Fieldlines.com: The Otherpower discussion board

I did fix the email issue with response to our host.

this particular easy flow poly resin does solidify well enough into a rigid structure when we take into account that most of the space is copper wires.

these slabs are pressed down on hard to obtain a minimal layer which in the grander tests should be central. I just thought like this;

heyy now I have got 2 slabs to play with. One powder filled and one without.

Like a toldler I just went at it..  I mean why not try it?

And then indeed even though there are not many iron particles in that slab when we are talking in terms of %.
Well the 230 mT field in the middle sure likes to cause all kinds of bending trouble though.

so your 1) remark is what is at play here.

2) nah, this is an easy flow poly resin that is ready to fight within 2 minutes.
3) it might be the wrong type in the grander scheme of things. but for these early test runs it is perfect as it does not stick very well to my PLA print templates and hardens soo fast I can't even squeeze a bathroom break in between.

and I forgot to mention that this is all without the magnets rotating. this is all during install time.

https://syntecshop.com/en/easyflo-60-polyurethane-resin-shore-d-65-fast-curedlow-viscosity

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https://syntecshop.com/en/easyflo-60-polyurethane-resin-shore-d-65-fast-curedlow-viscosity

I do respect the poking. And please keep at it.
I call it a form of peer review.


But never let it be said that I was unable to explain myself ok?

And this message is in particular not to Bruce!

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DD

I really need to get one thing out of the way once and for all.

I do not do hypocritical stuff or use my words in a cynical way.

Sure I contradict my self at times but boy am I easy to land back where I departed from.

Now all that is important here to me is; How can we find the means to actually quantify what a PMA can do.

I have confidence there will be plenty of electrical harvesting with your 4:1 gear ratio.

Ive been following your other blog updates.  I think 0 is go.

I would like to get notifications again of when I get feed backback on my content. Just like it has been for quite a while before.

Am I unaware of some kind of setting change that I really should be of?

Emails aren't working either, most likely.

So I think I have figured out a way to really compare apples to apples when it comes to coils in the context of the current dual rotor disk and each having their 96 magnets at a 3.75 degree interval.
And whether adding iron powder does any good in terms permeability of the field between the magnets of the rotor disks and thus will lead to an enhanced voltage generation ability of the coil.

This is my hypothesis. It has been for quite a while.

Now please jump in here and present the possible errors of my plan if you can spot one as consensus is all I care about.

So the idea is to have 2 identical 3 legged serpentine coils of 36 winds. Identical other than one is filled with basic resin and the other is filled with iron powder.

Yet both of them will be squeezed to their absolute minimum. I am guessing something of like 3 to 4mm will remain.

Now we know for sure that all the wires are concentrated on a fairly single plane.

Now we can start adding both sides of both coils with their respective resin composition (without any more wires of course) equally to reach their intended thickness.

The result will be a super thin few mm of wires in the center of the full 15mm coil.

And now, and only if I can make sure that both coils are equally positioned enough between the disks.
Only NOW we can take tests seriously.

Now mind you even the last part is no small feat. But I will get there.

Now before I break my head on actually doing this. Is there anyone that can see an error in the idea? I mean what is the point going through all this trouble if no one will take the data seriously and no one will take my test setup I offer to reproduce said results.

 
 XXX

Quote from: Adriaan Kragten on March 25, 2024, 02:12:48 PM

The calculations of the output have been reviewed because I took a too high peak power of a solar panel size 1 * 1.65 m. The peak power is reduced from 400 W up to 300 W.

Dear Adriaan,

So in general; if one has far too much power generated by the solar panels oriented in a east-west back to back setup in summer times. with as goal generating as much as possible during winter times.
even after you have refined your study a bit based on the new peak values.

Would you still conclude that an optimal south facing orientation of the panels, even though now needing more spacing between rows, will benefit the power generation during winter times?

If that is the case then I need to find some new and inventive ways to reposition more than 22 panels as my roof is already maxed out (I now have 44 panels in a east-west back to back configuration)

One thing I have been considering is to have floating arrays of panels. But especially during winter time the sun is rather low so I will need to have them float outside of my property to have full sun. But I guess no one minds as then we have little to no boating activity during those times anyway. But then that damned freezing that could happen. Now I have to think of a raft type that can deal with that.

{1}reason I ask is because I am trying to transition away from grid connected as even though netmetering has been extended for some time by our government again. electrical utility providers are actively trying to circumvent the loss of revenue by employing really nasty tricks like for people with smart meters. Some if not most of them are now being taken from behind by now netmetering will be done on a monthly basis rather than annually.

