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Propellers, what is the max number of blades?


By South Dakota Farmer, Section Homebrewed Electricity
Posted on Wed Dec 24th, 2003 at 06:10:10 PM MST
I am trying to find out if a smaller diameter multiblade (6 blade) prop will work on an alternator that would be spec'ed with a three blade 12 footer?

Everything I see uses three blades. I will be building an alternator that will need a twelve foot three bladed prop. Can I use, say (just for discussion) a six bladed 6 foot prop? Am I going to end up dealing with twice the tip speed? thus a lot more noise? Or am I going to raise the starting wind speed to a point that it isn't worth it? or, or, or? Obviously I don't know squat about the physics of props and wind, but I have a lot of it! The other night on the ridge we had sustained wind speeds of 86 mph... and that is not unusual. Ripped a $400 door off of one of the tractors! and those doors are designed for this type of thing. I don't expect to have this kind of wind all the time, but am wondering if anyone has a handle on or can point me in the right direction on propeller design or the pitfalls of experimentation. I am planning on building a few Axial flux alternators. Thanks for the help
Propellers, what is the max number of blades? | 4 comments (4 topical, 0 editorial)

Re: Propellers, what is the max number of blades? (none / 0) (#1)
by Kevin L on Wed Dec 24th, 2003 at 09:44:58 PM MST
(User Info)

Three blades are used because as you increase the number of blades you increase the leading edge and blade tip resistance. At half the diameter you wil reduce the tip speed by half.   The power output will be much lower at 6 ft because the increase in power exponentally increases with diameter.  A 6 X 6 ft blade will produce much less power then a three bladed 12 footer.   Use caution if you are dealing with 86 mph winds.  I don't have enough high wind speed experiance to say weather it should or shouldn't be done, but you certainly would want the system a safe distance from the house, as lossing a blade in 86 mph winds could send that blade very far.  Use caution expessially if the house is downwind!   You will also want a very good furling system.  Good Luck



Re: Propellers, what is the max number of blades? (none / 0) (#2)
by desertratjack on Wed Dec 24th, 2003 at 10:22:14 PM MST
(User Info)

You have located the place where art and science mix. I believe there is a point where blade number controls the rpm but I don't know where this is (1000 blades?). 100000? Currently I run 6 blade and 3 blade mills. Thin high aspect blades with optimal helical pitch turn very fast in 6' diameter mills (probably near 2000 rpm in 35 mph breeze (the permanent magnet alternators characteristics matter too). Great fun to experiment with! Mostly, I deal with 20 to 50 mph here in the canyon. Two of my mills tilt back beginning at 30 mph or so and are able to take 60 mph (they look and sound like monsters at these higher wind speeds. The other two use 6 blades and do not tilt back and I am experimenting with them above 40 mph. One of these mills was on a 1 1/2 " pipe threaded into a 2" union with a 5' lever arm to the guy point. It broke through the threads at about 45 mph. I never found two of the blades! The present lever arm is 2 feet with 1 1/2" pipe and I think it will hold to 50 mph and more. 80 mph is a big difference from 50 so take it slow and make it strong :-) I've resigned myself to furling/feathering/tip back or swing out of the wind mechanisms for these higher speeds but I don't like wasting those winds. If I can be of help

jacknl7s@hotmail.com



Re: Propellers, what is the max number of blades? (none / 0) (#3)
by DanB (danb@*no spam*otherpower.com) on Thu Dec 25th, 2003 at 07:12:28 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.otherpower.com/

Hii -
"Everything I see uses three blades."

There is a reason for that.  Typically fewer blades run faster and more efficiently.  Two blades runs (as a general rule) a bit faster - and even more efficiently in many cases than three but the drawback is vibration.  (they shake when they yaw).  Sometimes the shaking can be overcome with weights - or sometimes it may seem un noticable, but any time you have two heavy spots a wheel and turn it (like a windmill yaws) its going to shake.

More blades generally have a bit mroe surface area and start more easily. 3 blades is a good compromise, probably the best compromise.

"I will be building an alternator that will need a twelve foot three bladed prop. Can I use, say (just for discussion) a six bladed 6 foot prop? "

No.  Your 3 blade 12 footer would run at a reasonable speed and probably have lots of power.  Your 6 blade 6' would probably have too many blades -  a bit mroe torque - but it would be inefficient - even for a 6' prop.  Power is related to the square of the diameter (the area).  Your 12' blade covers a bit over 100 square feet.  Your 6' prop covers about 30.  The 12' prop (done well) should make 3 X the power of a good 6' prop.  A 6 bladed 6' prop will have lots of xtra drag, so itd be even less powerful I suspect.

the 6 bladed 6' prop might have a bit of xtra torque to get your big alternator turning, but it will not have the  power to spin it up to the sorts of speeds itll need to go to make power as it would if it had a 6' blade.

Hope that makes sense... (havent had any coffee yet this morning, its dangerous for me to do, or write anything before coffee!)



Re: Propellers, what is the max number of blades? (none / 0) (#4)
by South Dakota Farmer (ken_at_thebockgroup.com) on Fri Jan 9th, 2004 at 09:07:37 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.thebockgroup.com

Thanks fella's, I will start with Hugh's designs and work out from there. That area statement makes a lot of sense. Some thing I didn't think about, area... hmmm. Gonna' get a power planer and go to town. Thanks again. Will let you know what I find...
One thing we have in South Dakota is wind...


Propellers, what is the max number of blades? | 4 comments (4 topical, 0 editorial)
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