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Can Battery damage occur from to much voltage...


By eformx, Section Wind
Posted on Wed Oct 13th, 2004 at 05:47:47 PM MST
Can Battery damage occur from to much voltage.  Ametek 30 put out 42 volts in extreme...

Can Battery damage occur from to much voltage.  Ametek 30 put out 42 volts in extreme wind the other day.  I have a 60 Amp Hour AGM Battery, just enough power to run a few dc lights over the indoor ice rink.  The battery manual suggested that the voltage input not exceed 15 volts.

In your experience, can damage occur if 40 or more volts is pushed into the battery?  And if so, is there a way to cap the dc voltage to 15 volts?

Thanks in advance for your advice/wisdom!

Rob

Ps.  In addition to the Ametek 30, I have an Ametek 90 vdc motor that I was thinking of running along side the other.  If I combine the voltage from the two turbines down the line to this battery, is this okay?

Can Battery damage occur from to much voltage... | 7 comments (7 topical, 0 editorial)

Re: Not until the batteries are full (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by ADMIN (info74 at otherpower.com) on Wed Oct 13th, 2004 at 08:10:05 PM MST
(User Info)

The batteries are an integral part of such a charging system, and they hold the voltage to correct levels just by their nature until they are full and bubbling. Bubble too long, and you risk battery damage from low electrolyte level. When the batteries are full, you must divert incoming wind power to a heating element or such to keep load on the wind turbine generator, or else it will overspeed for lack of load.
You could hook up a wind turbine using a 120 volt Ametek DC generator to a 12v battery bank...and you would get a little bit of power at low RPMs in low windspeeds...but as the wind speed increased, your power output would not--the resistance is too high in the stator of the 120v DC motor; it's not made for this kind of application. Better to find an Ametek that's rated at 1.5 to 2 times the voltage of your battery bank. Not a perfect match because of the high-resistance nature of DC Pm motors, but pretty good. You can expect quite a bit less than rated voltage, at rated rpm, of a DC motor when used as a generator. You can get lots of power out of them, but the RPMs must be significatly increased over the rating listed, and high rpms are not good for wind turbines.
DANF



Battery damage occur from to much voltage. (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by jacquesm (j@ww.com- I run a whitelist, add 'stjoes' to msg) on Wed Oct 13th, 2004 at 08:50:22 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.greenbits.com/

what happens when you charge your battery is that you are using electrical energy to effect a chemical change. If the 'internal resistance' of your generator is so low that it can raise the battery above let's say 16 volts or so then you are probably using way too heavy a generator for your charging.


But, the internal resistance of your battery is probably much lower than your generator so it will win the 'tug of war' as soon as you connect it. Which means that with the battery connected the voltage will drop a lot, and current will start flowing into the battery.


If this current is too high, or if it continues at too high a level once the battery is full you will damage your terminals/plates or 'overcharge' your battery to the point where the water in the electrolyte boils off.


To avoid that from happening you can simply shut down your windmill when the battery is charged, or you can automate the whole process by using a dumpload.


JimU keeps a nice schematic of a charge controller here


What it does is divert the power coming from your windmill to a 'dumpload' as soon as your batteries are full.


Dumploads are usually resistive heaters, they can sink a whole pile of power in a fairly compact package.


hope this helps. good luck !
 
www.greenbits.com



Re (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by ghurd on Fri Oct 15th, 2004 at 09:40:26 PM MST
(User Info)

Is this the open circuit voltage? You more need to pay attention to the battery voltage. Most AGMs call for about 13.7v float, 14.4 cyclic.

Anyway... Sounds like you could use more battery, like maybe 2, 6v 220ah, before the second charger goes up.

For a controller, how about a Trace C60, or Morningstar TriStar used for controlling a dump load? Called Diversion Regulation.



Re: Can Battery damage occur (1.00 / 1) (#1)
by zmoz on Wed Oct 13th, 2004 at 07:44:55 PM MST
(User Info)

Yes. It will overcharge quite quickly. You need a charge controller.



Re: Can Battery damage occur (1.00 / 1) (#2)
by eformx on Wed Oct 13th, 2004 at 08:05:23 PM MST
(User Info)

Do you know if there is a charge controller that will handle the voltage, is there a manufacturer that you can suggest or is there a kit/plans so I could piece together a charge controller?

I suppose if it had the ability to transfer the excess to a 12 volt heater that  would also be a benefit.

Hmmm...

Rob

[ Parent ]



Re: Can Battery damage occur (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by erne on Thu Oct 14th, 2004 at 07:10:49 AM MST
(User Info)

agm batt??? isn't that a sealed batt. if so how do you add water?? don't they daMAGE EASIER FROM OVERCHARGE OR EQUALIZING??  erne

[ Parent ]


Re: Can Battery damage occur (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by eformx on Fri Oct 15th, 2004 at 09:07:07 PM MST
(User Info)

Text from a site...AGM, Absorbed Glass Mat, AGM's will generally go for 5 to 8 years. A newer type of sealed battery uses "Absorbed Glass Mats", or AGM between the plates. This is a very fine fiber Boron-Silicate glass mat. These type of batteries have all the advantages of gelled, but can take much more abuse. These are also called "starved electrolyte", as the mat is about 95% saturated rather than fully soaked. That also means that they will not leak acid even if broken.

AGM batteries have several advantages over both gelled and flooded, at about the same cost as gelled:
Since all the electrolyte (acid) is contained in the glass mats, they cannot spill, even if broken. This also means that since they are non-hazardous, the shipping costs are lower. In addition, since there is no liquid to freeze and expand, they are practically immune from freezing damage.

Nearly all AGM batteries are "recombinant" - what that means is that the Oxygen and Hydrogen recombine INSIDE the battery. These use gas phase transfer of oxygen to the negative plates to recombine them back into water while charging and prevent the loss of water through electrolysis. The recombining is typically 99+% efficient, so almost no water is lost.

The charging voltages are about the same as for any standard battery - no need for any special adjustments or problems with incompatible chargers or charge controls. And, since the internal resistance is extremely low, there is almost no heating of the battery even under heavy charge and discharge currents. These batteries have no charge or discharge current limits for all practical purposes - you would exceed the wire amperage capacity long before you reach the danger point. Note that we do not recommend "super charging" them, but it can be done if you really need to.

AGM's have a very low self-discharge - from 1% to 3% per month is usual. This means that they can sit in storage for much longer periods without charging than standard batteries. The batteries can be almost fully recharged (95% or better) even after 30 days of being totally discharged.

AGM's do not have any liquid to spill, and even under severe overcharge conditions hydrogen emission is far below the 4% max specified for aircraft and enclosed spaces. The plates in AGM's are tightly packed and rigidly mounted, and will withstand shock and vibration better than any standard battery.

Even with all the advantages listed above, there is still a place for the standard flooded deep cycle battery. AGM's will cost 2 to 3 times as much as flooded batteries of the same capacity. In many installations, where the batteries are set in an area where you don't have to worry about fumes or leakage, a standard or industrial deep cycle is a better economic choice. AGM batteries main advantages are no maintenance, completely sealed against fumes, Hydrogen, or leakage, non-spilling even if they are broken, and can survive most freezes. Not everyone needs these features.

Hope this helps.

Rob

[ Parent ]



Can Battery damage occur from to much voltage... | 7 comments (7 topical, 0 editorial)
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