I am ecstatic I have always resisted the installation of a smart meter. And please believe me they tried! hard!!{/1}

If you want to put solar panels on an existing house you have little choise about the slope and the azimuth. But for as new house or a new solar park, I think it is best if you optimise the positioning for the month December. If the solar panels are grid connected, the fee which you recieve for one kWh is much higher in december than in June. Maximising the output in December means orientation to the south and a large slope of about 60°. My calculations show that then the loss of energy in summer because of the large slope is less than the gain in winter.

Recently a new solar park was made in my town with east west orientation and a slope of 15°. I have calculted that the output in December is only about 10% of the output in June. If all solar panels would be orientated south at a slope of 60°, the output in December is about 1/3 of the output in June and so the grid imbalance is much lower. Another disadvantage of a small slope is the sensibility of damage by hail. Today I read a story that thouthends of solar panels were damaged is Texas by golf ball large pieces of hail. This was not only caused by the small slope but also because of the too small thickness of the panels ralated to the other dimensions.

yes give me a minute, im working on this today.
if the site go's down it will be for a short time I have to make a payment to the host. This time it wont be down for last time which was 2 weeks. I will check on the host tomorrow morning I have to make switch with a bank account. Transfer money to the account for this.

also I am going to incorporate a 4 times rotational speed increase.

I really would like to share why but I also would like to test the waters if there are still actually people interested in the why?

Hi

I have been bombarded with phone calls and letters telling me their engineers (electrical supply company) will be in my area installing smart meters.

My matra is "I don't want one and I will change supplier if I have to to avoid having one."  If pushed I elaborate that everyone I know who has had one their bills have increased and I already have a power meter monitoring my usage.

Now it transpires that 4 million smart meters in the UK could be faulty and overcharging people and only working in dumb mode. Each meter has a personality module in it, (SIM card type thing.) and your supplier can alter your tariff at will turn you off individually or control the maximum load you can use.. When they're working properly.

There haven't been any updates on the news about what they intend to do about it yet.


Brian

Regardless, without adjustments for slope the choice is pretty much permanently made at installation.  Moving panels without reroofing is adding holes to the boat.

Nah, I designed and build my home. So in this case restructuring the panels has nothing to do with the structure of roof the (that is in fact not a roof in terms of structure but just another floor) they are situated on. Other than of course the dimensions they allow for panels to be placed on.

But in general terms you might well be correct. And I did ask for an in general response.

Besides the original devices being rolled out via a discrete Chinese partnership, it sure seems odd the incessant push for these smart meters as they literally made zero impact on the grid.  Your solar panels facing east-west are probably only superior under dynamic loads like net metering, where you would be softening price gouges at peak draws.  But if you are overproducing during the day with a storage system, to cover your night usage, it would seem south facing would be a wise choice.  Regardless, without adjustments for slope the choice is pretty much permanently made at installation.  Moving panels without reroofing is adding holes to the boat.

The calculations of the output have been reviewed because I took a too high peak power of a solar panel size 1 * 1.65 m. The peak power is reduced from 400 W up to 300 W.

 No one can upload photos at this time, I'm still working on this. wait for an update.

JW

31 coil legs?

yes. in a stacked (or twisted) serpentine coil configuration coils share legs.
but I still can't post images so here I go again
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/building-the-sickest-%C2%AE-vawt-ever-brilliant-minds-unite-please.31934/post-1044317

it is basically one big 100 winds loop but because it is stacked the central legs will have double the amount of wires. The field in the first and last coil is just as strong as the fields in the central coils even though having only 75% of the wires.

{1}unless I am making a huge blinder again I think this stacked serpentine is far superior to the standard closed loop coils. Just think about it. we get around 200% electromagnetic field (ignoring the wire savings) as opposed to standard closed loop coils. And then the overall reduction in wire length. I mean only properly conducted gravity torque tests can be of help now if we want hard proof.

I for one have made my commitment based on my data. How ever poorly taken. It is almost as if I show sings of faith almost!
{/1}

We don't have actual mentions... *Cough*... Yet. I do hope he sees this

I can already tell that running 96 magnets at 3.7 Hz at a 3.75 degree spacing per disk. And both disks spaced at 17mm from each other will never get me to where I need to get using 0.71mm diam wires.

You see I can only get 31 coil legs in that space to have 3 phases non overlapped. yes yes yes I abandoned overlapping phases because it just leaves no space for cores and although unconfirmed I now again think it will hinder the field forming abilities of coils.

So either we increase the rotation speed of the PMA or we decrease the wire thickness.

choices choices.

Now here comes the conundrum.

How can a gravity torque test ever be useful if it depends on the field the electromagnets (coils) produce. And that means they need to be rotated over at service speed. Not at all a gravity torque test can ever provide.

