Electric vehicles

[monte350c]

Sigh.

I'm pretty sure this is in the wrong section.

A while back I think I remember reading about an electric pickup truck Jerry was in the process of converting. Unless I was dreaming or something. I searched the board for the story but after several tries I still can't find it.

If you see this Jerry,

How did it work out? (range, acceleration etc.)

What's your motor/batteries/controller combination?

If you had do do anything different what would it be?

I have been thinking about this as an interesting project. If you didn't have tp drive too far you could fill up from the sun or wind.

Ted.

[henjulfox]

http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2005/5/1/32619/32286

This what you're looking for?

-Henry

[Jerry]

Hi Ted

No updates yet on the EV. Just got back from my 3K mile trip. Just befor I left one of the batteries blew up.

The metal braket that holds the batteries down is the problem. Carosion had built up and began a small carbon track that ignited one battery during over night charging.

I've got to find another way to hold the batteries down. At the same time I'll do a cable upgrade to 4/0 from 1/0.

That should speed things up abit. Depending on wind and battery charge top end is between 55 and 68 MPH.

This gets me to work and home again just fine.

                       JK TAS Jerry

[monte350c]

Hi,

Thanks for the link Henry. You're better at searching than me!

Jerry - thanks for the update. I have been saving my pennies planning to do an S10. I like the idea of putting the batteries between the frame rails, and I also like the idea that (quite) a few others have already been there, done that.

My drive to work is short (about 10 miles each way) and the ground is very flat, with little traffic so all in all I think probably good for a conversion.

The recharge idea from a mill or sun is pretty cool - even if it would take a while and need a pretty big turbine. A lot easier than making your own gasoline!

Ted.

[nothing to lose]

Hi Jerry

Hope you had a good trip.

I'll look over your post on that truck again also. I have a Ford Ranger with 5sp I am thinking about. I have an engine for it in a mercury all unbolted ready to pull for the truck, but now I am thinking a conversion instead

Any updates or new posts on your truck would be great, thanks for the ones you've already posted too.

I hate HONDA! Tell people for years all you got to do to extend range is run a gennie a bit and they Bulk and act like I'm stupid. Then Honda comes out with this crap of a car that recharges itself and they actually beleave it! All it does is start a feul powered gennie when the batteries get low as I understand it. Big deal, same thing I and many others said for years now but no-one listens, do they!

 Driving on batteries and running a gennie uses less fuel than driving on fuel itself for many reasons. Any fuel burned is producing power and the gennie can always be run at the most efficent speed/power for the fuel used. The gennie only runs when needed. Compare that to a fuel engine wasting fuel durring braking, coasting, idling at lights and drive up fast food windows etc. Times when batteries are at rest with no load a feul powered vehicle is still burning fuel (but doing no work)!

 Charging at home is even better of course and cheaper than a gennie, but to extend range a small gennie will do wonders.

Buying a motor is my bigest problem, can't afford one. But now at $3 a gallon for gas it will only take a savings of 500 gallons to pay for a $1500 motor compared to haveing to save 1,000 gallons of gas at $1.50 a gallon. Half the gallons for all the other needed items also. I have to drive the kid to school every day, no bus for her here, I bet I could save the cost of an electric pickup truck in 1 school year and that includes batteries and electric.

Gee Jerry you were super smart to build yours when you did

[kitno455]

ntl- i think i understand the basic premise of using a small ICE running at peak eff. to charge batteries, and an electric motor with a flat torque curve to motivate the vehicle, and batteries to smooth out the high demand periods, but with FLA's as the batteries, does the additional weight not reduce most of the benefits?

i mean, you can switch to a smaller, higher RPM ICE, and use a continuously variable transmission, and gain at least some of the benefits without the weight gain...

allan

[windstuffnow]

  Ted,

   I'm doing just about what your thinking of... Basically an S10 conversion but I plan to add a few extra things to the mix.

   I purchased the 94 S10 this July and have purchased the motor and adaptor to start the process.  This is going to be my winter project this year so it will be a couple weeks before I actually get greasy.  I will post pictures of the conversion as it progresses.

   I really wanted to find a 29-30 modelA pickup for the conversion.... electric/hybrid street rod.  But couldn't find anything that was reasonably priced with a decient body.  So the S10 was my second choice and far less expensive for the donor vehicle.

   .

[monte350c]

Hi Ed,

Very interesting! I'll be bringing back a similar vintage S10 from down south when I go to visit my sister this December.

