Author Topic: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)  (Read 5693 times)

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SparWeb

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My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« on: October 25, 2009, 10:19:31 PM »
Finally in the air!  What a relief to have the windmill back together and running "on schedule".  


   


   


Here's my data-logger screen (PICLOG: www.thebackshed.com) showing a 20kph wind giving me about 200 watts.  The wind picked up Saturday afternoon and I had it logging for 2 hours when I took the photo.  For the two hours you can seen 450 W-hr collected.  Not bad but it could have been more.  The tail was too light, and furling in the 30 kph gusts!  I lowered the tower again on Sunday, added weight, and sent it back up.  That was also an opportunity to add protective tape to the leading edges of the blades (oops forgot).


This wind turbine replaces the one destroyed in an accident in April.  I'd already collected this 3-phase motor for another conversion, but it was supposed to be in addition to the old GE motor conversion, my first wind turbine.  With the destruction of the GE, I had to get started on this motor conversion as a replacement .


The conversion process required scavenging the magnets from the GE.  There is enough room on the rotor of this one to use the same number of mags.  That offered the promise that this conversion would produce roughly the same amount of power as the GE, too.  Some simple bench tests showed that this was likely to be so.


The blades were damaged in the crash, too, and I decided to make new ones using the one survivor as a template instead of trying to start a new design all over again.  After laminating together a set of boards, I carved two down using the old third as a guide.  There was one drawback to doing this.  The old blades ended up weighing less than the 2 new ones, due to its age and dryness.  Balancing the blades became a tricky question because I would either need a pound of steel counterbalance or have to "tweak" the heavy ones.  In the end I discovered a way to adjust the heavy blades and just get them into balance.  I did so by weighing each blade and finding its center of gravity.  For the blades with more weight near the tip, I shaved them just a little at the tip to remove that weight.  It took a lot of repeated shave-check-shave-again to get it right.  Now I have a well balanced set of blades with no counterweight to cause dynamic imbalance.  Now that it's up and turning, I can see the benefit already.  There is less vibration to feel when I hold on to the tower.


   


   


Fortunately, much of the tower and parts from the old wind turbine mount survived the accident.  I didn't have to build a new generator mount or tail arm.  To bring the tower back into service, I installed a winch for raising and lowering it.  Using the winch makes the process of raising slower, but it affords more opportunity to stop, check on things, and to notice tangled cables.  This happened during one raising with the winch already, so it's already proven its worth.  The winch itself is a worm-gear winch, and it holds the tower in any position with no little pawls or free-spooling levers to get bumped.  Instead of hand-cranking the winch, I have an eye-bolt that I chuck into the power drill, and use the drill to turn the winch much faster than I can by hand.


   


   

« Last Edit: October 25, 2009, 10:19:31 PM by (unknown) »
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adaml

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 06:35:02 AM »
Steven,

Looks very nice indeed.  May I ask what size the blades are and TSR you went for?
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 06:35:02 AM by adaml »

Jason Wilkinson

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2009, 06:40:04 AM »
Hi I like the worm gear winch, how many lbs can it pull, i have a "WARN WORKS 1700 12V DC POWERED WINCH" and is not capable of lifting my turbine off the ground, however it does take over at about 30 to 40 degree with a bit og groaning

 jason
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 06:40:04 AM by Jason Wilkinson »

ghurd

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2009, 07:52:41 AM »
Looks great.

Good to see it flying.

G-
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 07:52:41 AM by ghurd »
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SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2009, 09:15:05 AM »
Thanks for the compliments.


The blades are identical to the blades I made a couple years ago.  The diameter is 8 feet, which was a good match to the converted 3HP motor I had last year, so for this converted 5HP motor I found it didn't really provide any more power, so it's 8-feet again!  


In the process of re-carving I noticed that the root was given an angle that would correspond to a TSR less than 4, while the tips are about 5.  That's an oops on my part a few years ago when I made the first set of blades, but they actually work well on these motor conversions I make.  There may be  a little more "oomph" to get started turning with so much twist.


It's always spinning, even in the lightest breeze.  You can feel the cogs when you turn it by hand, and the blades visibly "step-step-step" to start and stop, but that's no inhibition to turning in any wind that would produce power.


The winch is rated for 2000 pounds, and the manufacturer refers to a safety factor of 4, though I think that's a bit optimistic considering its size.  It's the biggest worm-gear winch in the Acklands catalog.  In my application, I'm putting about 1200 pounds on it just at the start of raising, so my operating safety margin is higher, but not large.  No, I'm not completely fooling myself =)


I had to lower the tower to adjust the tail angle, then after Saturday's wind showed me that the tail was too light, I lowered the tower again to put weights on it.  So in one weekend I raised the tower three times.  The winch performed just fine, but one thing I did notice is how hot the worm gear gets.  The grease would get very liquid at these temperatures and I stopped cranking half-way to re-grease.  Not sure if that's a sign of doom or perfectly normal.  Considering a bigger winch anyway.  

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 09:15:05 AM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
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bob golding

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2009, 10:09:31 AM »
hi jason, if you get a couple of pulley blocks one single and one double that will stop the winch groaning. winches should not groan.


bob

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:09:31 AM by bob golding »
if i cant fix it i can fix it so it cant be fixed.

bj

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2009, 10:12:39 AM »
  Nice Steven.  I hope the evil Wind Gods never visit you again.

  bj
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:12:39 AM by bj »
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Janne

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2009, 10:21:52 AM »
Hello Steven,


Thanks for the update. The new turbine looks at least as super as the old one.

