http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/12/24/1316228
http://www.tcdailyplanet.net/?q=article/2007/12/21/energy-bill-brings-change-passes-renewable-electr icity-standard.html http://money.cnn.com/2005/07/29/pf/energy_bill_consumers/index.htm http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2007/12/23/18468576.php W o o f -={(
It's just sad that people have to have the laws changed to make them do the right thing. In the vast majority of places CF bulbs have been economically the right choice for at least the last 3 years.
http://www.ilsr.org/columns/2006/021306.html
interesting stuff . Carpe Ventum (seize the wind)
Merry Holidays, Chris
Contact: IRC
[ Parent ]
"The Easy-Bake Oven, currently a product of Hasbro, is a working toy oven that for many years used an ordinary light bulb as a heat source, but now has a true heating element." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easy-Bake_Oven)
Catweazle
There is a place for everything. I currently run about 90% CFL in my house, but there are other applications where the regular old incandescent bulbs are the superior option. Night stand lights in the children's rooms are one. They tend to knock over lamps on a semi-regular basis and I don't need exposure to mercury added to the broken glass. And then there are places where the cost of a CFL isn't justified, for example, the hallway light that isn't on more than an hour a year.
Legislating common sense has never worked, never will.____ For the sake of Peace the Sword... www.letsgoviking.com
It's a real problem to do color matching in a place where various types of fluorescent tubes are used..
Incandescents still have their use. For heating chickens, or in the bathroom (where the light is turned on for only a few seconds each time).
Incandescent vs. CFL; different horses for different courses. Too bad one horse will be banned from the USA (and Australia and Europe). But if the average person can't choose the right product for an application, maybe the choice needs to be made for him.
Remember, these are the same people that need warning labels that say 'unwrap candy bar before eating' and 'do not use microwave to dry wet pets'.
.
Ron Adventure is just bad planning." -- Roald Amundsen [ Parent ]
Volvo Farmer
May you always have success in your quest to irritate those who you despise. -Ben Goode [ Parent ]
I've also noticed that the newer CFLs do pretty good in the cold, but the older ones have problems. I replaced the cannister CFLs I had in my kitchen (look like little spotlights) with regular ones, and they work great. The ones made for the application took about 5 minutes to warm up, the newer coily ones I replaced them with light instantly and provide enough light that I unscrewed 3 of the 6 bulbs. With the spotlights I needed all 6 to not get as much light as I have now.
And, I've got a 100 watt equivalent CFL in my droplight in the garage. When I was using incandescents I'd break 4-5 a day when working in the garage, and would constantly burn myself in tight quarters. With the CFL, no burn problems, plenty of light except on the coldest days (when I don't work outside anyway) AND over the last 4 years I've only had to replace the bulb once, and that's with the droplight being dropped several times from waist to shoulder height. With the incandescent, it would blow out if you just looked at it funny, forget about dropping it. [ Parent ]
Leaving the scene (and ventilating) the scene of the crime for a while probably minimises the risk from that...
Considering that we played with liquid Mercury at school I cannot get that worked up about it, though ready-vapourised stuff is probably less clever.
Rgds
Damon[ Parent ]
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7172662.stm
The LEDs are already knocking on the door. Pretty powerful and soon available at the right warmth and brightness.
i also think the same
LED is the future.
i am not sure about just one thing - how much energy factory needs for making amount of leds equal to one "old fashioned" bulb?
similar debate was about toyota Prius - how really that car is "greener" then ordinary one - if we include energy needed for making it from basic elements.[ Parent ]
they also did not figure in repairs as the prius is reported (by toyota) be in the very low cattagory for problems/repairs, I do not know about the hummer.
As for lifespan it is reported some of the early prius's are getting up on the high miles of over 200000 miles with the origanal batteries
just do a search for "prius hummer" and you will find alotg reif [ Parent ]
They come in different light outputs and as we found out, clear CFLs, and white light CFLS have their places and by getting them mixed up, you run into problems. Get them right and they are indeed a gift to mankind?
