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functional differences between sine, modified sine, and sqaree waves?


By asheets, Section Newbies
Posted on Thu Feb 08, 2007 at 05:25:28 PM MST
functional differences between sine, modified sine, and sqaree waves?

I'm not exactly a newbie, but this seems like a newbie question to me -- so I'll put it here...

I was recently at the Habitat for Humanity store, and picked up an older 500W inverter for $6.  Solid as a rock, all solid state, no fans (just massive heatsinks), and no sign of it ever having been used.  It works great, and doesn't seem to have the issues with "phantom" power usage like newer units do.

I turned it over to look at the specs label, and noticed that the output is "120VAX square wave 60hz".  Well, I know what the graphical difference between square, sine, and modified sine is, and how they each look on the "silly-scope".  But my question is:  what is the functional difference between each type?

I know that you don't want to run anything that relies on wave timing on anything other than pure sine at 60hz -- especially electric clocks, record players, old reel-to-reel players, and certain timer motors in old washers/dryers/dishwashers, etc.  Well, I haven't seen an old electric clock in ages, my record players all need new needles, my reel tapes have all been converted to wind gens, and my Maytags were retrofitted with digital front panels.

I also know that most lights can run on almost whatever kind of wave you feed them...

Are there any other limitations I should know about?

functional differences between sine, modified sine, and sqaree waves? | 2 comments (2 topical)

Re: functional differences between sine, modified (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by Flux on Thu Feb 08, 2007 at 11:07:38 AM MST

With a square wave the peak, mean and rms values are all the same.

With a sine wave they are all different. For the sine, if we take the peak as unity, the rms is 70.7% and the mean is 63% of the peak.

Things designed to run from a sine wave will be designed on these factors.

For an example if we think about a 100v nominal sine wave supply ( 100v rms) then the peak voltage will be about 140v. Many devices work from rectified dc so the dc of such things will be just under 140v if they have smoothing capacitors.

If you run a 100v lamp on a 100v square wave it will be fine as lamps work on rms and that will be 100v. your radio will now produce a ht voltage of under 100v instead of 140 and may not work at all and certainly will not work properly.

So called modified sine inverters have a square wave with about 50% duty cycle and the trick is to make the peak voltage about 140v. This is fine for the radio and will charge its capacitor to 14ov peak. It so happens that the rms value of this waveform is 100v rms so the lamp will also be fine.

The result of all this is that square waves will not suit much other than lamps and heaters. Modified sine will suit lamps and heaters and also many electronic things that rectify to dc.

Things with universal ( series) motors will work perfectly well on any of these waveforms ( and even dc in many cases)

There are other devices that fall into a very grey area and may or not work on modified sine ( even less likely on square wave).

Induction motors may or may not run, they will certainly run hot and rough on MSW and are worse on square wave. The harmonics cause circulating currents and also cause tendencies to crawl at sub-harmonic speeds. Laser printers and many small power supplies will be damaged by msw or square. Power tools with speed regulators may not work.

Circuits with electronic power factor control such as hf lighting ballasts may be totally confused and not work or blow up.

Most people seem to be lucky, but there is always an element of risk with most clever things with msw and the risk is very high with square wave.

Microwave ovens tend to take longer on msw, they may die with square wave.
Flux



You can filter it (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by Seaspray0 on Thu Feb 08, 2007 at 04:32:31 PM MST

A sine wave is a pure wave.  It is an alternating cycle that has one frequency.  A square wave contains odd harmonics which is not suitable for many things.  I would not run anything that has any solid state component or a transformer not designed for it.  You do have an option available... you can "clean" the output into pretty much a clean sine wave.  The filter I saw consisted of a heavy duty transformer with capacitors on the output tuned to the induction of the coils in the transformer.   The reactive induction and capacitance, when properly tuned, filters out the harmonics.  Don't expect zero phantom losses if you do this, but you will have a much more useable output.



functional differences between sine, modified sine, and sqaree waves? | 2 comments (2 topical)
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