On the contrary Jerry
"My verbal arguments have gone noware. My examples had no impact. My car alt examples were deamed unfair to the star conection"
Your arguments whilst not having yet changed the world, have opened up the world to other possibilities. Some have tried similar systems before, but nowhere have i heard anyone deliberatly derating their wire size to half the capacity and doubling the turns.
This just may turn out to be the master stroke. I have learned a lot just by having to confront your ideas, some of which seemed convoluted, and maybe to me factually misbased in some cases, but even if your reasoning was based on some misconceptions, they were based on what you had observed. This made your conclusions far more worthy of consideration.........and the jury is still out!!
I hadn't realised that delta had 1/3 the resistance of star and thats without paralleling your windings. (thanks peter netherlands).
This fact alone deems your system to be looked at for longer. As you know, i have a few powerful three phase machines which I had to convert to match my phase converter, this led me to have to learn about them. It occurs to me that half were star, half were delta. The biggest ones were delta. It seems anomalous that they would deliberatly use inefficient means to power industrial equiptment. Its not toy equiptment, it's designed to run all day every day. Surely economies of operation were uppermind in the designers minds. You couldn't sell a big delta motor of 10hp for heavy going continuous use if it was going to be much more economical to use a star winding, and you certainly wouldn't design it into your equiptment unless the competition was just as silly. In these big machines, daily cost of ownership is a big issue, it would have to have been taken into account .
This has bought into focus just how much more efficient is star supposed to be, and why?. The fact that star is in use in this axial flux, may have more to to with hughs original testing Was he trying to get maximun wire thickness into a fixed size area. The logical choice is star, as max voltage for min turns are possible. Once running and seeing lowering of power curve as speed went up, switched to delta, and made comparisons. I don't know, but unless you were aware that you could double turn no and still be less R than star coil, you could use wire thinner wire and still do ok, and then you could wind up the other coils the same, and still remain ok, maybe that wasn't thought of, I dont know, but whatever the reasons, it IS worth exploring the possibilities further.
It would be useful for you to get accurate wind readings for your test figures. At the moment they appear quite unbelievable, mostly because youv'e blown the possible power extraction from a certain wind speed to bits. I think you'll agree that that puts them in the rubbery figures department. It is necessary that proper figures are found, so that accurate comparison of other like sized machines can be compared.
The car alternator business was unable to set a normalised frame of reference to compare one system to another. It wasn't dynamic, and would in no way give us a picture of how both systems may perform up the tower in the wind. Here blade stall and gennie matching become critical to AH in the batteries over time. If we didn't have to match these characteristics, we could wind as many turns as possible or put 24v system on 12v batteries, and let the losses fall where they may, burn out a stator or two.... probably not, blade stall may prevent this and it may never get up to speed where the airfoils generate their power effectively.
Thats why I feel these tests will prove inconclusive. Only by comparing this machine to like machines, can we get close. After that blade design etc etc, tower height blah blah blah. Or have another stator made star to test against. But that should only be as a last resort. If we can get an accepted power curve from it it would help the argument considerably. I'd be interested in what Danb felt may help to definatively prove the case one way or the other.
I am not qualified to compare , as I have not spent the night with only a candle because I had no power that day.
I'm not that quick to discount the air 403 design either. It looks like it may suit a jerryrig makeover. The fact that you can fine tune different parts of the power curve is nice also.
So keep the chin up, we all (well most of us anyway) have learn't something along the way, I think you'll find that you have most peoples admiration for not giving up in the face of adversity, and you have definatly not become a contender for the corner.....that position could be looming up to be mine yet..........oztules
