Author Topic: brushless motor experiment  (Read 2446 times)

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dinges

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brushless motor experiment
« on: March 16, 2008, 02:05:53 PM »
Dear Diary,


I got a bit bored today. As I was contemplating that it would be about time to clean up the workdesk my eye fell upon some harddisks that were waiting to be slaughtered. At that very moment a little lamp lit up inside my brain (light was pouring out of my ears).


[Start flashback] For the past 2-3 weeks I've been looking a bit into variable frequency drives for the lathe. Just 'for the fun of it' I'd like to drive the latest motorconversion (which is now a generator) as a motor too. And, I've been thinking more... For those who already have a 12-24-48Vdc system in their house but would like to operate their tools (lathe, drillpress), it might be an idea to use a motorconversion and a small VFD for 12-48Vdc. Especially the RC aircraft electro scene has some very nice 12Vdc 3-phase drives (70+ A...) to drive small 3 phase brushless motors. I was contemplating building one to drive the 500W conversion as motor, till my eye happened to fall upon the harddisks on the workbench... [end flashback]


Thinking... those harddisk motors are brushless 3 phase motors. So, somewhere on the board there must be a driver. Now, if I could hook up my motor to the drivers... and perhaps make RPM adjustable too...


So, took apart one of the drives and located the 3 connector pins that went to the HD motor. By stroke of sheer luck I happened to have exactly 3 wires with crocodile clamps left (all the other wires let out their majic smoke; in my experience they make great fuses too. Cheap trashy wires with just a few thin copper wires. I usually replace them with thicker wire after they burn out). Connected the 3 crocodile wires to the printed circuit board (PCB) with bits of paper preventing short-circuits between them, the other ends of the wires going to the motorconversion (the motor, which was converted to a generator, but is now being used as a motor again. If you can still follow me...)





Needed to find another wire to trick the ATX PC PSU into operation. Green wire to ground and it lives. And, as if by magic, the motorconversion starts to turn!


Great!


But... after about one second it stops turning and starts buzzing. I get the same effect when I manually block the HDD motor. It buzzes and won't start again. Could be an overload problem, or could be that my motorconversion doesn't spin up rapidly enough (accelerates too slowly) ? Who knows.


A 1.3 MB .avi file can be found in the link below. It shows the motor starting up, then stopping. As I turn the PC PSU off and on again it starts up again.


http://www.otherpower.com/images/scimages/3538/brushless_dc_motor_experiment.avi


I may try some other HDD boards as well, maybe they'll work better. If they do, it might be worthwhile to figure out how to modify the boards for variable RPM. If not, I guess I'll have to build a brushless motor driver from scratch.


That's all for today, dear diary. Talk to you again soon.


XXX,


Peter.

« Last Edit: March 16, 2008, 02:05:53 PM by (unknown) »
“Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing.” (W. von Braun)

donald77777

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Re: brushless motor experiment
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2008, 10:29:20 AM »
Talking as a computer repairperson, some HD motors require the fourth electrical pad to be used for the control signal. The motors will spin up but then they will stop after reaching full speed.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2008, 10:29:20 AM by donald77777 »

dinges

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Re: brushless motor experiment
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2008, 10:38:55 AM »
Just tried out another HDD board. This one had the 4 pads as you describe. The motorconversion runs pretty fine on it, but with very little torque; it's easy to stop it from turning by holding the shaft.


Also, this other board seems to turn off power to the motor after -exactly- 60 seconds.


The driver IC is a Hitachi HA13481. Have got the datasheet for it now.


Good fun, but not of much use. Still, might be fun for someone to connect their axial flux generator to an old HDD board and see it run as a motor.


Peter.

« Last Edit: March 16, 2008, 10:38:55 AM by dinges »
“Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing.” (W. von Braun)

tecker

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Re: brushless motor experiment
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2008, 11:07:00 AM »
 Look at the pulse from the driver and match it to the nmagnet position .It's either positive pulses or out of time with the magnet pass.Switch on the neg side of the coil and a  back emf spike will develop  100 volts 0ver battery voltage  take it off with a diode or let it pulse the drive battery no diode.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2008, 11:07:00 AM by tecker »

TheCasualTraveler

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Re: brushless motor experiment
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2008, 11:47:05 AM »
     I don't understand why you felt the need to clean up the work desk. Looks fine to me.

« Last Edit: March 16, 2008, 11:47:05 AM by TheCasualTraveler »

Warrior

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Re: brushless motor experiment
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2008, 05:48:38 AM »
LOL, yup that workbench looks perfectly fine to me too :)
« Last Edit: March 17, 2008, 05:48:38 AM by Warrior »
Why can't Murphy's Law be used to my advantage?

fungus

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Re: brushless motor experiment
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2008, 02:29:14 PM »
Hmm .. I wonder if a computer fan could be used to provide the output .. decides to try it
« Last Edit: March 18, 2008, 02:29:14 PM by fungus »