How? By saving the northeast from mercury. I know I know, CFL's have a TRACE of mercury in them, but did you know children and pregnant women are not supposed to eat the fresh water fish here because of mercury. That mercury comes from the coal fired plants in the midwest producing power. If everyone in the midwest switched to CFL's and just one or two coal plants could be shut down, we would save tons of mercury being driven into the air,and ultimately landing on Maine.
Currently Maine has several windfarms that are going up. Ordinarily I would think this was good, but the owners of these wind plants are from the midwest power producers. Windplants allow them to get green credits that keep them from installing smog devices on their coal fired powerplants. Yes we get renewable kilowatts, but there is no reduction in mercury. Its a catch 22. We need incentives to install large scale windplants, and increase the kw output of the grid, yet the mercury poising still comes with the prevailing wind. The only true way to stop this is via conservation. CFL's will allow this country to maintain its lifestyle and yet reduce consumption.
Also check for incentives to buy them. Currently Maine has a program called "Efficiency Maine and there is a website about the program. I think Mainers can get 50% of the cost of CFL bulbs for residents and even more for companies. The company I work for is expanding its lightning system and only has to pay for installation of these new lights. The material costs are paid by the Maine PUC. Check into it if you live in Maine. If not,see what your state has for a program. You might be surprised.
if you read his work he is biass and offers no reference of where the info came from.
did they do the exchange in spring and then there was more energy usage in summer? --air con....
let him show proof?g reif
I will not eat animal fat, but your mandated healthier hydrogenated trans fatty acids.
I will not eat your hydrogenated trans fatty acids, and will now revert back to animal fat, because you are now banning Transfat.
I will only take government-approved drugs like Thalidomide, so my future babies can be born with mutated arms.
I will not take Thalidomide because it has been recalled.
I will take Thalidomide again because it has been approved again.
I will only eat the foods you recommend, following your food pyramid.
I will only eat the foods you recommend, using your NEW food pyramid.
I will only eat the COLORS of foods you recommend, now that the pyramid is gone.
I will exercise because my Body Mass Index is higher than you mandate.
I will refrain from exercise, as the increase in carbon dioxide output may cause the earth to get warmer.
I will not smoke because second-hand smoke endangers children.
I WILL smoke, so that the taxes I pay on cigarettes may fund health care for needy children.
I will not kill mosquitoes with DDT so that I might kill millions of people with Malaria to ensure that birds eggs have firm, solid shells.
I will mandate that developing nations only rely on Wind and Solar so that the African Nations full of poor brown folk - rich with oil and coal - may never come and eat at the same table in our global economy and threaten my way of life.
I will require the corporations in my own country to follow rigorous and expensive environmental policies and increase unemployment, but will ignore China's polution so that I won't have to pay too much for those children to manufacture gadgets for me.
I will screw those evil, polluting corporations by ensuring companies like General Electric billions of dollars in profit and incentives on newly mandated "eco" generaion of electricity. After all, what's greener than the ole Dollar Bill?
I will follow the preaching of private-jet-flying over-consuming mansion-dwelling prophets who can predict the weather 50 years from now, because THIS TIME they're right.
I will fly in my celebrity friends to "Think Global, Act Local" conferences where we each take our own jet, and spend millions of dollars to import luxurious GLOBAL food from NON-local sources.
I will support whatever tax hikes are necessary to rid us of the plague of incandescent bulbs.
I will support FURTHER tax hikes to attempt to clean the mercury from our water.
I clearly make too much money, so I will gladly give it to you. You are so wise and efficient, O Frugal Steward! Lest I forget, please take it from me with force!
THANK YOU, O Powerful Government!
By the way... EZ Bake ovens won't have light bulbs, but will have actual heating elements? So resistive heating is okay, but God Forbid it should also emit photons.[ Parent ]
Just for accuracy's sake:
I think you meant florescent because the "common" light bulb is incandescent and they do work on dimmers.
Cheers.
