battery pack utilization

[xmarkox]

Hello
I was wondering if maybe someone could help me figure out the best way to make use of a battery that I have aquired that I would like to use. It is a 201 v Nickel metal hydride pack from a prius,  It has 28-7.2 v "modules.  the pack is rated for what they call 1310 Wh or a measured average capacity pf 6.09 AH.  would this be feasable to use in a grid tied wind turbine system? I am thinking of breaking it up and trying to get it to a useable voltage that is compatible with the various controls that are out there.  Should I do this or should I tru to wind my own stator and make it compatible with the batteries.

I also considered making a system that would "tie the cells for charging then switch them out for use.

thanks for any input.  I have not even heard of this being done. so I want to be sure before I start building a turbine.

[xmarkox]

Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.

Have a good Day

[Bruce S]

How much experience do you have with grid tie? electrical systems? batteries? Electrical code in your area?
Please tell us more about your abilities and what you aim to achieve so we can properly advise you further.
Next and most importantly this will not save you any money, nor will it probably pay back the investment in any short period of time.
Having said that, here's some information you could probably use.
Those packs are built very well, breaking apart the 168 individual packs without breaking some is going to be "FUN" to say the least.
Each cell is rated at 1.2vdc nominally along with max Amp hour rating being 6.09Ah.
The correct voltage these are rated at is 201.6Vdc , this is important as this breaks up to an even 168 cells.
You will then need to assemble packs of 10 for the 12Vdc voltage, you could break up the 28 modules up into pairs of 7.2Vdc pairs for the 14.4Vdc that would be much better with due respect to inverters and their power needs. This will get you about 85Ah at 14.4Vdc for 12Vdc systems.

Having said all that, these being NiMh types lend themselves to being used for off gird OR a good stepping stone to the next level.


The other ting you could do, is find a person with a Prius or hybrid Camry and see if they want to hack their car's system to extend their range on batteries

Bruce S
 

[xmarkox]

I would love to go off grid but that is not really practical. For that I would need probably a 2000 w mill and storage and controls. I am qualified electrically to divide my usage in my house to feed non critical circuits as my system grows.  I figure that with a hybrid wind and solar system I could work at supplying my own partial needs using the batteries as a way to store capacity when the alternate wind and solar are not able to keep up. I plan on making my own mill and would like to use that energy and when the batteries are full is when grid tie comes into the picture.  These batteries are modular and it seems they are robust and are are easy to reconfigure at the 7.2  v module level.  from what Ive read they charge almost as fast as they discharge and they are able to deliver the watts I would need to feed a lets say around 600w demand with the mill and whatever solar  panels I may need.  I'm not just rying to save money.  Its kinda a hobby with a practical application.  I'm an ex Navy electronic technician so trons are not new to me and I know if the math dont work then the whole thing fallls apart.  I'm not looking for someone to waste their time.  I just wanted to know if these new high tech super heavy duty batteries would be an asset to build on.  I don't want to put a forklift battery in my garage. I know thats what most large systems use but I think the math would work with these batteries.  Its the longevity, charge parameters and usable power that I'm interested in.  I ve seen controllers from outback that look like they would do the trick but I could also get a plc and program it to do just about anything I want.

Thanks for your reply and have a good day.

[SparWeb]

You're lucky, finding a set of batteries for free like that takes a lot of cost out of what is , really, a hobby project.

It happened to me, too, in 2007, when I literally found a pack of batteries far greater than my needs.  Since that discovery, it's been a lot easier for me to go farther with many new RE projects, without worrying about how to store the energy.  If you really are interested in RE, start simple I say, to learn the basics.  Then take on something more ambitious (eg a Piggott 8 foot or a Otherpower 10-foot turbine or a set of solar panels, and the whole project will be easier to complete, because you don't have to fret about the cost of batteries!

[dnix71]

Ditto what SparWeb said. I would love to have a pack that size to use. Is the pack a service takeout because it no longer met specs, or does it still hold 1300 watt-hours?

A lot of off-grid isn't about 'more-bigger-better,' it's about finding less energy intensive ways of doing things. Common refrigeration alone would require a larger pack than that because you need to allow for the times when the sun doesn't shine AND the wind doesn't blow and there are times like that.

How big is this Prius pack? Does it have safeties to reduce the chance you would touch high voltage? NiMH's put out a pretty good dead short current. There are special non-conductive tools for working on electric cars and hybrids. If you could get a starter set of those it might be worth the investment.

Are these the first generation Prius cells that are said to have leakage problems, or the newer high cap gen2 cells?

[independent]

Hi, I don't know if you've seen the posts on endless sphere (ebike enthusiasts forums) but there are a number of those users who take these apart and test them for usefulness and them put them in their ebikes. There are threads (one main one) there with photos. If I remember correctly, if a pack has been swapped out, for a bad pack it is often a matter of bad cell or two. Another way people seem to get them is when one has been in an accident and they are just wrecking the car for useful bits (good packs gotten this way). Cells swelling seems to be a problem when testing for capacity as I think they bulge because the are under a bit of pressure when in the pack proper (could be wrong about that). Supposedly these are very good cells and people get good use out of them even if they are reduced capacity.

[xmarkox]

Thanks all for the advice.  As far as I know i's a totally good pack and it is well constructed.  So well built that I hate to take the cells apart individually.  The cells are orientated so the + and - are next to each other with a small copper bar to tie them together.  of course all the hi voltage stuff is bright orange and well covered. it has screw terminals and it also has a set of wires to each cell's post to measure each cell voltage.  I wish I could afford 28 individual digital panel meters.  Anyway I'm going to make two 48v packs out of it and try to engineer a circuit to automatically swap out the two cells when they become depleted or charged.  I plan on taking a couple of my home circuits at a time and grid tie them to experiment.  I am also going to dive in to the solar panel technology and "build or assemble an array to supplement my wind turbine.  I am an industrial mechanic/electrician so I have access to alot of surplus equipment and machine tools to fab up just about anything.  Right now i'm thinking of a PLC contol that would monitor the system and make adjustments to the conditions at hand.

I'll try to post some pic's for you to see but this thing is really a nice piece and I can't wait to see how much usable capacity is available.  Ive done some math and it looks like this could be a better than average storage solution.

Thanks so much for your input and advice.  I really appreciate it.

I'll be sending some help shortly so this board can grow.

Best regards

Marko Hazbro

[offgrid1]

Prius batteries (2007 and 2012) are made up of sets of 6 cells (a module) for a total of 28 modules (non separable at the single cell level). These are FIFO (fast in and fast out) nickel metal hydride cells of good quality. When one considers that the 28 module battery can be fully charged and discharged on about 30 minutes there is serious computer servicing to keep them from over charging/undercharging and overheating, all of which limits their life. The units are exceptionally well packaged to make the likelihood of impact damage and leakage of electrolyte minimal. I recently broke the two batteries into two 12v units and two 24v batteries (by rewiring). Although they had sat in a junk yard all 56 modules checked out in low to mid 7 volt range. Pound for pound the junkyard price compared favorably with the nickel iron cells I got from China (very expensive) but considering how poor lead acids are a 10 year life span vs 3 year makes them worth trying. NiFe cells are SISO (slow in and slow out) so for starters I'm piggy backing the Nickel hydrides on the nickel irons to gain experience.   

[gww]

I don't know about the batteries but you might do better going solar rather then wind in using them. Solar is easier to get your arms around and has easier controls when charging.  Don't get me wrong, I may build another turbine, but solar is cheaper and easier. 
Just a thought.
gww

[offgrid1]

The Prius batteries would be excellent for wind power storage as FIFO (fast in and fast out).