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Blade swept area needed for a home


By Gary D, Section Wind
Posted on Wed May 17, 2006 at 03:31:57 PM MST
This is from the Scoraig home page

Hugh has a link to an article from Paul Gipe (of wind-works.org fame), showing needed blade diameters to power a home...
 Editors, if this is any kind of copyrite infringement please delete immedietely!
 On Hugh's homepage under links the article can be clicked.... Informative and could help show newcomers that swept area IS VERY important! Link below. Doing it this way may make it accectable?  Gary D.
http://www.scoraigwind.com
Blade swept area needed for a home | 7 comments (7 topical)

Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by TomW on Wed May 17, 2006 at 09:59:43 AM MST

At one time Hugh told me I could use anything on his site. I hope that means this direct link is OK:

Direct LINK

TomW

The Truth is the Truth, even if no one believes it; and a lie is a lie even if everyone believes it




Re: Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by Slingshot on Wed May 17, 2006 at 10:13:10 AM MST

What do you think Paul was saying when he wrote "large wind turbines produce 9/5 of the power of small wind turbines, for the same swept area"?

If the swept area is the same, what makes one turbine "small" and the other "large"?

[ Parent ]



Re: Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by richhagen on Wed May 17, 2006 at 04:07:41 PM MST

I was wondering about that comment too.  I would assume he means power per unit of swept area to compare efficiencies.  The disparity seems large.

I have noted that small commercial machines all seem to be optimized for high winds, which occur infrequently.  The larger the commercial machine, the more it seems to be designed to produce in 'normal' winds.  As an economy of scale, it may be more likely to implement pitch control, electronics, and more thorough design to increase efficiency as well.  If you are connected to the grid, the small machine optimization may make some sense in that the power output is so much larger during those rare times of high wind.  For charging batteries however, you'll be left in the dark once your batteries go dead the rest of the time.  For battery charging I think DanB has it right to size it and optimize it for low (normal) winds, and basically build it to survive the high ones.  It may be a little easier to obtain higher efficiency in a larger machine, but I can not think of a rule of physics that requires it to be that way.  I haven't read Paul's arguments on the subject so I am uncertain what his reasonings are.  He is generally very well regarded, so I am sure there is a logical basis.  Rich Hagen
'A Joule saved is a Joule made'
[ Parent ]



Re: Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by ghurd on Wed May 17, 2006 at 05:07:56 PM MST

Maybe 5/9?  55.556%?  Meaning 99% of the limit?
Sounds a little over the top.
G-
Ghurd.info
[ Parent ]


Re: Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by richhagen on Thu May 18, 2006 at 11:57:32 AM MST

I've never heard of a machine close to that efficient, including large commercial ones.  I think he was comparing efficiency of large and small scale, but that is speculation.  It looks like I will have some good reading to do. :-)  Rich
'A Joule saved is a Joule made'
[ Parent ]


Re: Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by Gary D on Fri May 19, 2006 at 08:45:26 AM MST

Rich, I think (stupid wild a__ guess) is that with the Cp of small wind turbines at 35% and the megawatt class nearing the Bentz limit of over 52-55%. Added to that, the wind rated output at 100% in higher windspeeds than normal smaller gennies due to variable pitch control... But this is a guess. Also the building to scale costs do drop per (rated)kilowatt... Just thought it might get people to thinking (especially the newby's).
 Dan F. has a 3 part article on things that anyone interested in windgeneration SHOULD read right here on the OTHERPOWER site just 3 clicks away also. One click on the top of the page to go to OTHERPOWER, the second click on the wind box at the bottom of that page, and the 3rd click on Dan F's article(s). Well worth the read... overreader and underachiever here...Gary D.

[ Parent ]


Re: Direct Link: (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by Gary D on Wed May 17, 2006 at 12:11:58 PM MST

Thanks for your input on this Tom, and the link. The equivalent on the 5 meters per second is about 11.1837mph at hub height(average).
 There is a wealth of other info on that site, just thought that a short article might sum up what we are needing. That is to enjoy our lifestyles as we are used to (durned energy hogs). Want to go into a rant, but will refrain...  ;-)  Gary D.  

[ Parent ]


Blade swept area needed for a home | 7 comments (7 topical)
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