Author Topic: When community objects to wind turbine, try this  (Read 3772 times)

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OperaHouse

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When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« on: October 23, 2016, 09:05:17 AM »
Not exactly practical, but wind turbines will have to disguise themselves in some way to get more community acceptance. It does prevent the chance of a 20 foot blade going off to a neighbor.  And everything from France is better.

http://www.newwind.fr/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Press_Kit_Interactive.pdf

SparWeb

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2016, 11:39:35 PM »
Admittedly, it's better than concealing a real WT within a grove of trees.
I doubt it will power more than a streetlight, however.
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
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george65

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2016, 12:29:33 AM »

Another load of Crock.

One has to understand business and investment to appreciate these things. They are often never really meant in teh designers eyes, their real and sole purpose is to attract investor funding and grants.

A mate worked for a R&D company for over 10 years. They developed all sorts of technology, particularly green washed projects. They got all sorts of Gubbermint and research grants and they pretty much made all their projects work. Then they shelved them.
There was more money in the research than actually marketing them and a lot of the things they developed while perfectly functional, were impractical from a cost or ROI point of view.

One thing he told me about was a high speed inkjet printer.  It was one continuous print head that was fixed. the paper just ran under it and it was printed on the fly. The paper could be run through at breakneck speed and you could have the thing 30Ft wide if you wanted.
It worked perfectly to a point.

They could demo the thing all day but in reality, the print head would fail in an unacceptably short time in relation to it's cost because of the filaments burning out and also because there was no real way to have it self clean being fixed.
The company still made a fortune in research grants and had all sorts of media releases etc which brought in more business and research money.

I think this thing will be the same. They may well sell some of these things to company's or public entities that want to pretend they are being environmentally conscious but I doubt of the people that created it are really thinking about selling millions of them, they have made their money with the  grants or these days, even crowd funding which seems a great way to pull suckers into lame  and half baked ideas.

It's not about what a product does these days, it's about what it pretends to do and cashing in on the idea no matter how impractical it is in reality.
What annoys me with things like this is you can just look at it and know what a lie it is as well as a hypocracy as there is far more energy, resources and emissions invested in the thing than what it will ever make up for.

I'm just jealous I don't have the smarts to come up with one of these money making loads of bunk to line my own pockets.   >:(

clockmanFRA

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2016, 03:10:31 AM »
And everything from France is better.

http://www.newwind.fr/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Press_Kit_Interactive.pdf

On Balance OperaHouse, I would say, 'It is Not better in France'.

I have seen this TREE project a few years ago, I remember calculating that each tree would have to be incredibly cheap to even pay for itself.



Everything is possible, just give me time.

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electrondady1

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2016, 08:03:55 AM »
i built the same thing but with out the luxury of injection molded parts.
8)
the mold to create those segments is probably 40-50 thousand dollars.




Adriaan Kragten

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2016, 09:51:40 AM »
If I look at the photo's, I see that the turbines are modified Savonius rotors. Savonius rotors are notorious for their low maximum Cp (see my public report KD 599) and very hight blade area in relation to the swept area. So in terms of value of the output in relation to the investment costs, a Savonious rotor will always loos the battle with a well designed horizontal axis wind turbine. These kind of windmills only have a value as art object.

The English brand Proven also has placed several wind turbines on a tree like structure but then at least you have a well performing wind turbine and you may expect a reasonable output.

Bruce S

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2016, 02:02:19 PM »
Y'all are missing the point  :o
It is purtty ! And it'll do some "good".
Yea, we all know this is probably yet attempt at removing $$$$ from people who don't want to pay attention to the details that are NOT in the PDF.
Stuff WE look for like output under a specific wind speed.
BUT it does look pretty :-).
They say one is due for install in 2016, so let's see where it ends up, how well it does and how well it's accepted . Heck it's won awards already ,,,,,,, it can't be all that bad :P.

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OperaHouse

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2016, 02:50:31 PM »
Every museum will have to have one just to show they are green.  That alone is a big enough market.

george65

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Re: When community objects to wind turbine, try this
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2016, 07:45:39 PM »

Having too much time on my hands I did a bit of a search on this thing.
Yeah, we pretty much picked it I'd say.

Characteristics of a Unit

Installed Power: 4.1 kW
Height: 10m
Width: 8m
Weight: 4 Tons

4 effing tons to produce 4.1 Kw?  Other reports I found said 3.5  but my point is, how much resources and energy are tied up in producing something that weighs 4 tons?  More than this crock of ship has a hope in hell of offsetting I'd say.

It gets better though......

The company plans to start producing wind trees on a large scale in 2017. But their high price – 49,500 Euro per unit – earmarks them initially for the private market. “At the moment, we are only selling the Aeroleaf to big companies and public authorities. Around 35 French, Swiss and German district councils have already placed orders for the end of the year, reveals Hélène Bédon-Rouanet, spokewoman of NewWind. We also have a lot of requests in Belgium. But we are waiting to obtain all the certifications before offering the Aeroleaf, at a more affordable price, to private individuals.”

So it's going to be well over 50K euro installed for one of these things and as predicted, Big business and gubbermint entities are the customers.
Almost 2M euros in advance orders before they start.  That seems like a reasonable sort of business kickoff doesn't it? Wait till they start actually marketing the things and get even more press and social media coverage!

Now lets see, 50K euro divided by 4 Kw a day (Yeah, I know, not a chance) times say 1 euro a day power cost offset divided by 365 days a year = Not the faintest hope in hell this thing will ever come near being anything bar a Joke or having a chance at ROI.
No doubt it will let officials, CEO's and directors  continue the facade that they are environmentally concerned and doing something for the planet to offset their other convenient abuse thereof.

One wonders what the  " more affordable price to private individuals" is going to be? It would have to be a 10th of the "Big company" version to be near worthwhile on an economic basis and that's if you think the thing isn't an eyesore.
Personally I rather have conventional solar panels than one of these things.  They will last infinitely longer for a start.



Time for me to start marketing my water flow generator. installed in your plumbing, it generates power every time you turn on the tap. You could make enough power to keep your wristwatch powered for a whole year in just one day!

I could let these go for the bargain based price of $5000 each as the mechanical flow meters I'd buy from china and re label would only cost me a few bucks each. I'll do a commercial version that can be installed in the mains of places like shopping centers, high rise and factorys that can generate up to 2 Kwh a day and make them available for only $40K each.

Ok, so my business plan will be:

Buy a box of the flowmeters for $100
Print stickers on my computer
Take pics and design a flashy PDF and print some glossy handouts.
Draw up some wizz bang graphics and pull some figures out my nether regions on how much co2 the things will save and how many ( dolls) houses they can power or (RC) cars they can recharge.
Create mailing list of the usual green suckers, Big biz and gubbermint entities and of course all the save the planet green based web sites.
Take orders, send out product, bank money, buy new luxury home, car and plan business trips to popular tourist destinations to promote product and save the world.

Took a while but I finally got smart and made some serious moolah.   :0)