Someone like @joestru please get back in here and make some sense out of this all

New Modern version concept PLANTE.

The PLANTE method forms the lead surface, microscopic level, into a lead dioxide on each charge /discharge.

Subsequent charge /discharge builds up the lead dioxide. 30 to 40 charge/discharges builds sufficient dioxide for the battery to become sufficiently useful for full time use.

However, doing 0.5mm rolled groves into bare 98% pure lead sheet increases the active area of the created lead dioxide by over 100% surface area improvement.

I have, over the decades experimented building 2v lead acid cells. So gained a fair bit of active hands on experience.

Just having a deep grooved lead sheet plates is not helping us achieve a low cost PLANTE battery, so hence me making a judgment of lead sheet thickness for internal strength and support, plus sufficient depth of rolled grooves to form the lead dioxide and offer a larger surface area of the active cell and importantly these groves will hold the active lead dioxide in place.

Again, its getting the variables all to line up to create a cost effective battery that is simple to make by anybody

Eventually our new PLANTE battery will get better and better amp hours and the lead plates slowly all turn to lead dioxide active mush.
In Theory, and others reckon, at my thickness of plates then a 20 year life is expected. Make the lead plated to thick then the dioxide is slower to form.
Again, its the charge rate that is important as the lead dioxide is formed.

Modern IFLA have thick lead matrix plates into which the manufacturers paste the ready formed lead dioxide.
My new modern version of the PLANTE battery won't give the same amp hour output as a IFLA at first.
But because of me doubling the acting surface area of our lead sheet, then amp hour output will be very good compared to a simple standard PLANTE cell.

Modern IFLA thick lead matrix plates for holding the lead dioxide are normally cast formed, so that is just not possible to make simple lead molds for a DIY battery making

Also manufactures hide where and what is actually in the lead dioxide pastes. As i have said before "its chemists delight", and not easy for a DIY build.
 
Our modern version of the old PLANTE battery dioxide forming and using, should be a big leap forward.

Sounds pretty interesting.  Are you aiming for trickle charging or do these have a fair rate they can form the oxides?

March 2024.

Case design now confirmed.

Insulators and plate seperators now confirmed.

Battery terminals and plate connections now confirmed.
.....

Please find this simple reply regards what’s going on in a 2v cell at the active lead DIOXIDE level for the IFLA and PLante cells.

This will form, after re-editing etc, part of my ‘How to Make a modern Plante 2v 450ah lead acid battery’ book.
I always try to write and explain and show with picks what’s practically going on. I have concerns that some groups are guessing and starting to spout rubbish about the humble 2v lead acid cell, so hopefully my below comments will straighten a few folks out.

........... Each 2v volt cell has a charge and discharge rate and this depends on several factors.

1. The structure of the matrix grid plates and the ratio between the supporting lead that is a basic PLANTE forming, and the composition of the LEAD DIOXIDE that is already made and pasted into the lead matrix that gives a higher Amp Hour holding capacity from the word go.

2. It is very important to recharge and reform the lead oxide at a suitable rate.   Eg, like electroplating, to quick and the plating does not form and adhere well.   The same with lead dioxide, make it efficient and give good ah output, then its short lived. Make the dioxide paste longer lasting but less preforming ah output, and more stable, then welcome to the IFLA as the lead plate matrix is very, very thick and holds the Oxide paste firmly.
BUT excessive constant charge on a individual 2v cell and the lead oxide that is pasted into the grid matrix will be disrupted, especially where it rests in the lead matrix grid, and then the precious lead oxide paste will shed and drop out.

3. With the IFLA batteries the lead matrix grid plates hold the lead dioxide tight, but the lead dioxide is fragile. The lead holding grid it self will also form the correct dioxide over many (over 40) charge recharges, and slowly integrate with the dioxide pastes. BUT CONSTANTLY GETTING THE CHARGE RATE WRONG AND THE PŔECIOUS LEAD DIOXIDE PASTE WILL START SHEDDING as the bond will be broken.

IN CONCLUSION. Some of you are aware of my R&D experiments and builds on a new modern form of the old pure lead PLANTE lead acid 2v 450ah battery. Forming the pure lead sheet surface into a active lead dioxide mush, but making this surface dioxide mush stable and yet giving good AH output rates, is mind boggling, as the variables that require experimentation and calculation are vast.
Oh yea, and these 13 plate 2v PLANTE cells of mine are all designed around a DIY context and constructed with simple tools.

So bear with me guys as i examine and publish a useful definitive practical guide to the humble 2v lead acid cell.

Ok one step closer will inform as we get to the next one.

please accept my humble apologies.

I understand and agree with your assessment.

respect