Are you using a 9" motor? Which one did you choose? Is the adapter from electroauto?

I have been wearing out the EV websites and it appears that a DC conversion will yield about the same range as an AC one at about half the cost.

If anyone has good reasons why this won't work I would love to hear about it while this thing's still in the planning stages.

Also it looks like flooded lead acid in spite of their problems may still be the most effective combination of cost and longevity.

My plan thus far is to use either a Curtis 1231 controller with 24 x 6 volt US or T 145 batteries, or the Zilla 1K controller with 26 batteries for a 156 volt system.

I will try very hard to put the project on a strict weight diet - perhaps aluminum for the battery frames. Every pound out will mean better performance all around.

This will be a fun project and ultimately good for the environment. Even if it's grid electricity it will be cleaner than the gas engine that comes out of it.

Ted.

[windstuffnow]

  Hi Ted,

    I purchased an FB1-4001 Advanced with the second shaft.  The adaptor I ordered from Randy at canadian Ev.  Fits the 2.2 and some of the older 2.5/2.8 engines.

    I'll be using the 1231 also but with 144volt system.  I'm thinking of going with the Trojan 27 series ( 12V ) Where there will only be 12 batteries at 67lbs to load in.  Of course that will mean 1/2 the range of 24 6v.  I'd like to add some other goodies that will extend the range, one being a small diesel which will drive the power steering and possibly some other accessories as well as an onboard genny... still up in the air about the hp and model.

    EvAmerica will talk your ear off about going clutchless and all the advantages of the clutchless system.  I'm not convinced... I've been driving a stick since before I had my licience.   If you talk with these guys ask them if you can downshift... The answer is no.  This means if you slow down to make a turn your stuck in the gear you were cruising in or you'll have to stop then downshift.  With a clutch you can easily slow down grab a low amp gear and make your way up to speed.  Other wise you'll have to amp the heck out of it to get back to speed.

    I'm not sure AC is that much better than DC with all the conversions and a whole bunch of extra costs.  There are a bunch of Solectra S10's out there for sale in the 10-12k range.  Unfortunately, if something goes bad your looking at 5k for a controller and 4k for the battery pack.   The GM version E10 was kind of unique with a front wheel drive system but it used a special made panasonic battery pack which is quite outrageous to replace.  

    I think the best bang for the buk is the DC versions/conversion.  

    I'm looking for alternative ideas for the cab heat though.... I don't like the idea of a 1500/3000 watt draw on the batteries to heat the truck in winter.  If I use a small diesel I can most likely use an exchanger on the exhaust but it would be nice to have a pre-heater of sorts.  It wouldn't be diffucult to make heat while your moving but when your warming it up from cold...

    Lots of fun challenging little problems...

.

[Jerry]

Hi Ed

You are spot on when it comes to the clutch. I can tell you from my expirience from driving my EV as far as the clutch is concerned DON"T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT IT. I have a couple small hills to deal with and a no clutch vehickle would be prety tuff.

As far as the heat I think 750 watts would work for me most winter days and maybe 1500watts on the real cold days. But it doesn't get that cold here. We rarely see temps in the teens. My comute is only 7 miles.

I'll have the heater going at 750w while charging overnight with the thermistat  set at 60%. WE get lots of rain so the defoger will get a work out.

Eager to see how these EV projects come along. I hope to do my upgrades in a few days.

All I need is time?

                        JK TAS Jerry

[ghurd]

Heat in a car with no radiator?  Now I know something about that, having driven a lot miles in rusted out, no heat at all, VW Bugs in Ohio winters.  Real Bugs, not those new ones.

Defrosting and defogging the windshield is the biggest issue.  There is no feeling quite like 60MPH on icy roads when the windshield totally fogs up in a "whoosh". An aftermarket rear window defroster kit on the windshield works great. The good kind with the tiny wire strips, not the totally useless little fan kind.

(I thought about a secondary oil cooler just for the defroster, never did it.)

Jerry's right. It doesn't take a lot of heat to be comfortable for a short time.

VW's used exhaust heat for the interior.

Some VWs had a 'gas heater', something between a pistonless motor and a bomb. Almost a collecters item for the Bug version, but I think all the type-3 cars had them.  Instant heat.  I 'adapted' a type-3 heater for a Bug, it melted the plastic on the seats in front of the vents.  3 hours per gallon comes to mind, but that was 25 years ago.