The new winch should be pretty good for the job.. with that it will pretty much impossible to crash the tower :)


I wonder if you will need to balance the rotor again, when the moisture content on the blades even up?

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:21:52 AM by Janne »
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Flux

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2009, 10:33:53 AM »
"In the process of re-carving I noticed that the root was given an angle that would correspond to a TSR less than 4, while the tips are about 5.  That's an oops on my part a few years ago when I made the first set of blades, but they actually work well on these motor conversions I make.  There may be  a little more "oomph" to get started turning with so much twist.


It's always spinning, even in the lightest breeze.  You can feel the cogs when you turn it by hand, and the blades visibly "step-step-step" to start and stop, but that's no inhibition to turning in any wind that would produce power."


As long as the outer 2/3 of the blade is correct I don't think the inner third matters much. If you use more twist or chord to help start up the only real downside is that you use more expensive wood.


Unless cog is very bad I don't consider it anything like as bad as most people think. The thing will almost always rock off in the end. The real killer at start up is iron loss and a perfectly cog free machine with too much iron loss will crawl but not pick up speed in low winds. Too high a flux density or poor grade iron is more of a problem than cog. Single rotor axials with bad laminated core material can also be difficult to start and they don't cog.


Flux

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:33:53 AM by Flux »

imsmooth

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2009, 10:46:14 AM »
You have such a nice unobstructed site.  What is your tower height?
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:46:14 AM by imsmooth »

SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2009, 11:25:02 AM »
Some day I should stand on the east side and take a picture facing west...  totally different situation.  It's 45' tall, based on the tower described on the Otherpower website.  The trees around the house were 30' tall when I started this project 4 years ago.  They're about 35' tall this year...  At this rate I only have 8 years left before I have taise a taller tower!
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 11:25:02 AM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
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SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2009, 11:33:06 AM »
"I wonder if you will need to balance the rotor again, when the moisture content on the blades even up?"


I wonder about that, too.  I wish I had made 3 new blades, and kept the old one on the shelf.  That would have SAVED some work, due to the balancing and to the tweaking of the twist, since I hadn't carved according to my paper templates.




Here's more about the carving on my personal page.


Sorry there are some broken links on the page that I only just discovered, but it mostly works anyway.

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 11:33:06 AM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
www.sparweb.ca

ghurd

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2009, 05:09:34 PM »
"You can feel the cogs when you turn it by hand, and the blades visibly "step-step-step" to start and stop,

but that's no inhibition to turning in any wind that would produce power."


Should be somewhere in the FAQs.  :)

G-

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 05:09:34 PM by ghurd »
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behoof

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2009, 07:13:39 PM »
Steven,


Great job, thanks for the pictures.


Now look what you've done !!


I have to get back to work on mine, can't have the neighbors up and mine NOT.


Good job,

Skip

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 07:13:39 PM by behoof »
They're in the wire!!

SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2009, 09:12:55 PM »
Oh great, there's a storm front coming in tonight between midnight and 1 AM.  Guess who won't be getting any sleep tonight!  

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 09:12:55 PM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
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SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2009, 10:19:40 PM »
Well the storm came early, so I can report that all's well, with about 60kph up there (35mph or so).  The tail is just about to furl in these gusts - a little fast but there's little I can do about it now.


I think the stator reactance is already limiting the output below 15 amps.  I can't be sure until I look over the PICLOG data tomorrow, but the analog gauge isn't going much higher than 12A.


For the sake of knowing what happens, I hit the "kill" switch.  Not a lot happened except it made less noise, indicating that it was running a little slower.  This isn't a big surprise, because the stator resistance across phases is 3.5 ohms.  Not much of a "short", is it?


Last years' generator, running in parallel-delta had a stator phase resistance of about 1.2 ohm, so there was much more authority at the kill switch because the shorted current was proportionately higher.


Well, unless I resorted to re-winding the stator wires, I couldn't expect much better.  This project wouldn't be finished this year if I'd tried doing that.  My one remaining theory about motor conversions is the construction of the rotor and trying to re-use these squirrel cage rotors by turning them down on a lathe.  Though the magnets stick frimly I'm thinking that the flux circuit isn't the best.  Re-making the rotor, with thick cylinders of iron to plunk the magnets onto, is the way to go.


I have little to complain about because this old motor was (like the others) free, the magnets were scavenged from the old crashed genny, and the shop time to re-work the rotor was also free.  It's running well in both light and moderate winds, which is where 90% of my wind is anyway.


Will post data when it becomes available...

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:19:40 PM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
www.sparweb.ca

SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2009, 10:25:21 PM »
Oops I meant the old GE generator ran in "Parallel-Star".  I never tried it in P-Delta.

« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 10:25:21 PM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
www.sparweb.ca

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2009, 07:21:14 PM »
Right.  Cogging is only an issue if it causes startup to be at wind speeds above cutin.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2009, 07:21:14 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2009, 07:24:21 PM »
Being reactance-limited below burnout currents means you only need furling to keep it from tearing itself up in a hurricane.  If that's the situation, terrific!
« Last Edit: October 27, 2009, 07:24:21 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

SparWeb

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Re: My New Wind Turbine (Much Like The Last One)
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2009, 12:27:04 PM »
I've been entertaining the notion of locking the tail so it won't furl...

Don't encourage me!  =)
« Last Edit: October 28, 2009, 12:27:04 PM by SparWeb »
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it. Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.
System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, Xantrex C40, DIY 10ft (3m) diameter wind turbine, Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024
www.sparweb.ca