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Question on Commercial wind generators
By welldog, Section Wind Posted on Wed Jul 30th, 2008 at 12:20:15 AM MST
Commercial wind generator positioning for best wind

This is kind of of subject here but may be relevent.
I was wondering why, When you drive past alot of the commercial wind farms in Northern Colorado and Southern Wyoming, That the windmills have a permenent direction that they face. They are set up at different angles but they are never all running due to the direction the wind is coming in.
After talking with a friend that travels to Europe frequently, He said that all the windmills there rotate to get the best wind possible. Why is that not done with the farms that I have seen.
This is something that people on this forum are concerned about, Keeping the best side to the wind for the most output.
What am I missing.
Is our govenment subsidized money getting the best bang for the buck. (or more importantly, Most power from what is available? )
Just wondering reasons why?
Welldog

Question on Commercial wind generators | 8 comments (8 topical, 0 editorial)

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#1)
by wdyasq on Tue Jul 29th, 2008 at 07:00:39 PM MST
(User Info)

Many of the wind farms don't have the infrastructure to transmit all of the power they have the capability to produce. I THINK, but don't know, there are credits for capacity, not actual generated power.

The few wind farms I have actually been to don't seem to have enough power-lines to them to support a good sized gas turbine, much less several Mega Watt windturbines.

I don't see how the 'light' lines I have seen can transmit the capacity of all the mills. If this is the case, there would be no practical way to run all of the mills at one time.

Ron
Adventure is just bad planning." -- Roald Amundsen

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#2)
by vawtman (vawtman(at)charter(dot)net) on Tue Jul 29th, 2008 at 07:02:39 PM MST
(User Info)

Hi Welldog
I would think it's kinda irrelevent here.Sorry, but we can't compete with them in the homebrew business.

Mark

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#3)
by electronbaby (roy<at>windsine.org) on Tue Jul 29th, 2008 at 07:05:39 PM MST
(User Info) http://www.windsine.org

yes, they rotate to face the wind. Possibly what you are seeing is them either in need of maintenance, or possibly the wind is too turbulent around those machines. Its hard to say.

If they are mainly facing one direction, that is probably because this is the direction the wind is coming from. What Ive noticed, if they are shut down for some reason, either automatically or manually, they still will rotate into the wind. This prevents the blade pitch from making unnecessary adjustments when locked in position.
Have Fun!! RoyR KB2UHF

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#4)
by veewee77 on Tue Jul 29th, 2008 at 09:42:02 PM MST
(User Info)

Those big turbines do turn into the wind. If they are not turning, they are either shut down for maintenance, or over production.

They just don't look to be turning to face the wind, because even when they are turning, it is very slow to keep centrifugal forces toa minimum, and they kinda do an "average over time" thing with the wind.

Those in NCO and SWO will generally be facing northwesterly and will stay that way most of the year because that is where most of the sind comes from.

Doug

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#7)
by Ungrounded Lightning Rod on Thu Jul 31st, 2008 at 11:20:20 PM MST
(User Info)

... even when they are turning, it is very slow to keep centrifugal forces to a minimum, and they kinda do an "average over time" thing with the wind.

They're turning at low RPM because, like our mills, they have a tip speed ratio as high as practical for efficiency (in the neighborhood of 6 or so) and they're up there a ways where the wind is high. You don't want the tip approaching the speed of sound (thus getting supersonic flow over part of the blade, wasting power making sonic booms, and creating turbulence that damages blades and other constructed things). So that limits both the tip speed ratio and the rotation rate.

The absolute tip speed doesn't change appreciably as you scale from a hobby mill to a big utility model, because the speed of sound is related only to temperature, which only drops slightly at the height of the big mills, and molecular weight, which doesn't change at all. So the RPM drops in proportion as radius increases.

[ Parent ]

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#8)
by Tritium on Fri Aug 1st, 2008 at 10:39:36 AM MST
(User Info)

I've been watching the turbines (they are 1 to 2 megawatt turbines) at three new farms in my area and they usually spin between 6 to 10 RPM. At a TSR of 6 that would put the tip speed between 100 to 200 mph most of the time.

Thurmond

[ Parent ]

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#5)
by welldog on Tue Jul 29th, 2008 at 09:49:04 PM MST
(User Info)

What it appears is that each generator is facing a little different direction so that there is a certain percentage that is catching wind at any wind direction. It does not appear that they swivel on the tower at all.

It may not apply to the DIYer but this is our mighty tax dollars at work. If I am going to take the expense of a generator then I am going to get the most out of it for the dollars spent.

WellDog

Re: Question on Commercial wind generators (3.00 / 0) (#6)
by Ungrounded Lightning Rod on Thu Jul 31st, 2008 at 11:08:35 PM MST
(User Info)

In particular, these puppies are usuall on hills. The hills deflect the wind. So it's not all going in the same direction as it flows over the hills, and different (operating) mills are pointing in different directions because the wind on different mills is from different directions.

You'll usually see this most on the end mills of a string. If one in the middle is pointed off into the ozone it's not currently running normally (or at all).

[ Parent ]

Question on Commercial wind generators | 8 comments (8 topical, 0 editorial)

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