turbine you propose to build has a diameter of 12 feet (3.6m).  The chord of each blade (3 blades) would be about 7.5 inches.  At the tip, the chord should taper down to about 5 inches.

At this scale, the difference between the Selig 822 airfoil and an "ancient" NACA is very small.  If you were then to compare the performance specs of these two airfoils, carefully considering scale effects, you would find very little difference in the end result.  It might matter in a bigger turbine, but not a small one.

Worse, the S823 has a nasty concave curvature at the trailing edge, that will be much more difficult to control than an airfoil with all convex curvatures.

If you're going to be responsible for the detailed aerodynamic design of a wind turbine, that people will be investing money and livelihoods into, I strongly suggest you get some aerodynamics books and take a few seminars!

We like to help here, but remember:
Advice given on the internet is worth what you paid for it!

Good luck.

Steven Fahey



Re: help with chord width/pitch (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by cslarson on Wed Oct 10th, 2007 at 01:42:57 AM MST
(User Info)

Hi Steven,
Thanks for the response!  About 6 months ago we installed a 500W wind turbine that I built based on Hugh Piggot's book "How to Build a Wind Turbine" (June 2005 edition).  There is now a German and also a (very inspiring - prior to meeting us he had already built his own!) Afghan working on producing more of these for distribution.  Carpenters are trained to produce the blades.  Neodymium magnets are imported from China.  There can be some fun involved finding good local supplies (i'm thinking of using schedule 8, 4" PVC we have here to stiffen up and supply the root shape of my blades).  

Taking build time, cost of materials, and cost of controller, batteries, and inverter into consideration I was generally unsatisfied with the resulting cost/watt.  I am hoping to improve this through the design of a larger, 1.5-2KW machine.  While not all do, some costs scale well.  Additionally, a larger machine might be designed that can be more generically suited to other applications, specifically pumping water.

So, I'm starting from scratch to really learn how these machines work.  As I mentioned, we have a wind map of Afghanistan now, which will give me much more confidence that any new design can be properly targeted for use here.

The researchers were comparing their new blades to those from a Bergey 1.5KW turbine.  Unlike what would be probably be suggested here, these incorporate no twist or taper.

Thanks again, it's nice to be welcomed to the board.
-Carl

[ Parent ]



help with chord width/pitch for blade w/ S822/S823 | 13 comments (13 topical, 0 editorial)

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