Author Topic: Winpower turbine questions  (Read 12717 times)

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MIgardener

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Winpower turbine questions
« on: October 14, 2014, 12:07:28 PM »
  I bought this at an auction on Saturady.

 From what I gather it is a Winpower turbine made by Winco(aka Windcharger).

 My question is, How well do these work? And, Am I missing any parts? There isn't much info about these online.

 Thanks, Jake


,Jake

Flux

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2014, 04:01:56 AM »
If it is a Wincharger, it's a model I have never met, but to be honest not many Winchargers other than the 200W one made it over here.

Flux

MIgardener

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2014, 07:55:37 PM »
The only info I have been able to find online are a few pictures on the page.

http://www.windcharger.org/Wind_Charger/Wind_Power_Light_Co..html
,Jake

keithturtle

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2014, 12:12:46 AM »
The only info I have been able to find online are a few pictures on the page.

http://www.windcharger.org/Wind_Charger/Wind_Power_Light_Co..html

Take what you got and start building from there.  Research downwind turbines to get a feel for the issues they face.

From the blog "the breeze" http://www.windcharger.org/Wind_Charger/The_Breeze/Entries/2013/2/18_My_stand_alone_hybrid_power_plant.html

2011 entry, no followup; maybe it didn't work

Turtle
« Last Edit: October 17, 2014, 12:18:54 AM by keithturtle »
soli deo gloria

Flux

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2014, 04:15:32 AM »
Interesting, looks as though you have got everything except the blades and flyball weights.

Good luck with it.

Flux

MIgardener

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2014, 06:58:38 PM »
Thanks for the replies.

The governor is what I am most concerned about.
I think I might have to make the weights.
,Jake

midwoud1

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2014, 12:48:30 AM »
Hi Migardener.
Most Winchargers have a fix blade with an airbrake , no pitch system.
Can you make a picture of the hub without the spinner ?
On Google I found one with passive pitch and flyweights, but that looks like a homemade modification.


Flux

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2014, 03:40:11 AM »
midwould1

It seems as though this company is Winpower and it is a down wind machine. I fell into the same trap of thinking it was Wincharger ( later Winco)

The picture you show is a very early Wincharger, mostly they used the air brake as you mentioned.

From the pictures I got the impression that the fly weights are blade mounted much like the Australian Dunlite, the Dunlite pictures may help get some proportions.

Flux

midwoud1

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2014, 09:03:16 AM »
On the passive pitch picture , there is a breakshoe and lever as a parking break.
And a pulldown line.
But the original breakdrum is missing.
So there is not much of safety in high wind and storm.
That way it looks like diy modification.

AzSun

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2014, 09:26:12 PM »
  I bought this at an auction on Saturady.

 From what I gather it is a Winpower turbine made by Winco(aka Windcharger).

 My question is, How well do these work? And, Am I missing any parts? There isn't much info about these online.

 Thanks, Jake



Nice Find !

I have a Winpower 1200 watt down wind. The propeller hub looks similar to mine. They do not use flyweights. As the wind gets stronger, it pushes on the back of the blades and overcomes a spring. This results in rotation of the blades which slows the rotor down. On mine the spring pressure is adjustable. Down winds need a brake. I have a cast iron drum inside the generator housing.
An external brake band  grabs the outside of the drum when you pull on a cable.. Not sure how they work, never put mine up. They do seem to be made well. The governor is designed so all 3 blades rotate equally. This is good as some models in those days did not synchronize the blades. This caused severe vibration during blade rotation. Post more photos, I might be able to figure out what you are missing if anything.       

MIgardener

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2014, 07:30:02 PM »
  I bought this at an auction on Saturady.

 From what I gather it is a Winpower turbine made by Winco(aka Windcharger).

 My question is, How well do these work? And, Am I missing any parts? There isn't much info about these online.

 Thanks, Jake



Nice Find !

