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increasing alternator perf/eff curve | 10 comments (10 topical, 0 editorial)
Re: increasing alternator perf/eff curve (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by Flux on Fri Feb 22nd, 2008 at 01:25:40 AM MST
(User Info)

bob
I don't go back to the Old Board era but I did a diary entry called matching the load in which I covered virtually every method of load matching that I could think of. I concentrated most on using a boost converter at the low speed end because that was the scheme that I had tried and proved effective at that time. I did include the mixed diode/mosfet boost circuit.

Since then I have done some work on the buck converter approach starting at cut in volts and leaving the alternator volts rise with speed.

I can assure you that both schemes work effectively. The buck converter is better in that it is far less affected by line resistance, but if you have short low resistance lines there is not a lot to choose.

I don't have a site of my own so I have to do tests as and when I can at other peoples convenience( or perhaps inconvenience) so it doesn't give me the chance to get as much data as quickly as I would sometimes like.

I am not prepared to give results unless they have been measured under reasonable conditions and are likely to be fairly accurate. I had hoped by now to have more performance figures for the buck converter.

You may have seen this before, it was an early test I did on a 6ft machine under poor and turbulent wind conditions. The top end wind speeds were few and far between and the result is undoubtedly skewed in such a way as to make the high wind end come out low. It does at least show that the converter gains you power all the way up the wind speed range although the big improvement only starts to come at wind speeds beyond that test.

Recently the thing has been doing over 30A into a 24 v battery. Unfortunately I don't have wind measurements but they must be below 30mph as that was the highest gust figures from a local airfield located in better surroundings.



The top curve is with converter. Bottom is alternator direct to battery and the middle one is with some series resistance added to hold the prop out of stall ( usually done with a lower efficiency alternator direct).

Adding series resistance doesn't have much effect on the low wind end but does raise the high wind results by holding prop out of stall.

Whatever you do in the low wind region the prop curve is so flat that it can never effectively match the steep slope of a high efficiency alternator. The improvement in the lower winds from the converter is more due to matching the prop than alternator efficiency. The top end gains on both scores with the prop on design tsr and the electrical efficiency still over 70% including the alternator rectifier and converter.

Hope this goes part way to answering your question.

Flux



Re: increasing alternator perf/eff curve (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by Hoskald (letsgoviking [AT] gmail [DOT] com) on Fri Feb 22nd, 2008 at 05:24:08 AM MST
(User Info) http://letsgoviking.com

Flux,
quick question, how do you deal with the nominal voltage from the turbine since it varies a great deal?

Thanks,
Hos
____ For the sake of Peace the Sword... www.letsgoviking.com
[ Parent ]



Re: increasing alternator perf/eff curve (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by Flux on Fri Feb 22nd, 2008 at 07:23:45 AM MST
(User Info)

The ideal is when prop speed tracks wind speed, if the alternator efficiency is high enough then this virtually means that the alternator voltage rises with wind speed, so you would expect about 3 or 4 times cut in voltage at the furling point.

The interesting bit is to track the load so as to achieve this voltage rise. If there were no losses you would need the alternator power out to increase as the cube of its rotational speed. In real life with the inclusion of reasonable losses I have found that tracking dc current against rotational speed squared gives a close approximation and that is the scheme I finally settled on.

I take frequency from the alternator convert to a voltage with a 2917 tacho chip, feed to a multiplier to get speed squared and use a tracking control loop to track output current to speed squared. If the loop gain is low then the output rises more steeply than speed squared. By altering the gain I can get a good match to the cube law.

Flux

[ Parent ]



Re: increasing alternator perf/eff curve (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by commanda (alwynne at unwired dot com dot au) on Fri Feb 22nd, 2008 at 09:35:58 AM MST
(User Info)

I've also been playing with this stuff, but currently have problems setting up a viable test rig. There's a few notes here:
http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2006/3/12/14840/1315

http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2007/11/25/22656/782

I'm using an un-modified F&P as the source.

Amanda

[ Parent ]



Re: increasing alternator perf/eff curve (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by SparWeb (sparweb at ANTISPAM_hotmail_com) on Fri Feb 22nd, 2008 at 11:17:37 AM MST
(User Info)

Hi Flux,

I don't think I understand something about that chart.  Maybe it's just a different turn of terminology.  I feel like a newbie asking this question, but could you clarify this statement, please?

"Adding series resistance doesn't have much effect on the low wind end but does raise the high wind results by holding prop out of stall."

I once added series resistance to my windmill to improve low wind performance, because the blades would stall... in light winds.  I can't picture my fixed-pitch prop stalling in high winds.  Power in is cubed, power out is (at best) squared.  Maybe I should go back and read your "Matching the load" diary.

Are you using a pitch-change mechanism that stalls the blades at high RPM?  Or is there a reduction in thrust load, in the resistance-matched and buck configuration, that keeps a furling mechanism from activating until a higher wind speed?
Steven Fahey
[ Parent ]



Re: increasing alternator perf/eff curve (3.00 / 0) (#9)
by Flux on Fri Feb 22nd, 2008 at 11:58:22 AM MST
(User Info)

No pitch change or furling involved here in those tests.

The lower curves are just what you were talking about adding series resistance to improve the performance when in stall. The bottom curve shows severe stall from 15 mph upwards. That is the low wind end as far as I am concerned. If I chose a much lower cut in then the stall would come in earlier.

I doubt that the thing would ever get out of that stall in any wind. By adding resistance you can extend the operation to a higher wind speed.

Although there is no obvious bad stall below 15mph, there is still some reduction of prop efficiency almost from cut in and you can see that with the converter there is increased output in the region below 15mph. That was what I meant when I said that the added resistance has little effect.

If any normal machine hits stall bad stall under 15mph then I would suggest that the cut in speed is too low. I think most people go for cut in speeds lower than necessary in the belief that it will help low wind results. Only on a very low wind site is this a benefit. The first step with stall is to try to increase cut in speed, if it high enough and you start to loose out in low winds then is the time to add resistance.

Raising cut in speed by increasing air gap is a useful dodge for fine tuning but it is not a good idea to deliberately aim for too low a cut in. It is better to raise cut in with less turns of thicker wire and keep efficiency up. If you have to compensate with added resistance at least the heat is not in the stator.

With the boost converter, stator heating is no longer a problem.

Flux

[ Parent ]



increasing alternator perf/eff curve | 10 comments (10 topical, 0 editorial)

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