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township zoning codes
By imsmooth, Section Newbies Posted on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 05:38:01 PM MST
Does anyone have township codes for wind generators?

My township councilman wrote me saying that they are going to start looking into wind generators for the township at the residential level. A preliminary search within townships in New Jersey came up with discovery that no residents, except on the coastline, have zoning codes for wind generators. I am hoping that someone here lives in a residential area, where adjacent properties are no more than a few hundred feet from each other, and the township has zoning codes for allowing residential land to be used for wind generators. If you do, can you pass on your township name, city, State and the township's phone number. I can then forward this to my township so they have a template.
Jonathan

township zoning codes | 31 comments (31 topical, 0 editorial)

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by Novelist (Timdixon@OneBox.com) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 11:25:55 AM MST
(User Info)

Have you considered asking to put up a large Flag pole? Fly the flag with pride, then, at some other time and totally not linked to this plan, put your generator on the same pole? Local gov is usually happy to let people be patriotic.

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by asheets on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 12:46:11 PM MST
(User Info)

Unless you live in a Colorado HOA. Then, you might have some problems, depending on where you live.
_____________________________

Alan Sheets
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by electronbaby (roy<at>windsine.org) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 11:42:41 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.windsine.org

Ive written a couple codes with regard to small wind for some townships on Long Island. Probably the best placeto start for you would be the AWEA website. (American Wind Energy Assosciation). They have some sample codes that can be copied or custom worked to your townships requirements. Be prepared for a lengthy battle. Its well worth it, but it might take over a year before you make progress. Thats just how government is. Ive had good luck on the east end of LI, but its taken me 2 years for some towns.

Ive written one for Southold Town NY. Also for Riverhead NY. Im working with 2-3 other towns now also.
Have Fun!! RoyR KB2UHF

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by Countryboy on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 12:37:45 PM MST
(User Info)

You don't need codes to allow you to have a wind turbine on private property. The last I knew, New Jersey was still a part of the American states united together, and under the principles of Freedom and Liberty. As such, if no law prohibits you from having a wind turbine on private land, you already have the right - you don't need another piece of meddlesome Socialist Anti-American government regulation to allow you to have a wind turbine.

I would encourage you to tell your councilman to mind his own business. Government's business is securing people in their rights, and staying out of their lives in every other way.

No American Township government has the authority to allow people to put up wind turbines on private lands. The people already have that right.

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by TomW on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 12:58:51 PM MST
(User Info)

CB;

Sorry, but I have to ask:

Have you been paying attention lately to whats happened in the past 2 terms of the current administration?

You may be required to ask to take a dump soon.

Your constitutionally guaranteed rights have been surrendered to fight terrorists. [read "Protecting Big Oil"]. That simple fact proves the terrorists already won.

Fear is an effective means of control.

Thats all I can say without getting onto thin ice discussing politics.

Not exactly my idea of freedom.

I am rural in a farm state and, as long as I call it "agricultural" the only restrictions i have are groundwater quality regulations, and, of course the FAA on height because I am close to an airport.

Cheers. [or not]

TomW

"Education consists mainly of what we have unlearned."--Mark Twain
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#14)
by Countryboy on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 06:36:43 PM MST
(User Info)

Yes Tom, I am well aware of the fleecing of the people. Without going on a political rant, I'll just say this. A dictator only has the power the people give them. As appalled as I get at our government, I am even disgusted even further at the American people for allowing government to act this way.

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#16)
by TomW on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 06:55:42 PM MST
(User Info)

AMEN.

People should not fear their government, government should fear its people.

Cheers.

TomW

"Education consists mainly of what we have unlearned."--Mark Twain
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#19)
by finnsawyer on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 08:43:34 AM MST
(User Info)

It's worse then that. Give your neighbors a little bit of political power and they act like the big politicos. I have to go vote in Michigan's primary today. The local school board put on a bond issue that has been turned down before. Just like our elected representatives they sneak around to try to circumvent the will of the people. Sorry for the rant and highjack, but I had to get it off my chest.
GeoM
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#28)
by finnsawyer on Wed Jan 16th, 2008 at 08:24:36 AM MST
(User Info)

Just for the record, the bond issue did not pass. Yay! Finnsawyer pretends to wave the flag of freedom.
GeoM
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#8)
by imsmooth on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 01:23:08 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.mindchallenger.com

I wish this were true; maybe it is, but this would require me to get a lawyer. When I asked my township they said there are defined, approved uses of residential land: homes, shed, pools, etc. If the item is not listed as an approved use of land it can not be put on the property unless one can get a variance, which will also cost me thousands with no guarantee that I will get one.