I have a Winpower 1200 watt down wind. The propeller hub looks similar to mine. They do not use flyweights. As the wind gets stronger, it pushes on the back of the blades and overcomes a spring. This results in rotation of the blades which slows the rotor down. On mine the spring pressure is adjustable. Down winds need a brake. I have a cast iron drum inside the generator housing.
An external brake band  grabs the outside of the drum when you pull on a cable.. Not sure how they work, never put mine up. They do seem to be made well. The governor is designed so all 3 blades rotate equally. This is good as some models in those days did not synchronize the blades. This caused severe vibration during blade rotation. Post more photos, I might be able to figure out what you are missing if anything.     


Thank you for that information. Here another picture of the hub assembly.

,Jake

AzSun

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2014, 10:00:06 PM »
Except for the blades it looks to be complete. Yours is the only other example of a Winpower unit i've seen. Properly rebuilt, this should last a long time. The most important and potentially expensive are the brush, brush holder, commutator, armature, and field coil condition. A lot of these used a cotton type of insulation wrap on the windings which is certain to not be in good condition. The commutator may need turned on a lathe and re-cut. Depending on condition, you might get away with re-varnishing the coils. Not sure how much you want to spend but ideally   this should  sent to an electric motor rebuild shop (if you can find one) that has knowledge of DC motors and generators (even harder to find). Also check the slip ring assembly under a fiber cover that should have3 studs coming out of it. Also change the armature bearings which are still available from industrial bearing suppliers.  What voltage is this unit? Most of them of this type were rated at 40 volts. There should be a tag on it showing the specs.

MIgardener

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2014, 08:23:10 PM »
Except for the blades it looks to be complete. Yours is the only other example of a Winpower unit i've seen. Properly rebuilt, this should last a long time. The most important and potentially expensive are the brush, brush holder, commutator, armature, and field coil condition. A lot of these used a cotton type of insulation wrap on the windings which is certain to not be in good condition. The commutator may need turned on a lathe and re-cut. Depending on condition, you might get away with re-varnishing the coils. Not sure how much you want to spend but ideally   this should  sent to an electric motor rebuild shop (if you can find one) that has knowledge of DC motors and generators (even harder to find). Also check the slip ring assembly under a fiber cover that should have3 studs coming out of it. Also change the armature bearings which are still available from industrial bearing suppliers.  What voltage is this unit? Most of them of this type were rated at 40 volts. There should be a tag on it showing the specs.


Thank you. That will help a lot. I could not find a tag.
,Jake

vassile52

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2014, 11:20:59 AM »
Congratulations for yours wincharger.
I'm living in Calgary,Canada

I have a 15 winchargers in my colection.
I would like to send u a few pictures and info about restored Winco wincharger .
My e-mail is it

(DamonHD: not a good idea to put email addresses here: people can send you a PM instead)

Have a good day!

Vasile Pop
« Last Edit: October 30, 2014, 12:35:39 PM by DamonHD »

CBabcock

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2014, 11:30:24 PM »
Looks as though you have a Winpower and not a Wincharger.  Those two companies were rivals back in the pre-REA days.

I have a 1200 watt Winpower that was most likely made under the Miller Airlite name before Winpower bought them out.


This machine came from my uncle's farm and was part of what gave me the wind generator "bug" at a young age.  It was a survivor that was still in tact atop it's 60', 3 legged freestanding tower, minus the blades.  The blades were removed decades prior to me coming along and were stored in the rafters of an outbuilding so they were in great shape.  I rebuilt this machine in my high school years and actually flew it again on my uncle's farm for about 3 years before "growing up" and moving away.  These are really great machines and those somewhat knowledgeable in the pre-REA turbines consider the Winpower to be between the Jacobs and the Wincharger in terms of status.  These are heavy duty direct drive machines with variable pitch, but not quite as heavy in physical weight compared to the Jacobs units.  Your turbine will indeed be needing the flyweights to govern correctly.  Wind pressure along with the governor geometry will naturally cause the machine to attempt to govern but it will be overspeeding before it does so.  They are mounted on the downwind side of the blade via one of the blade mounting bolts.  Your governor is very similar to the one I have, but looks a bit more modern.




The voltage on your machine is also most likely 32 volt.  These 32 volt machines will run on a 24 volt system at reduced wattage or on a 48 volt system at a slightly higher wattage without any modifications.  I ran my Winpower on a 24 volt system when I had it flying.

