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helix blues
By spinner, Section Mechanical Posted on Tue Nov 27, 2007 at 02:21:44 PM MST
the best laid plans of mice and men.....

...often go amiss (or somethin' like that, anyhoo
yesterday i hada remove the blowout panels from the helix due to noises they were making, so it was back up on the ladder for a while (cold fingers, again!)
sure eneough, the noise seemed to go away.
hour or so later i heard a new noise (helix was spinnin' without any load on it)
every time the rpm went up and down (gusty winds) noises again ...just different ones.
looked like the bottom heavy duty floating bearings' grease was stiffing up as it got colder...sprayed in a bunch of lube to thin the grease a bit....once again the unit quieted down...
woke up this am to hear NOISE again, winds were a lot stronger 25-35mph and it was somewhere near zero wind chill; locked the helix down in the dark
judging from the sounds the noise is internal, ie from inside the helix structure
thinkin now that it might be spring before i can safetly fix/replace whatever is wrong
will know more when it is lighter outside
spinner
Resectioned. Good luck with it.

helix blues | 14 comments (14 topical)

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by TomW on Tue Nov 27, 2007 at 02:03:30 PM MST

spinner;

You make a large assumption that anyone here knows what your talking about. I kind of do but I read everything here, All of it. Most don't.

Cheers.

TomW

The Truth is the Truth, even if no one believes it; and a lie is a lie even if everyone believes it

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by wooferhound on Tue Nov 27, 2007 at 04:26:31 PM MST

Here is the story about his Dual helix
http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2005/12/1/02230/9169

W o o f -={(

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#11)
by spinner on Thu Nov 29, 2007 at 11:41:32 AM MST

wolf:
thanks for posting the link
spinner

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#10)
by spinner on Thu Nov 29, 2007 at 11:40:31 AM MST

Tom
you are correct, my error (again) bad habit of making crummy posts, i have.
spinner

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by fcfcfc on Tue Nov 27, 2007 at 02:42:00 PM MST

Just a suggestion... when greasing things outdoors especially in cold climates, use only synthetic grease. Stay away from all petroleum based lubes. That will solve your thickening issues...

.....Bill

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by luckeydog on Tue Nov 27, 2007 at 05:35:13 PM MST

hey Bill

Thanks for that tidbit of info. I did not know about that.

I will for now on use synthetic grease.

Thanks

Luckeydog
.
wind gens are much funner to watch than solar panels. Broomfield,Colorado
[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#14)
by fcfcfc on Wed Dec 05, 2007 at 05:01:17 PM MST

Hi: BTW, do you have a picture of your helix anywhere on the web..??.. I will be building a VAWT Helix in the future and I was just curious what yours looked like...

Thanks...

.....Bill

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by dynaman on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 09:37:56 AM MST

it is wise not to mix synthetic and petroeum base lubes

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by veewee77 on Tue Nov 27, 2007 at 06:40:24 PM MST

Wind chill does not affect anything but mammals and other live animate and inanimate objects. 32 degrees with a 0 degree wind chill is still 32 degrees to everything besides us. It is how it "feels" due to evaporative cooling from your body. The helix has no sweat glands, and therefore "feels" no wind chill. . . just 32 degrees.

That doesn't mean, though that it won't reach 32 degrees faster, simply because of faster airflow means dissipation of more heat.

All in all. . .
Wind chill is not a factor to windmills or other man-made or natural objects except live ones.

Thought you'd like to know. . .

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by electrondady1 on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 07:22:04 PM MST

spinner,
does the noise modulate in response to changes in rpm or temperature ?
is it coming from the mill or the alt?

wind chill effects anything with an operating temperature.

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#8)
by fcfcfc on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 07:34:19 PM MST

Hi: Strictly speaking, wind chill refers to organic "things" with a moisture content, IE evaporative cooling. But, wind increases convective losses dramatically. I think it comes down to the strict definitions of wind chill VS convective losses in a wind, no wind environment.

.....Bill

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#9)
by TomW on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 07:39:58 PM MST

Bill;

I agree. Otherwise why put a fan on an automobile radiator?

I am no expert in thermodynamics but I know moving air pulls heat away from a surface. Can't say it makes it colder than ambient temps, tho, because I never checked.

I think in this case it is mostly semantics.

Cheers.

TomW

The Truth is the Truth, even if no one believes it; and a lie is a lie even if everyone believes it

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#12)
by spinner on Thu Nov 29, 2007 at 11:56:34 AM MST

hiya, E.D.

yer right about the windchill, <grin> specially atop a tall ladder!

seems to vary with speed..when it is really spinnin there is little or no noise..
when it is goin slow or rpm is goin up and down with wind gusts, the noise gets kinda ugly sometimes and seems to origionate whenever one side of the helix passes a given spot in each revoultion.
somehow (?) there is now some runout when you are watchin the thing spin; a case of accumulated hard knocks over its lifetime, perhaps.
that, combined with the bottom bearing actin'like it is ridgid (grease) not floating don't help...i plan on heating it carefully to remove the crappy grease and refil it with synthetic
1st time this problem has occured
the noise seems to originate from inside the helix..it is the kinda noise one hears when wood and metal don't take to being spun around, ie binding.

before i get otta here i should explain that "blowout panels" refer to something i designed: they are lite weight panels that fit betweem the inner edge of the helix and its center mast.....i made 'em removeable cause i had no way to predict how much torque and/or speed the thing would put out in different winds..when they are in place torque and speed (especially speed) are improved a bit
nice of everyone to post their thoughts, much appreciated
spinner

[ Parent ]

Re: helix blues (3.00 / 0) (#13)
by electrondady1 on Sat Dec 01, 2007 at 07:19:02 AM MST

tracking down weird noises is always a puzzle
you have a lot of wood involved and that could have changed shape over time.
maybe the top and bottom pins are misaligned a bit.
if the sound disappears at speed, then the spinning is forcing something back into alignment,
cold grease will make the bearings stiffer and harder to rotate but i cant see how it could make a noise unless by resisting movement it is forcing something out of alignment.

[ Parent ]

helix blues | 14 comments (14 topical)

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