Author Topic: 12VDC LED Lamps  (Read 10779 times)

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kitestrings

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12VDC LED Lamps
« on: November 08, 2014, 05:29:00 PM »
Mod's, fell free to move this (with apologies) if it belongs in "reviews".

I rarely endorse a product, but thought I'd pass this one along.  No affiliation.

We recently bought two of these LED lamps to replace CFLs.  They are a standard screw in A19, 12VDC, 12w, 2,700K.  A bit pricey, but we have been very, very pleased with the quality.  They are compact and fit most normal fixtures.  The light output, color and distribution is excellent.  And, they are half the wattage of comparable CFLs; a third that of quartz halogens.

Having tried many energy efficient products that fell short somewhere or other over the years, this was a pleasant surprise.

https://www.superbrightleds.com/moreinfo/g-series-large/e27-led-bulb,-12w,-12-volt-dc/1568/

kindly, ~kitestrings

Mary B

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2014, 11:28:40 PM »
I have swapped to 120v versions for grid use and won't go back. Need a bunch of 24 volt for the DC side of things

bart

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2014, 04:38:43 AM »
   Have been using 3 of these for about 2 years. Had one go bad under warranty and they shipped a replacement in 3 days.
 120v, 15 watt.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009EU825C/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Mary B

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2014, 02:17:40 PM »
I could moving lighting circuits to one of the inverters but then it would need to idle all the time with a very light load. Reason I want to go 24 volt and avoid that.

kc7noa

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2014, 04:05:07 PM »
So i sapose no one has come up with a list of venders .. with a graph or list of power consumption to lumins ratio ?

Iv been harassing a few sellers on ebay about the current draw at rated lumens/power ....

not a one has actually answered me ... one still is clueless about what im after ...
keeps replying with its voltage, lumen and power .... leaving out the efficiency numbers ....

i was/still looking for the best lumen to power ratio ....

DamonHD

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2014, 12:36:45 AM »
Hi,

I created a UK-based list which is a bit out of date now I expect.

You should definitely aim for 60lm/W or higher, as that is CFL efficiency. 100lm/W+ is possible now in off-the-shelf lamps.

Its harder to achieve those numbers in smaller lamps.

Rgds

Damon

dnix71

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2014, 10:39:02 AM »
To get the rated light output of some of the "super bright" leds I see advertised you would need some pretty good heat sinks. But that heat comes at the expense of efficiency and rated life.

Damon do you need a high frequency driver to maximize light output efficiency? I've bought and used some very bright commercially made led lights that had stupidly short life spans because of heat but if I cut the voltage the lights dimmed noticeably. In a flashlight you might not care if the life was short because the run time is short, but for home lighting I don't want to pay premium prices for something that won't outlast a linear fluorescent.

DamonHD

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2014, 03:43:19 PM »
Hi,

I don't think so, though to avoid having something silly like a series resistor (wasting energy), a switch-mode constant-current driver could be used instead, and it probably would be fairly high frequency.

Rgds

Damon

Bruce S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2014, 08:01:58 AM »
The newest thing I've begun seeing is dimmable versus non-dimmable LEDs being sold.
The newer ones sure are hot!!
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kitestrings

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2014, 11:29:09 AM »
Quote
I could moving lighting circuits to one of the inverters but then it would need to idle all the time with a very light load. Reason I want to go 24 volt and avoid that

I'm admittedly old-school, and it stems from having lived with inverters that were much less than what the better ones are today, but I really dislike having all of the lighting (and water pumping) reliant on an inverter.  If you ever have to send one "away" for repairs - and that's a hassle all its own - I'd don't want to be without, light, heat and refrigeration if I have a choice.  Inverters have come a long way though.

kc7 raises a good point about efficacy specs/standards, or lack of.  As with the fist CFLs there's some junk to avoid.  The one above seems to be in the 75 l/w.

What I tend to be more sensitive to with CFLs & LEDs is not the output generally, but the color and especially the CRI.  We've used a lot of those MR16 (Quartz Halogen) specular reflector lamps in areas where color is important.  You can power a small trac section with 12VDC (usually with one wire terminal change, and eliminating the transformer(s) of course) and dim them with chopper dimmers.  Excellent color and control.  I've just started converting some to LEDs with pretty good results.

Quote
The newest thing I've begun seeing is dimmable versus non-dimmable LEDs being sold.

There are also emerging "smart bulbs" that allow remote full-color dimming (smart phone or fob).  I like the ones with motion sensing.  I like going down the stairs to get a drink of water without fumbling for a light.  Most kids don't know what clock-wise means today, I wonder if wall switches may soon be a thing of the past.

~ks

kitestrings

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2015, 07:13:45 AM »
We've pretty much have phased out all our CFLs and moved to LEDs over this last year.  I thought I'd share one more fixture that we've been really happy with -

This summer we finally built dormers on the kids rooms (30- years later)


I put in three of these LED reading lights, one for each of the young' ins.  They are pretty slick, 4W, dimmable, nice color and they have this touch dimming feature that is pretty slick.  They also have a small blue LED night light mode which allows you to find the thing at night and gives a soft translucent glow through the shade.