My uncle was kind enough to give me this machine prior to me "growing up" and moving away from the area after graduating high school.  I took the entire thing down piece by piece (including the 60' tower) without anything but a rope, pulley, couple wrenches and a lot of guts.  It then sat in storage for over a decade before my wife and I purchased our acreage.  A few years ago, my uncle passed away from cancer and I decided to pull the machine out and set it up on display in my shop, next to some of my other unique machines on display, in his memory.  If I had a second unit, I would fly it in a heartbeat.  They are great turbines and can take a beating.

Take a look at windcharger.org (not .com) as they have a lot of history on these old machines that may be somewhat helpful.

Corey

kitestrings

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2014, 03:01:16 PM »
Corey,

Very nice pictures, and machine.  Thanks for sharing this.  A couple/three questions:

Are the blades interconnected on this hub, such that they all move together?
Is there a spring, or springs that resist the weights and return it to the normal position?
Is that copper foil on the leading edge?  I seem to recall they used this on some models.

Regards, ~ks

CBabcock

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #16 on: December 17, 2014, 08:24:49 PM »
Hi ks

Yes, the blades are synchronized to move together and there is a return spring.  I tried to crop the picture of the "interesting" side of the governor and make a few notes (hopefully they explain a bit):



The synchronizer plate has a brass or bronze bushing and it slides on the hub / rotor shaft "tube"during governing.  The sync plate (as well as the blades) is kept in it's normal running position via a compression spring.  Each blade mounting bracket is tied to the sync plate via an eyebolt.

And yes, that is copper flashing on the leading edges and it's original.  Copper was pretty commonly used for leading edge protection on nearly all of the pre REA machines.  I'm guessing they chose copper as it's fairly soft and could be formed to the blade fairly easily.  I have had success using standard aluminum roof flashing for leading edge protection on wood blades though it is somewhat tough to form to the blade.  A standard staple gun is used to attach it before sealing the blade.

My apologies for the messy shop in the background of the previous pics, I'm somewhat embarrassed- too many projects going on at once!  :)

Corey

kitestrings

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2014, 02:01:08 PM »
Oh, that's very interesting, and much clearer to see.  If I'm understanding it right, both the centr. weights and, probably to a lesser extent, the thrust on the rotor are collectively actuating the pitch mechanism?  It looks pretty beefy, as typical of this era.

~kitestrings

kitestrings

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2014, 09:58:54 AM »
Scratch that - I see it now.  When I first looked at it I thought the collar/synch plate was on the upwind side.  ~ks

DanB

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #19 on: December 24, 2014, 10:53:35 AM »
Corey....  awesome!!!  Neat pics and thank you for sharing that stuff.
If I ever figure out what's in the box then maybe I can think outside of it.

MIgardener

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2015, 10:34:41 AM »
It has been a while since I last posted, but in the last few weeks I have started working on the generator again. I made some governor weights, got the generator working, and set it on a lattice tower. I have the blades too, but I'm not going to mount them until I have the electronics ready to go.



The problem I have is finding a suitable charge controller.  This unit was originally meant to produce 2500W on 32 volts. I am only going to be hooking it up to 24V, so I assume it will give me around 1800W max. That's going to be be around 80 amps, and the only charge controllers I can find that large are the ones on ebay with external solenoids, which I haven't read anything good about.

Can anyone recommend a commercial dump controller that can handle upwards of 80 amps?
,Jake

Mary B

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Re: Winpower turbine questions
« Reply #21 on: November 15, 2015, 06:47:58 PM »
Any of the large MPPT charge controllers should work. https://www.solarblvd.com/product_info.php?cPath=6_46_92&products_id=608

vassile52

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Re: Winpower fly-ball questions
« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2017, 11:52:05 PM »
I have a wincharger WINCO

WIND POWER LIGHT CO
 MD35  SERIAL NR 1224
2500W/32V
NEWTON ​

are missing 3 Fly-balls

Have u the dimensions,please?
I want to try to rebuild them.
Tnx!