G-

[windstuffnow]

  Hi Jerry,

    Your probably right about the low wattage heater for short trips.  It does get downright cold here and sub-zero weather isn't uncommon.  I'm not as concerned about the creature comfort as much as the defrosters working well.   When you exhale here in winter it turns to ice.  

    There has to be an inexpensive logical way to make heat without using the batteries or fuel... interesting challenge I'd say...

.

[monte350c]

Jerry and Ed,

I'm with you on the clutch idea. Out of curiousity Ed, the adapter you got, does it include a splined shaft that goes into the clutch disk? And is it one of those shaft and compression collar things that holds it on the motor?

I wonder if a ceramic heater designed for 120 VAC could be used right off the main battery pack. Or maybe a 220 volt version. That would at least cut out the DC DC converter for heating purposes. The other 'big ticket' items as far as current draw goes would be headlights and heater blower fan. Wonder if those could be rigged to run from the main pack as well.

It probably wouldn't be too hard to find a small DC motor to run the squirrel cage blower fan. About head lights I don't know...

If you could get the current draw for the remaining 12 volt items low enough the aux. battery could be quite small.

Just thinking out loud!

Once this project is complete I might have to change my nickname from monte350c to S10e!

Ted.

[monte350c]

Oops!

Typing before thinking. Guess most transmissions already have the splined shaft!

What I should have said... does it come with a flange to bolt the flywheel to!!

Ted.

[RP]

I think for heat I'd consider something based on Propane.  The fuel is fairly cheap, clean burning, simple and mechanisms are quite scavengable from barbeques, stoves, heaters, torches, etc.  

As for running a 12volt blower on the battery pack:  There have been several articles on rewinding them as a generator.  Why not rewind one for 144volts?  You can still use a simple series resistor system to control fan speed since at least the waste heat from the resistor would be put to good use.

[windstuffnow]

  Hi Ted,

     The adaptor kit came with the tapered split bushing that slides over the motor shaft and is torqued into place.  The adaptor itself is machined to fit the flywheel your using, in my case I'm using the flywheel and clutch from the original 2.2 engine.  The trans shaft simply slips into the original parts.

     They make some nice electric heaters that replace the original liquid heater core and run off the main battery pack ( 96,120 or 144 volt ).  Their only around 80 bux for the 1500 watt unit.   I'd really like to find a different way to use the original liquid core... havent figured that out yet.

     You can drive a standard alternator off the second shaft on the motor to run your 12v stuff and keep the battery charged ( run lights, blowers, vacuum pump etc ) and save a bunch of money on the DC-DC converter.  Also, you could use a small wind turbine behind the grill to charge the 12v battery.  At 50 mph it would be quite easy getting 5 to 10 amps charge with a very small mill. ( of course I'm thinking of a small Lenz turbine ;o)

     I've been thinking of adding a small diesel engine ( burning vegie oil) and drive the power steering pump, alternator for 12volt as well as a hv alternator as a range extender.  If I decide to go this way then the heat shouldn't be a major problem.  

     I have a bunch of idea's on extending the range.   Definately a fun and challenging project!  

.

[windstuffnow]

  Ted,

    You've probably already found them but here are a couple links.   The prices are reasonable and their quite helpful.

http://www.canev.com

http:/www.evparts.com

.

[Drives]

Many years ago, the heater boxes in my old VW BUG rotted out, so having no money to fix them, I placed an open flame propane camp stove on my passengers seat.  Worked great until you started nodding off due to lack of oxygen...Ha Ha!  You just had to remember to crack the wing style windows to catch some fresh air.   When the weather was really cold, the camp stove wouldn't get the job done, so I would pile blankets over my legs, drink lots of hot coffee, and have an ice scraper handy to scrape the inside of the windshield.  

We had no money, but those were the days!

[monte350c]

Thanks for the info Ed,

This will be an interesting project to do. And very appropriate for the times!

Ted.

[nothing to lose]

Hello.

I am not around where I have net access much lately and probably won't be for awhile still, sorry for late replies but can't help it.

Ok, the extra weight is not that big a deal. Everyone says it is, but alot probably depends on the vehicle itself. For instance my F250 pickup truck gets pretty close to the same milage rather I haul a few hundred pounds or run empty. In this case batteries are not a big deal as far as milage goes. Perhaps if I drove a Geo Metro and got 40mpg then adding 200 pounds of batteries would matter alot?

Curruntly I am experimenting with adding a Distillery to the truck for alcohol fuel and some other things too

Regulating the temps properly and a couple other items have been holding u the project but I think I have then solved and can build again.