Here's a link to the specs on them:
https://store.marinebeam.com/3w-led-bulkhead-reading-light-with-touch-dimming/

~ks

Frank S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2015, 04:34:01 PM »
 A while back all my Cfls in my shop burned out at the same time from high voltage.
  I've always had a problem with Cfls because they take so long to warm to full brightness. They don't like to be turned on and off then back on again very much. and I don't think they really last all that much longer than an incandescent. Probably a shorter life than a regular bulb when turned on and offf several times a day.
 I replace these with Leds that just screw into the sockets and look like regular 60 w bulbs they are 800 lumens and draw 9 watts I'll see how well they work over time I guess.
  Thye were cheap enough at $4.00 apiece.
 This week end I went out to our house we will be moving to it has about 80 light sockets  maybe 20 of these have Cfls  in them half of these are burned out and another 15 of the incandescent bulbs are burned or missing
  even at $4.00 I'm looking at over $300.00 to replace all of them. I think for now I will only replace the ones that are missing and burned out.
  The prices are dropping as the LEDs become more popular.   
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hiker

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2015, 01:47:31 PM »
Cfls....few years back I had one that caught on fire..just briefly...walked in the room and smelled smoke looked up and that's when it flared up...made in China...close call...removed the rest of the cfls with that brand name and replaced....no probs sence..     Anyone else. .?
WILD in ALASKA

DamonHD

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2015, 02:16:03 PM »
I had just one CFL let out magic smoke as I recall, but now I'm almost entirely on LEDs.

Two nights ago I managed to knock an LED lamp out of the hall/landing socket, down the stairs, and it survived!  I don't think any other sort of lamp would have...  %-P

Rgds

Damon

kitestrings

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2015, 07:18:29 AM »
hiker, lucky you were there.

Yes, I haven't found the hype of long lamp-life to be lived up to well with CFL's.  For me the verdict is still out on LED life, but they seem to be much more durable.  Despite the relatively low wattage some of the LEDs still get pretty hot, thought the better ones seem to have good heat sinks.

Overall the LEDs have cut our lighting load by about two-thirds; and I thought we were pretty efficient before.  We had virtually no incandescent, most quartz-halogen (MR16s) and CFLs.  In most cases we've traded a 7W LED for 20W MR16 QH, 10w LEDs for our 35W Edison/A19s, and 4-5W LEDs for the 23W CFLs.  And, the output, color, CRI cold-start, etc. all seem as good or better.  Many of the LEDs are dimmable now which is also a plus.

We've been real happy with these, and for folks off-grid you can power a trac-strip or mono-point directly with 12VDC:
http://www.lightology.com/index.php?module=prod_detail&prod_id=332815&option_id=332814

~ks

OperaHouse

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2015, 07:27:16 AM »
I've noticed that many LED lamp packages now state 0-10 thousand hours of life vs some that have 22 thousand hours.  These shorter hour lamps run hot and plastic isn't much of a heat sink.

Frank S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2015, 10:41:00 AM »
 One problem I have always had with direct lighting is diffusion.. even in when I owned or worked in a factory with High bay lighting I found that no matter how high up the lights were placed it was impossible to not have the extremely intense blinding lights hit me in my eyes. most difusers when installed blocked so much usable light that either more lighting had to be installed or larger wattage bulbs were required.
 When it comes to low bay IE home office or work station lighting, the glare of lights becomes even more prevalent.  Soft white or frosted incandescent bulbs  did little to correct this Florescent tubes needed covers on the fixtures  CFLs do not do well in recessed or covered fixtures due to heat.
 Now that the price of LED lighting is becoming competitive and dim-able I am thinking about going with European standard voltage lights 240v used on 120v. I am thinking by using half the voltage rating with double the fixtures like I used to do with incandescent s to reduce heat glare and extend their life span,I can achieve the same amount or nearly the same ambient light at reduced heat and intensity without the need to diffuse the glare spot 
 
I live so far outside of the box, when I die they will stretch my carcass over the coffin

Bruce S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2015, 12:24:35 PM »
I must be living a charmed life!
I have some CFLs that are going on 10 years old. Those big FAT ugly ones ! and a Circle light one that has been in our furnace room since our daughter was still in grade school and she's 25 now  :P.

I do like the plastic covered LEDs, I find them at HD for about 2/es 800 lumen. They do get warm at the base, but not so hot I can't hold onto them.
I really like the LEDs for being able to dim, which most CFLs you just could not do to.
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madlabs

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2015, 03:55:50 PM »
I have a few CFL's still in service and some of them are at least close to 10 years old. I wonder if my more stable power as I am off grid has anything to do with it?

I love my LED shop lights. The other day I walloped one with a ladder, no problem. If that had been a fluorescent light I would have been covered in glass. And they are the same britness when they turn on. My old T34 fluorescents took a few mins to warm up and get bright.