I sent them a copy of the model ordinance from awea.org. Hopefully, in a few months, or more likely in a few years they may do something. I am very discouraged...

jonathan
Jonathan
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#9)
by Birdmmjb on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 02:15:05 PM MST
(User Info)

IM I would not take the townships word on that, as in most states the rule is that a land owner may do what he wishes to on his property as long as there is no express law or oridance (sp) restricting such activity. IE your may have a pool on your property as long as there is no restriction on having a pool. The township cant keep you from having said pool just becase they dont list it as an option.

Worth looking in to.

JAN

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#11)
by vawtman (vawtman(at)charter(dot)net) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 05:12:22 PM MST
(User Info)

Hmmm,I enjoy watching the vawts spin while laying in the pool with one of those little water couches and hope i dont tip over.
My neighbors are the nosiest things hiding in the trees and everything.They turned me in for my sons parties but not the turbine.I think they want one.

Soakin up the sun and thinkin.

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#17)
by Volvo farmer on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 08:27:13 PM MST
(User Info)

You might find the latest issue of Homepower magazine interesting. There's a guy in Wisconsin that wanted to put up a 120' freestanding tower with an old Jacobs on it. His request for a variance was denied but he found this lawyer who was an expert in small wind turbine issues and hired him. Well, six months later, he got his variance, with fifteen conditions attached, including a noise limit, and a write-off by a structural engineer that his tower was installed properly.

The article said the attorneys fees were just shy of four grand. How bad do you want that turbine?

Volvo Farmer

May you always have success in your quest to irritate those who you despise. -Ben Goode
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#25)
by elvin1949 (elvin1949@yahoo.com) on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 11:02:55 PM MST
(User Info)

imsmooth
There is a list of what is approved om a
residential property,GOOD.
Read it,odds are human,s are not on it,no wild animal,s are on it. The wild animal,s come first on my list.You are on the eastern migratory flight
path for the Canadian Goose.When they start north
in the spring,have everyone you know complain to
the township gov. [Alter the flight path of the Goose].
MY POINT
Politicians are afraid of us.They think if they
don't pass new law's they will not get re-elected.
SO We are inundated with stupid law's that are unenforceable. IT IS HARD TO FIX

better stop now while i am ahead
later
Elvin

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by SparWeb (sparweb at ANTISPAM_hotmail_com) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 01:05:19 PM MST
(User Info)

Last spring, I grit my teeth, braced for the worst, and phoned the municipality.
They answered, "We have no by-law regarding wind turbines or towers." I almost laughed with relief.
Then again, I don't live in the land of the free...

...I live in the land of the even free-er!
Steven Fahey

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by DamonHD (d@hd.org) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 01:21:43 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.earth.org.uk/

Hi,

I live in the land of the unfree subjects of Her Royal Maj, but my local council has been amazingly quick so far to say yes to me putting solar panels on my roof. Most of it done in a few days by email without even so much as a sketch design yet.

Less tricky than a turbine, but more effective round here anyway.

Rgds

Damon

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#10)
by TheCasualTraveler (a.miklos@yahoo.com) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 03:00:32 PM MST
(User Info) http://thecasualtraveler.com/wind.htm

IM, your township said they are looking into it so the way I read that is they aren't saying you can't do it, yet. From the standpoint that "If the item is not listed as an approved use of land it can not be put on the property unless one can get a variance" Just take a short ride around your neighborhood and ask the city where it states you can have a birdbath, an outdoor thermometer, solar powered garden lights, wind chimes, Christmas lights, weather vanes the list could be in the thousands of things not specifically mentioned as allowed. I think the bottom line is that public saftey is maintained so make sure the thing is braced right, that it cannot fall onto adjacent property, that it is wired right with fuses etc. so that it's not a fire hazard electrically. I would do that and tell them not to mess with me unless they want a very large RE Community targeting them as anti-green.
Andy
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#13)
by mat (mat@continuo.com) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 05:41:39 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.continuo.com

I live in port burwell on lake erie. There are bylaws prohibiting wind turbines BUT i petitioned the council and won a temporary two year permit at no cost and it will turn into a permanent zoning if no one complains. It was a struggle at times since the bureaucrats are alsays concerned about safety matters. Not if it falls or anything like that but their safety..... if they endorse it and something screws up they may be responsible. At any rate my tower is up and I am just getting the blades balanced and then to try it on the test stand. I already have solar cells which are far easier but almost useless in november and december... January too!

