the Otherpower.com Discussion Board || Tower wrecking

Front Page - [Homebrewed Electricity-- (wind) (solar) (hydro) (steam) (controls) (storage) (mechanical)] - Classifieds - Site News
Everything - Newbies - [Remote Living-- (housing) (heat) (light) (water)] - Rants & Opinion - Diaries - Our Products

Tower wrecking
By Old F, Section Homebrewed Electricity Posted on Sun Dec 28th, 2003 at 04:29:05 PM MST
Were can find a hand operated hydraulic pump?

I just got the top section of my tower done. And it is time to do some destructive testing.
I have a three inch bore double acting cylinder and a hydraulic pressure gage.
All I need now is a hand operated hydraulic pump.
I plan on bolting up the two sections on the ground and run a cable from the top to the base.
And the hydraulic cylinder will set at the center of the tower like an arrow strung in a bow.
This will be for side loading.
Then from a safe distant and behind a barrier. Just in case.
I will pump up the pressure writing gage reading an observations as I go.
With this information I can decide were to go from here.
Old F

Tower wrecking | 11 comments (11 topical, 0 editorial)

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#1)
by kell on Sun Dec 28th, 2003 at 05:56:08 PM MST
(User Info)

I wonder why you intend to do this test. Do you want to see how much wind load your tower will take? Wind loading exerts external forces. The proposed test exerts internal forces.
The test you described could give you some idea how much sheer weight the tower would support, since the cable will exert a downward force on the tower at its uppermost point, as would a massive mill of some sort. But what mill is so heavy and tower so weak as to buckle in such a way? A heavy mill poses a risk by making your tower more vulnerable to tipping!
Weakness will likely manifest itself where the sections of tower join and at the base. A tipping tower exerts the most moment (torque) at its base. Like a big lever.

The closest thing to copy wind loading and tipping would entail erecting the tower, attaching a cable to the tower somewhere between the middle and the top and pulling in a horizontal direction, insofar as possible.

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#2)
by rhud on Sun Dec 28th, 2003 at 06:04:56 PM MST
(User Info)

Hello,
New to this site, but i'll throw this in. Surplus Center has hand pumps with small oil tanks attached. i think they were used to lift the cabs of transfer trucks. seems they were around $150. you might try one of the "power pak" sets used for auto body work (northern or harbor freight) Are you near a community college? they might have one or a hydraulics lab with pump and gauges. might be a good project for the class. forgive my spelling.

[ Parent ]

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#3)
by RobC on Sun Dec 28th, 2003 at 06:10:16 PM MST
(User Info)

Determined aren't you. http://www.surpluscenter.com/
RobC

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#4)
by monte350c on Sun Dec 28th, 2003 at 08:48:23 PM MST
(User Info)

Hi OldF,

That's going to be a very neat tower! I like the design...

Here's a possibly easier and maybe safer suggestion - if you're just looking to find the buckling strength, you could support the tower in a horizontal orientation (like on strong sawhorses or something similar) at each end.

Then put a couple of empty barrels on top, in the center of the tower. Add measured amounts of water to the barrels until she buckles. Water is 1 kilogram per liter (or 8.34 pounds per gallon). So if you had a 50 gallon drum full it would put 417 pounds plus the weight of the barrel on it. Two or three barrels would probably do it. Or if you had an old oil furnace tank...

At least when it fails, the most danger will be from having a barrel land on you, or getting wet!

Good luck and keep us posted!

Ted.

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#5)
by Old F on Mon Dec 29th, 2003 at 09:50:37 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.oldf.homestead.com

Kell

One of My design goals is a tower that is ridged enough to support its own weight and 200
pounds of mill during raising and lowering using guys just as safeties.
And not like pipe towers that are 100% guy wire dependent and are at there weakest during rasing and lowering.

I have no doubts that this design will meet that goal I want to find out what its upper limits
are. Now I wont be putting any thing near that on it but it would be nice to know. Then I can start on wind loading.

