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been awhile, checkin in | 17 comments (17 topical, editorial)
Re: been awhile, checkin in (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by bob g on Wed Aug 15th, 2007 at 11:48:01 PM MST
(User Info)

no i didnt post all the test results, basically just to reduce the word count

but here they are

input voltage       mx60 indicated     meter one       meter two
.                          60.0               60.0            60.0

input current            3.9                 3.9             3.9

output voltage        13.2                13.2           13.2

output amperage     * 6.9 *                 5.7            5.7

as you can see the two external test meters agree with outbacks screen on input and output voltage and input current,, but disagree significantly on output current.

when we called outback we were told they compute the output current and do not actually measure it!  so... how do you get accurate efficiency computations if you compute one of the variables and it is so far off of reality?

this is why i would like to see someone else check their output current externally and compare it with the screen indicated current.

volvo farmer:

yes i am aware that they can be had for about 450, but even at that level
i want to see better efficiencies (actual) not calculated based on some fuzzy math.

yes these are being tested on a solar array, we tested them with various panels of various wattage input and from 30 volts input to 80 volts input,, and got very near the same results in efficiency with actual readings. and coincidentally the screen still computed mid to high 90 efficiency, which is apparently a flawed result.

thank you both

anyone got one they can test the output on?

bob g



Re: been awhile, checkin in (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by DamonHD (d@hd.org) on Thu Aug 16th, 2007 at 03:52:02 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.earth.org.uk/

Is it at all possible that the pulsed output current that the MX60 will be producing is causing the external meters to misread?  (It would be less likely to cause the same misreading in different brands of meter, I think.)

Rgds

Damon

[ Parent ]



Re: been awhile, checkin in (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by boB on Thu Aug 16th, 2007 at 02:54:02 PM MST
(User Info) http://bob.gudgel.org

I see most of your problem, bob.  One reason the DC to DC conversion efficiency is
low is because you are using a higher input voltage.  It may be lower by just
1 or 2 percent because of that BUT the BIGGIE is that you are outputting such
a LOW output power that the power losses are a BIG percentage of the output power.
For instance, the MX (and any controller) takes some power just to operate
the relay and the DC-DC converter. Also, the higher the voltage at the input
terminals... the higher the "idle" or "tare" losses are.  Now, if you measure
your output power vs. the input power, it can be extremely low. Say, you
were putting out ONE (1) amp to the battery... The efficiency will be
extremely low.  I'd say 85% is pretty good in your case.  If it were a 24V
and even better yet, a 48 V battery system, and the SAME output current,
you would have twice or 4 times the output power you have now, and those
idle losses would be less of a portion of the total output power and the measured
efficiency would come up.

You notice how manufactures never seem to publish efficiency at low output
powers ?  Especially inverters.  You will notice the efficiency curve dropping
at a very steep slope at the left hand side (lower power side) of the power
vs. efficiency graph.

And SOMEBODY has the wrong information on the MX60 meter !  The MX measures
the OUTPUT, NOT the input current.  It's the INPUT current that is calculated,
so the output current should read closer. Maybe it got mis-adjusted somehow ??
The current is averaged in hardware and software so shouldn't make a lot of difference if there is output current ripple or smooth DC current.
Most inverters will cause 120 Hz current ripple on the DC line at higher output powers.

Hope this helps shed some light.

boB

[ Parent ]



been awhile, checkin in | 17 comments (17 topical, 0 editorial)

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