Author Topic: Windmill project  (Read 2540 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

wellery

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Windmill project
« on: April 11, 2008, 07:59:41 AM »
Hello to All.

This is my first post and here are some pictures of my first windmill project.

It,s 3 phase 10" brake disc alternator with 12 coils and 14 magnets.

I have 60 turns of 18 AWG in coils and 4 coil in series.

I use little different winding style than usually seen in here and I get 12 open DC volts in 60 rpm.s.

Any comments are more than welcome.































« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 07:59:41 AM by (unknown) »

blueyonder

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 184
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2008, 05:35:09 AM »


  great work there wellery.

   you got sum good shots there .  the shack looks great aswell.

    you must have done lots of reading on here. and this is your first post.

   you must be a man of a few words.  but it would be nice if you done a write up about it aswell.

   hope you dont think i am complaining as i just love all them pics.

   i think i must be a comic book reader.(just look at the pics)

    but thanks again wellery .
« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 05:35:09 AM by blueyonder »

TheCasualTraveler

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2008, 06:07:17 AM »
Looks like  great work down to the carved blades and everything.


I don't understand the 14 / 12 three phase setup though.


I only see 2 magnets lining up with a coil at any given time. I would have thought it would need to be 7 phase. But then I have a lot to learn.

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 06:07:17 AM by TheCasualTraveler »

tecker

  • SuperHero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2183
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2008, 07:50:42 AM »
 Clockwise Counter Clockwise winding.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 07:50:42 AM by tecker »

DanB

  • Global Moderator
  • SuperHero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2151
  • Country: us
    • otherpower.com
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2008, 07:56:24 AM »
I'ts very nicely done, thank you for sharing pics.  I do have doubts about how you've wired it.  For one, I think the cutin speed (60 rpm  assuming its for a 12V system) is way too low and that will hurt you, I wonder if it will ever get out of stall.  Secondly - with 18 gage wire the resistance is very high and I worry that because of that, and the cutin speed you'll get very little from it and it might overheat.

I don't see the sense in the 14 magnet/12 coil arrangment...  


I wonder what the diameter of the blades is?  At any rate -  even if it still requires a bit of work you've built a good machine and it's not too far out!

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 07:56:24 AM by DanB »
If I ever figure out what's in the box then maybe I can think outside of it.

wellery

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2008, 09:18:10 AM »
Thanks for comments.

I was going to make same kind of generator as everybody else 9 coils and 12 magnets then

electric engineer who designs generators advice me to do that kind of design and it should be better." who knows"

It is Clockwise Counter Clockwise winding just like in picture.

The blades are 9 foot diameter and I had little overheat problem but now I am working on mppt system witch hopefully allows it run faster.

I measured 10 Amps in high wind but it seem to be to much to the coils.

Sorry my spelling I,m from Finland.

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 09:18:10 AM by wellery »

tecker

  • SuperHero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2183
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2008, 09:56:37 AM »
Worst case cope out the bond between the cw /ccw each phase and use as center tap.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 09:56:37 AM by tecker »

Flux

  • Super Hero Member Plus
  • *******
  • Posts: 6275
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2008, 11:22:54 AM »
Nice work.


I agree with dan that your cut in is desperately low for 12v, it will work much better at 24v and even then it is slow.


I doubt that you gain anything at all by using 4 extra magnets with that strange setup.


For 12 coils you will be better off with 16 poles not 14. At least it does work ( some of the odd combinations are very poor).


Yes if you can get the mppt to work then you will overcome your stall and heating problems.


Flux

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 11:22:54 AM by Flux »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

  • SuperHero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2865
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2008, 01:28:42 PM »
Looks to me like that winding puts the current through more copper than necessary, resulting in higher I2R losses.


Another way to look at is is that you're summing two voltages at a 30 degree phase angle.  Assuming a sine wave you'd be losing about 7% of the voltage (and thus the power at a given current) that you could have gotten from the same amount of copper and magnets in the same coil arrangement, but with twice as many turns of half-the-cross-section wire, connected in a 6-phase system.  (The actual amount would depend on the waveshape, of course.  Perhaps this arrangement would make for a sufficiently flat-topped waveform that you'd do as well, or even better than, the more traditional setup.  But at first cut I'm inclined to doubt it.)


Regardless, I'd expect that adding more magnets in the more traditional style would have more copper under poles, raising the voltage and improving the ratio of power out to stator heating.


I'd love to hear your EE friend describe the logic behind his recommendations.  Could you get him to compose an explanation of what he was trying for?

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 01:28:42 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

Ideal Fabrications

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 16
Many Thanks
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2008, 02:54:25 PM »
Hello Flux,


  You don't know me, and I doubt our paths will cross so being a new person to this site as well as the wind turbine experiance, I would like to say thank you for all your positive and educational comments. If one keeps hisher eyes open, it become quite clear who to lean towards in respect to gathering good information. In the short time I have had the pleasure of  reading your postings, it make me wonder if I could combine my skills with a person of your skills, what a contraption we could fly...

Respectfully,

Don

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 02:54:25 PM by Ideal Fabrications »

Jerry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1519
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2008, 10:12:18 PM »
Hi Wellery.


Very nice looking machine. This gives me insentive to start my 14 magnet 11 coil alt I was about to start a year ago.


I have some larger wedge magnets and they will take up a larger area.


I'm thinking about using 12" discs. 14 magnets with 11 coils.


If you were to rectify each phase seperatly, you would raise cut in and increase amperage out while at the same time reduce heat.


I will most likely be told my idea won't work. What will they say if it does?


                        JK TAS Jerry

« Last Edit: April 11, 2008, 10:12:18 PM by Jerry »

Flux

  • Super Hero Member Plus
  • *******
  • Posts: 6275
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2008, 01:37:03 AM »
Jerry.

As long as you use an even number of poles then if you rectify each coil ( or in phase coil group) separately then I think it will always work, although you will end up using  a lot of diodes in some cases.


Again you are right that he would get better results at 12V if he adopted your idea because the cut in is seriously too low. He doesn't seem to have a star point so it is possible he is already doing this. We don't have his complete connections to see if he is using star.


Flux

« Last Edit: April 12, 2008, 01:37:03 AM by Flux »

wellery

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2008, 02:24:53 AM »
Flux.

I updated that first picture little bit to make it more clear how the windings are made.

There is a star point and I even have a wire out of it.

« Last Edit: April 12, 2008, 02:24:53 AM by wellery »

Flux

  • Super Hero Member Plus
  • *******
  • Posts: 6275
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2008, 03:50:43 AM »
Thanks, that's easier to understand.


Now that you have buried the star point inside the potting you can't connect it as Jerry suggested.


Flux

« Last Edit: April 12, 2008, 03:50:43 AM by Flux »

wellery

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #14 on: April 13, 2008, 11:05:50 AM »
Hello.

Ungrounded Lightning Rod


I can see that you have some very good thoughts and you have put your mind to it.


Here are examined different winding styles.


http://www.ee.lut.fi/en/research/Pia_Salminen.pdf


Wellery.

« Last Edit: April 13, 2008, 11:05:50 AM by wellery »

elvin1949

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 645
Re: Windmill project
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2008, 09:30:16 AM »
Wellery

 Thank you for the pdf.

I downloaded it for further study.It will take me a while to absorb all of the info there.I am not very well educated but getting there.

 Thank you again

later

Elvin
« Last Edit: April 14, 2008, 09:30:16 AM by elvin1949 »