My site www.continuo.com

-mat in port burwell canada, formerly of ohio

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#12)
by spinningmagnets (velmis1450bc(at)aol(dot)com) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 05:23:47 PM MST
(User Info)

Codes are not always a bad thing (I do admit, I have been disappointed many times).

I do not find it unreasonable that I am asked to study and pass a test to get a drivers license. I don't mind passing a test to show I have basic knowlege of the law and gun safety before I get a firearm (why I have to wait 3 weeks to pick it up is a mystery, so I bought 3)

I can have a solar PV panel and a solar water pre-heater on my roof, but not a wind-gen or a clothes drying line visible from the street.

I could understand if I was required to post a bond or carry liability insurance in case a 60' tall home-built wind-gen fell over, or a blade flew 300 feet, but the answer is NO.

If they want to establish reasonable standards for safe installation (I don't want my neighbors to fall on my roof) I wouldn't mind, but I am always suspicious when somebody from the government says they want to help me.

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#15)
by Countryboy on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 06:45:04 PM MST
(User Info)

There is no code which is a good code. All codes are evil and used for oppress. No codes have any use if we would only use the Constitutional Law we already have.

I do not find it unreasonable that I am asked to study and pass a test to get a drivers license. *

I do. You should have Liberty of action, so long as you do not infringe the rights of your neighbor. If you infringe the rights of your neighbor, you should be held fully accountable.
Patrick Henry also found it unreasonable that a man had to get a license to preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ. That was his inspiration for his famous phrase, "Give me Liberty or give me death."

*I don't mind passing a test to show I have basic knowlege of the law and gun safety before I get a firearm (why I have to wait 3 weeks to pick it up is a mystery, so I bought 3)

I mind. I think you should be allowed to have a firearm, regardless of your knowledge. That is what Freedom and Liberty is about. It's no skin off my back if you shoot yourself...and if you shoot someone else, you should be held accountable. As for your victim, the Tree of Liberty needs watered with the blood of patriots and tyrants from time to time. It is Nature's manure.
The risk of being a victim is part of the price we pay for our Freedom and Liberty.

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#31)
by spinningmagnets (velmis1450bc(at)aol(dot)com) on Wed Jan 16th, 2008 at 06:00:56 PM MST
(User Info)

I am sympathetic to your point of view, but...

As soon as soon as its established that its "ridiculous" to create a wind-gen noise law, there will be some doofus who will erect a wind-gen that is very noisy on purpose. (not a problem if you own 20 acres, I don't)

Are you against the government FORCING wind-gen owners to attach red blinking lights to any tower above 60 ft to prevent low-flyibg aircraft from hitting it?

What if a neighbor erects a 60' tower next to the property line, 10' from your house, but 100' from his house because the noise bothers him, and he's afraid the flimsy tower he built might fall over?

By not participating in the developement of any reasonable standards, we may actually end up giving more power to the community fascists. Just my opinion, I could be wrong...

I hear the only thing that's certain in life is death and taxes,...but at least death doesn't get worse every time congress meets! -Will Rogers

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#18)
by domwild (domwild at hotmail dot com) on Mon Jan 14th, 2008 at 08:44:47 PM MST
(User Info)

Read an interesting comment from New Zealand, but I live in Oz:

Drilling rigs and their towers do not need permission as they are not permanent structures. If you are using earth anchors rather than concrete you may be able to claim the same for your windmill tower.

In rural areas it is certainly permissible to erect water pumpers, so why not RE ones?

In residential areas all sorts of council regulations re noise, visual pollution, safety, etc. may be placed in your way. In Oz, any structure, and that may only be a six-foot dunny (toilet), would require council approval.
dom There is one thing money cannot buy: POVERTY!
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#20)
by brkwind2 (mcool61@nspamyahoo.com) on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 08:55:52 AM MST
(User Info)

I don't intend to ask. Trespassers invade my property at their own risk.
Rover, stop it.

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#21)
by carlb23 on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 03:33:06 PM MST
(User Info)

I live in Harrison Township New Jersey and I have a Skystream 3.7 on a 33.5' tower in my back yard. We are in a development but there are no by laws restricting what i can put on my property in the Homeowners agreement. When I applied to the township the only restricting was that the maximum height could only be 35' this height is common in many residential situations.