My thinking is the stronger and more ridged a structure you start with for a guyed tower.
The closer you can set the guys to the tower base even to the point were it take up just a little
more room than a free standing tower. The guys will handle the bulk of the wind thrust load.
And a ridged tower makes thing so much easier for raising and lowering.

Rob

And I am stubborn to : )

It my be hard to believe. In the same time or less than it takes to build a wind generator
You can have a nice tower to put it on. This design is a lot easier to build than a generator.

Rhud
I will check them out thanks

Monte

I was thinking about this but could not come with a handy to way measure the amount of
water used I had the hydraulics laying around just needed a hand pump.

Old F

On the edge of the learning curve and loving It : )

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#6)
by windstuffnow (elenz(at)windstuffnow(dot)com) on Mon Dec 29th, 2003 at 11:20:43 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.windstuffnow.com/main

Old F
It sure seem a shame to wreck such a nice looking tower!!! Seems like you can calculate the compression loads on 2 of those tubes and come up with a suitable number for wind loading. If you know the strength of the steel your using it shouldn't be to hard to calculate this out.

Looks like your having fun! Nice Tower.

Ed

Have Fun! Windstuff Ed
[ Parent ]

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#7)
by Old F on Mon Dec 29th, 2003 at 01:09:05 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.oldf.homestead.com

Ed
The tubes are emt conduit 3/4 inch.
The stuffs cheap all I would be out is a little
time. Whats neat is the weight fo a 10 foot section of tower comes in at only 41 pounds

Old F

[ Parent ]

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#8)
by Old F on Mon Dec 29th, 2003 at 01:29:34 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.oldf.homestead.com

Ed
One more thing If you like check out the diary I started called More tower Fun
I have some pics of the press an angle gage I used to flatten the conduit.
There easier to build than they look.
Old F

[ Parent ]

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#9)
by Demetri (corvettemach1@yahoo.com) on Mon Dec 29th, 2003 at 02:59:15 PM MST
(User Info)

If you've got easy access to a wrecking yard, go look at late '80's automatic transmission Hondas. The speedometer cable fitting on the transmission contains a hydraulic pump; you can see the two hoses coming out of it. I believe it is two bolts to remove the fitting. It can be chucked into a drill as a drive source, and I've had it to 150 psi without trouble. Not very many gpm, so it'd take some time, but something to consider. Hope this helps.

Demetri
Uncommon sense required.

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#10)
by Norm (peppysue@suite224.net) on Mon Dec 29th, 2003 at 05:54:20 PM MST
(User Info)

Hoist up about 400 pounds of cement blocks ....hook a pulley at the top ...launch a kite about the size of a hang glider when the wind kicks up to about 30 or 40mph. that ought to give you a safety factor of about 200 if it doesn't tip over and especially if it's a real gusty wind.Forces on the side of the tower should be negligable. Just kinda far out thinking maybe? Norm
( :>) Norm

Re: Tower wrecking (none / 0) (#11)
by Old F on Tue Dec 30th, 2003 at 10:32:52 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.oldf.homestead.com

Oops never mind

I think its old age setting.
I all ready have all the hydraulic power I need.
I will just put the pressure gage on my Cad digger back hoe and run the engine at very low idle.
Du (sound of palm of hand hitting forehead ).

If you haven't see a Cad digger check out the pics on my web site.

Thanks to all

Old F

Tower wrecking | 11 comments (11 topical, 0 editorial)

Menu

� create account
� How to use the board
� FAQs
� search the board
� Google search the board
� Old Otherpower Board

Login

Make a new account

Username:

Password:

Total Views

��145 Scoop users have viewed this posting.

Related Links

� Also by Old F

You must be a registered user to post here. It's easy and free, and the link is on the upper right side of your page.
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. Postings are owned by the poster, but may be deleted or moved at the ADMIN's sole discretion. The Rest � 2003 Forcefield.
You can Email the board ADMIN here. PLEASE include the username you signed up with!