Anyway, I love LED lights. I make replacements for my trailer lights with those strip LEDs. Mount 'em on a bit of PCB for a heatsink and screw 'em in place, slap the cover back on, done.

Jonathan - KK6RPX

Mary B

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2015, 05:08:25 PM »
It isn't the voltage that hurts LED life(as long as it is in spec) as is uncontrolled current. LED's like a constant current source for best life.

One problem I have always had with direct lighting is diffusion.. even in when I owned or worked in a factory with High bay lighting I found that no matter how high up the lights were placed it was impossible to not have the extremely intense blinding lights hit me in my eyes. most difusers when installed blocked so much usable light that either more lighting had to be installed or larger wattage bulbs were required.
 When it comes to low bay IE home office or work station lighting, the glare of lights becomes even more prevalent.  Soft white or frosted incandescent bulbs  did little to correct this Florescent tubes needed covers on the fixtures  CFLs do not do well in recessed or covered fixtures due to heat.
 Now that the price of LED lighting is becoming competitive and dim-able I am thinking about going with European standard voltage lights 240v used on 120v. I am thinking by using half the voltage rating with double the fixtures like I used to do with incandescent s to reduce heat glare and extend their life span,I can achieve the same amount or nearly the same ambient light at reduced heat and intensity without the need to diffuse the glare spot 
 

Frank S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2015, 09:03:33 PM »
  When transformed my 45 ft moving van from storage into a machine shop it had 6 60 Watt standard bulbs in it they would suck down the juice from my 1899 watt inverter in my bus  to the  point that every time I started my 1/2 HP lathe or 3/4 HP bench grinder or band saw they dimmed badly if the wife was making coffee at the same time it would sometimes kick off, we were really taxing the overload cap of the dimensions inverter.
 I unscrewed 2 and then 4 bulbs before the dimming ceased as long as the coffee maker wasn't brewing.
  I figuted I could get away with 5 23 watt CFLs So that was what I ran for a couple of years. the introduction of my 3PH lathe necessitated using a generator which after rewiring I discovered too late the duplex had previously been wired to what then became a wild leg the CFLs couldn't handle the high voltage. Re wire again so no wild  Replaced the CFLs with 10.3 watt LEDs now have 11 of them and they still don't draw as much current as  the 5  23 watt CFLs plus I have  more than twice the visible light.
 I have a box full of 12v 36 led super bright RV dome lights that I plan on placing where needed at the work stations and machines. My plan is to have as near noon day light bright as possible where and when needed while drawing less power than 2 100 watt flood lights
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dnix71

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #21 on: December 04, 2015, 11:23:52 AM »
We moved at work recently and the building manager gave me these 2 lamps as he had no use for them in the newer buildings we moved to.

Note the outer package contradicts the inside labelling on the tubes. They really are 240v tubes as best I can tell. I tried them on 120v and they cycle on and off.

If anyone wants them, send me a PM with your address and I'll mail them to you in a tube.

9391-0


Bruce S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2015, 11:48:00 AM »
dnix71;
If no one else answers, I'll take 'em. Let me know the shipping cost.
I can quickly get a 120-240 setup transformer.

Thanks
Bruce S
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dnix71

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2015, 05:53:26 PM »
I can ship them tomorrow if you PM me your address. A US address is no problem. Should be less than $12 including the postal tube.

Harold in CR

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2015, 05:02:24 PM »

 Frank S
 Your box of lights look anything like these ?

 http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-36-LED-Super-Bright-White-Dome-Roof-Car-Interior-Lamp-Light-New-Silver-/351595008647?hash=item51dcb21287:g:GPAAAOSwEeFU94m0&vxp=mtr

 I need something like this over my 2 work benches and machinery, also.

Frank S

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2015, 09:41:23 PM »
  Actually they look exactly like the ones in this link
http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-Car-Motor-Auto-42-LED-Interior-Dome-Lamp-Lighting-Bulb-Panel-Bright-White-BL-/200902211402?hash=item2ec6b4774a:g:7mQAAOSwd4tTzd4O&vxp=mtr

   I think I bought a box of 10 at a local auction because I already had 2 of them I want to mount them inside of some 6x6 J boxes then use a 3/32" tempered glass for a lenz cover and mount that on flex mounts to use  as work lights on the lathes and other machines, I might have to figure out a heat sink or ventilation but I need them protected form cutting coolant



 Frank S
 Your box of lights look anything like these ?

 http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-36-LED-Super-Bright-White-Dome-Roof-Car-Interior-Lamp-Light-New-Silver-/351595008647?hash=item51dcb21287:g:GPAAAOSwEeFU94m0&vxp=mtr

 I need something like this over my 2 work benches and machinery, also.
I live so far outside of the box, when I die they will stretch my carcass over the coffin

Harold in CR

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Re: 12VDC LED Lamps
« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2015, 07:06:51 AM »

 Thanks Frank.  Price on your link is a bit better, also.

 Harold