We installed the turbine in June 2006 and had no problem with approval from the township. About a year after we put it up some of the neighbors not even close to us tried to have the Homeowners association put a ban on Wind turbines. Well one of the complaining neighbors attended the meeting but abstained when it came time to vote and the other didn't even show up.

The opinion of the others that attended was that they didn't want any homeowners assoc telling them what they could put on their property. We are only on a little over 1/2 acre.

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#22)
by ghurd on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 03:44:28 PM MST
(User Info)

Nice.

My sister worked in an area that decided what color choices the curtain should be.
Good for her.

Ever seen someone who was just told the garage curtains must match the house, and therefore would cost $1,000 per window?
Bad for them. Funny to me.

No clue about windmills there.
McDs and BK must have signs waist high, max.
Hudson, OH. ?

Near it is the first Wendy's. Must be the same crap there, because I looked for an hour to get a freaking burger. Short sign, bragging about ""Wendy's #1"".

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#23)
by terryg on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 08:26:26 PM MST
(User Info)

Although I'm new to the issue, I do know that all towers must have proper lighting,(red or white light every 60 ft. and flashing light on top) only for towers 60ft. and taller. townships may have some erection standards

Terry

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#24)
by Experimental (harogate@whidbey.com(no spam)) on Tue Jan 15th, 2008 at 08:39:15 PM MST
(User Info)

I put up my wind gen and tower, on our present property, two years ago -- I didn,t ask the county and don,t intend to..
In my way of thinking, you don,t do yourself a favor by attracting attention to yourself -- espically with county executives...
I make sure, the tower can,t fall on the neighbors property, and make sure the prop on the mill dosen,t make irratating noise -- I also glue the backing plate and the blades together -- this makes it nearly impossiable to replace a single blade, but the chanch of a blade flying off and thru the neighbors window or roof, plus the fact, that it is much stronger, gives me a lot of confidence in high winds !!
I think you will have more problems with "Home owner associations". than you will with Local government -- and I won,t buy a home with a HOA, with out knowing just what kind of laws they have --- actually, I avoid them...
True, the county can force you to take down a wind gen, but I,ve done this in three different neighborhoods including a city in the San Francisco area, and have had no problems in 20 years...
My advise --- Don,t ask !!! Bill H.........

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#27)
by imsmooth on Wed Jan 16th, 2008 at 06:04:29 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.mindchallenger.com

I think the cat is out of the bag...I've already spoken with the township zoning officer, engineer and I've written two of the councilmen, including the mayor over the last few months. Maybe I should have just done it in hindsight. If it was going to be completely invisible to passerbys and neighbors I would just put it up. I know, though, that if I erect the pole and it is seen from the street I will get a phone call from the township or police to take it down. I could then make a fight of it, and get legal council, but this is not the direction I want to go. I have already forwarded them awea.org information and asked them to look at the fact the someone in Harrison Township has erected a tower. I guess if this takes too long I can contact a paper and make a stink of why an "environmentally concerned" township is thwarting efforts go use clean energy. All of your comments are very helpful so far.
Jonathan
[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#30)
by fcfcfc on Wed Jan 16th, 2008 at 03:23:01 PM MST
(User Info)

Hi: All this is quite interesting and not surprising. Often times people, and especially bureaucracies interpret asking up front as a lack of self confidence in what you are doing, as opposed to trying to be proactive. Since you let the cat out of the bag first, rather than just doing it, I fear the cat may wind up dead.

[ Parent ]

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#26)
by luckeydog (bryan@coloradowindpower.com) on Wed Jan 16th, 2008 at 12:02:04 AM MST
(User Info) http://www.coloradowindpower.com

In my City it is illegal or in violation of cod to fly a electrical producing wind turbine.

I did not ask for permission and I wont either ant any time. So far there has been no complaints and no code enforcement has stopped by to ask me about it.
If they do I might tell them it is kinetic art or something stupid like that. or I might just put them on the defence. and say "what is the city of Broomfield oppose renewable energy."

usually if you live in a HOA here in Colorado you are screwed. I refuse to live in a HOA talk about no property rights just move into one of those little "communities"

Some times it is better to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission.

Luckeydog
.
wind gens are much funner to watch than solar panels. Broomfield,Colorado

Re: township zoning codes (3.00 / 0) (#29)
by asheets on Wed Jan 16th, 2008 at 09:54:45 AM MST
(User Info)

Too bad... the City and County of Broomfield is a great wind area...
_____________________________

Alan Sheets
[ Parent ]

township zoning codes | 31 comments (31 topical, 0 editorial)

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