Author Topic: Star-Delta switch  (Read 2856 times)

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commanda

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Star-Delta switch
« on: March 20, 2005, 02:27:47 AM »
I actually built this back before Xmas, just haven't gotten around to finalising it & publishing it. The input voltage is taken from the Tacho circuit I published previously, and gives a DC voltage proportional to RPM. The switch is a DPDT, centre-off toggle switch.


circuit in pdf format


Pcb layout in pdf format


The switch has positions for;


normal - relay operates off input voltage - corresponding Led lights steady


relay off - relay permanently off - Led still follows input voltage but flashes


relay on - relay permanently on - Led still follows input voltage but flashes



The op-amp, I used an LMC7111, rail to rail micropower device, mainly because I have some on hand.


The cmos device must be a 4093, schmitt quad nand. A normal nand gate won't oscillate (U2A).


And here's some photo's of my test rack setup.









My batteries, a pair of retired automotive batteries, have deteriorated since I last played with this back before Xmas. And I've yet to cut some copper busbar and wire most of this up a bit more professionally. But you can see the 3 toroidal transformers, the terminals where the transformer primaries terminate, the 2 relays for the star-delta switching, the 3 bridge rectifiers, and the back of the meters (volts, amps, rpm).


Amanda

« Last Edit: March 20, 2005, 02:27:47 AM by (unknown) »

commanda

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2005, 07:30:45 PM »
Sorry, I mucked that up badly.


This is the link to the circuit.


circuit in pdf format

« Last Edit: March 19, 2005, 07:30:45 PM by commanda »

domwild

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2005, 07:19:43 PM »
Commanda,


Thanks for that. You have kept us in suspenders for a long time! Did you see the latest Silicon Chip re tacho circuit out of an old Skyline or Nissan Pintara. Probably just like your circuit. LM2917 based with analogue car tacho, etc.


Keep up the good work.


Regards,

« Last Edit: March 20, 2005, 07:19:43 PM by domwild »

domwild

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2005, 08:12:56 PM »
Amanda,


As you know I know very little about electronics but intend to build a load switching circuit based on yours plus Hugh Piggot's idea. My thought is to add a star/delta circuit in addition to the load shedding circuit(s). Hugh's circuit seems to be much simpler than yours or so it seems to me. Would i be correct in assuming that a load shedding circuit can also be used to switch star/delta??


There seems to be an advantage to switch AC at the zero-crossing point.


Another question: Using the same load shedding circuits would it be possible to short the windings in extreme winds without "valuable smoke" coming from the windings??


Regards,

« Last Edit: March 21, 2005, 08:12:56 PM by domwild »

commanda

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2005, 01:32:27 PM »
I presume you're talking about Hugh's circuits here?

http://www.scoraigwind.com/circuits/index.htm


His tacho circuit is essentially the same as mine, except he doesn't include the meter.

His op-amp comparator circuit is also essentially the same as mine; except his output goes to a triac via an opto-coupler.


My circuit is more complex, yes, but it gives auto/manual control over star/delta, and intelligent indication of what's happening. The leds flash when in manual mode. In reality, it's only one 14 pin cmos chip, which costs about a dollar.


By switching it to manual, and locking it in one mode, you can then get current vs rpm data. Once you've done this in both modes, you can then choose a suitable cross-over frequency, and adjust the trim-pot to suit.


Switching AC at the zero crossing point is preferable in 2 situations.

First, when you have a large reactive load, and switching causes lots of arcing to relay contacts, or stresses the solid-state devices doing the switching and arc protection.

Second, where you are switching on every cycle, and the switching noise creates RF hash (interferes with radio & TV.)


I think, switching 3 phase from star to delta, using zero crossing, if not completely impossible, is certainly making life more difficult. Only one of the 3 phases is ever at zero at any given point in time. Questionable advantages when we're only talking power levels, in most cases, of less than a kilowatt at full power. So the power at the switch-over point is only a couple of hundred watts. And, it's not going to be switching 60 times a second, 24/7, either.


It is possible to use a tacho circuit driving an op-amp comparator to short out the windings above a certain rpm. I'd probably want it latching, and raising some sort of alarm; preferably a flashing led, which remains active until the latch is reset, and audio indication (think sonalert) with it's own "silence" switch. Whether the alternator comes to a screaching stop, or just keeps spinning & smokes, depends on the alternator, and how much resistance between it & the relay contacts. So you'd probably want the actual relay at the top of the mast. More wiring, and a bigger pain if things go wrong. For me, the less gear on top of that mast, the better.


A properly designed furling system is, to me, much simpler and inherently more reliable.


I have seen people use a manual switch at the base of their tower, to short out the windings while doing maintenance, or if extreme weather is coming. But I think the idea is to shut it down "before" the weather hits.


Amanda

« Last Edit: March 22, 2005, 01:32:27 PM by commanda »

domwild

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2005, 06:45:54 PM »
Thanks for that. As usual, complexity brings about more flexibility.


Regards,

« Last Edit: March 22, 2005, 06:45:54 PM by domwild »

phil b

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2005, 11:35:31 AM »
Hi Amanda,

On your schematic, there are a few components that are not labeled with values. They are E1, Q1, D1 to D3, L1&L2. Also what does 5V6 on the zener mean? and R8 is a 2K2 resistor?

Sorry, I'm missing something. Other than that, I'm ready to order the parts and build one!

Thanks Phil
« Last Edit: March 24, 2005, 11:35:31 AM by phil b »
Phil

nanotech

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2005, 10:14:57 PM »
I'm probably being just a little dense (I claim late night time as fault!!  :P ), but what exactly do the 3 toroidal transformers do?
« Last Edit: March 30, 2005, 10:14:57 PM by nanotech »

commanda

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2005, 11:28:53 PM »
I'm running the F&P at high voltage, and converting to low voltage at the battery bank. Saves transmission losses.


Amanda

« Last Edit: March 30, 2005, 11:28:53 PM by commanda »

commanda

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Re: Star-Delta switch
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2005, 02:00:34 AM »
Phil,


Sorry for the slow response.


E1 is 1uF. Not a critical value. 10uF would work just as well.

Q1 is a garden variety NPN transistor. BC548 etc. So long as it can handle the current to pull in your relay(s).

D1 should probably be a 1N4001 or better.

D2,D3 can be 1N914, 1N4148 signal diodes or 1N4001. Doesn't matter.

L1 & L2 are led's.

5V6 is shorthand for 5.6 volts. It is common practice to put the unit identifier in place of the decimal point, because decimal points often get lost in photocopying or faxing.

Same applies to R8. 2K2 means 2.2K.


Amanda

« Last Edit: March 31, 2005, 02:00:34 AM by commanda »