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Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project underway


By Chagrin, Section Wind
Posted on Wed Dec 29th, 2004 at 09:48:40 PM MST
Compressed air as an energy storage device

http://www.idea.iastate.edu/isep/

The plan is to store compressed air in an underground aquifier to enable its later release to generate power. Will be fantastic to see if it works!

Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project underway | 9 comments (9 topical, 0 editorial)

Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by skravlinge on Wed Dec 29th, 2004 at 03:20:09 PM MST
(User Info)

Its done in Sweden, use an old mine.
-- Always find the typos after posting!


Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by richhagen (richhagen (a t) Juno.com) on Thu Dec 30th, 2004 at 01:53:56 PM MST
(User Info)

Also currently done in Alabama using an old mine.  A similar site is under construction in Ohio as well.  Rich Hagen
'A Joule saved is a Joule made'
[ Parent ]


Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by Ungrounded Lightning Rod on Wed Dec 29th, 2004 at 06:26:04 PM MST
(User Info)

The plan is to store compressed air in an underground aquifier to enable its later release to generate power. Will be fantastic to see if it works!

Two downsides (assuming the site doesn't leak the air out):

 - You can turn a large area into a jack, causing earthquakes (even where there haven't been any in geologic time).  Easier to do injecting liquid.  But injecting air could do it, too.

 - You'll have some significant losses due to heat pumping.  (Compressing the air heats it, expanding it cools it.  Much of your energy goes to pumping the heat, just like a refrigerator.  If you dump the heat on compression and replace it with ambient heat on expansion you lose that energy.  Insulating the pipes on the way to the storage, and using the ground's insulating properties, may mitigate that, by storing the heat with the compressed air and recovering most of it when the air is used.)

Neither issue looks insurmountable.  The quake risk just requires good site selection.  Inefficiency is not prohibitive when fuel is "free" and you just need to build stuff to tap it.



Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by rotornuts on Wed Dec 29th, 2004 at 08:43:19 PM MST
(User Info)

Site selection is acknowledged as a prerequisite, heating and cooling of the compressed air has I'm sure also been considered and the notion you may cause an earthquake is ridiculous. A quick search revealed two sites in germany currently employing this technology as well as a gas utility in Ontario operating an underground aquifer gas storage facility in the Ottawa area. Not everyone is stupid. If you don't understand something do not assume everyone else is in the same boat. don't be afraid to look around and see what the "state" of the art is.

[ Parent ]


not everyone is stupid (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by Norm (peppysue@suite224.net) on Wed Dec 29th, 2004 at 09:25:46 PM MST
(User Info)

Gee you're so right!
            Norm.
( :>) Norm
[ Parent ]


Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by RatOmeter on Thu Dec 30th, 2004 at 06:33:17 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.rato.us

It's fairly common to store natural gas underground and under pressure.  There are a staggering, mind-boggling (I do so hate having my mind boggled) number of miles of caverns left over from salt mining operations 500 feet or so under the ground near Hutchinson, Kansas.  OneOk stores a few billion (yeah, thats a 'b') cubic feet of natural gas in several of those caverns.

Of course, just because it's possible and being done doesn't mean it's without flaw.  In late 2000, one of the storage caves sprung a leak and OneOK, in their finite wisdom, kept pumping natural gas into it to keep the pressure up.  The leaking gas found its way out through several abandoned wells that had been used in salt extraction, one of which was downtown.  Much hilarity and flames ensued... scratch the hilarity part. Two people died when gas leaking from a well exploded in a mobile home park.  The folks in Hutch were quite nervous for many days, not knowing when or where another geyser of flammable gas might breech the surface.

Pictures:
http://www.kgs.ukans.edu/Hydro/Hutch/Background/

Article:
http://www.ljworld.com/section/hutchinsonfires/story/40281

[ Parent ]



Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#8)
by richhagen (richhagen (a t) Juno.com) on Thu Dec 30th, 2004 at 01:58:47 PM MST
(User Info)

Most of the compression is done at night when there is surplus power.  If the air temperature outside is cooler than the mine temperature, then some of the system losses can be offset by an energy gain of compressing cool air, heating it in the mine, thereby increasing the pressure still further, and then running it through a turbine on the way out.  Rich Hagen
'A Joule saved is a Joule made'
[ Parent ]


Re: Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by bob g on Wed Dec 29th, 2004 at 09:53:59 PM MST
(User Info)

considering that natural gas wells often are of very high pressure, in excess of several thousand psi, i doubt that compressed air will cause much of an upset.

also i doubt there will be much pressure stored, but a butt load of volume!

look forward to seeing how their plan works

bob g



Just a thought. (3.00 / 0) (#9)
by Inventor on Tue Jan 4th, 2005 at 03:07:15 PM MST
(User Info)

I would suggest that the underground storage of natural gas, LPG etc. in the Mount Bellvieu, Texas site should be of interest to y'all.  I'm sure that many papers and reports are available through American Petroleum Institute sources.

Rather than compressing air you might want to consider pumping water below the air cavity thereby increasing the air pressure to a more efficient pressure by being able to pump the water to higer pressures than might be possible (or economical) than air.
Paul



Crazy Iowans -- massive power storage project underway | 9 comments (9 topical, 0 editorial)
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