TomW
http://www.taunton.com/finehomebuilding/how-to/qa/compact-fluorescents-bulbs-dimmers.aspx?nterms=657 58
Phillips now makes a CFL with only 25% of the mercury content of the cheapest and most common CFL's (I've heard that "mercury-free" bulbs are coming soon, due to demand.
http://www.greenerbuildings.com/news_detail.cfm?NewsID=34914
Some bulbs now come with a shatter-resistant plastic cover. Commonly found in outdoor applications they are referred to as "capsule CFL's". They could easily be used in a childs room.
http://www.goodmart.com/products/213619.htm [ Parent ]
As a replacement for incandescent lighting- sure, BUT Most of the US has a heating season. What that means is there will be a net zero change in energy consumption in the long run- that heat entering the domicile via incandescent lighting means less heat the heating plant has to produce. Remove those incandescents for energy efficient bulbs- people will see the savings on their electric bill unless they have electric heat. Everyone else will likely use as much other energy form used for heat as those light bulbs produced. For some- not an issue. But then comes disposal.
If people are truly concerned about environmental impacts, make the switch now to LED lighting- no mercury.) CFL's would not ever come up again as an option if their EOL impacts were considered first. This change for LED lighting has only really come about within the last 6 months. LEDs are the future, and one industrial supplier has broken the light output barrier if you want to call it that. In one case, a thousand Lumens from a single die, and a Power LED Xlamp capable of 100+ lumens output from one Watt input.
Drop a CFL- what happens? Granted, mercury is bad- it is the only metal with a vapor pressure, and oxidizes so readily that an oxide layer forms on amounts that can exist as a nodule. A teaspoon of mercury if not oxidized, could a lecture hall full of people within an hour otherwise. The amounts used in florescents is so miniscule it vaporizesand oxidizes the moment the envelope breaks. But that mercury vapor released, while not immediately a problem, does add up in the atmosphere and can precipitate out in rain. So why contribute to that amount by buying CFL's? They may be reasonably cheap now- but end of life? How about light output after a month or two? In some cases, there is a noticable amount of loss.
Drop an LED array, it may crack in some designs, or it may bounce in others. Is there any contamination? Nope. Then there is the matter of End Of Life? 50,000 to 100,000 hours later- work it out. That would be a decade from now or longer if left on all day and night, and with even less energy consumed.
Consider in your home- how much storage space do you dedicate to storing your items that reached their EOL? Then consider a 5 Watt Power LED is about the diameter of a US quarter, and maybe 1/4 inch thick. This means more room in your closet for EOL items. Then consider what impact on storage space occurs in an office or institutional environment of 100,000 square feet?
While the technology still has a ways to go- it is at a useful stage now for true consideration and CFL's lose horribly in this discussion. Compare 50,000 hours of an LED to the life expectancy of a CFL- the CFL loses at a mere 6000 to 8000 hours. Then figure time required to replace each one times ten- Now figure Union Scale on that too.
Dimmability is easier with LEDs too. CFL's and all florescent tubes can be dimmed via "Pulsed Width Modulation." In the case of the cited CFL's above- they utilize this technique, and it is resident in the control chip on the circuit board in the base. A number of manufacturers of that chip use the PWM method for dimming. (It is also used for stepping up the voltage in cell phones to drive the LED flash module in cell phones. It is also the fundamental principle for switchmode powersupplies.)
LEDs can be dimmed with PWM, it is less energy consuming than linear regulators or rheostats, therefore more efficient. Isn't that the real goal?
CFL's are not an answer- just a transitional technology. Transformer supplies for LED lighting on 120VAC kills the energy savings potential that exists dropping them to the same level as a 2 tube trougher. The solution I am using in my transition is to supply from a surplus switchmode supply from a computer printer, or other device.
But with all this said about the alternatives- what really happens is the incandescent light bulb will now be the target of social engineering taxation. All for show, as it is largely going to be a zero sum discussion about the incandescents "wasteful nature." If you heat with alternative energy already- it is not that big of a deal.30 KiloWatt Brats anyone?[ Parent ]
The electric bicycle forums are very interested in getting as much LED light as possible from as few Watts as possible when riding at night. 48-volts is a common battery value there. Here's just one discussion of many, use the search function at the top right for more if this type of discussion is valuable to your project.
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2951&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=l ed%E2%80%A6[ Parent ]
