Author Topic: Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights (CCCFL)  (Read 4717 times)

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Clifford

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Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights (CCCFL)
« on: February 05, 2006, 06:30:02 AM »
Just browsing again,


I found a good comparison of different types of lights (lumens / watt)


http://www.rpc.com.au/products/lights/Lighting-Efficiency-Chart.pdf


The highest rated lights are the Cold Cathode Compact Fluroscent Lights at 76 lumens / watt (50% more than the CFLs, and 5 times as much as the LED's).


http://www.rpc.com.au/products/lights/compactfluoro/coldcathode.html


Apparently these are a type of thin-tube CFL.  Rainbow has them in Reflector and non reflector versions which is nice.


Unfortunately, I am having troubles finding other sources of 12V CCFL "screw-in" light bulbs, and they are $28 EACH from Rainbow...  (oh, maybe that is Australian Dollars  :D )


Perhaps that is a reason to use LED's for "spotlights"...  they are dirt cheap.

« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 06:30:02 AM by (unknown) »

scottsAI

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Re: Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights CCCFL
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2006, 02:10:05 PM »
Interesting chart Clifford.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lighting_efficiency

More complete chart, also in keeping with my experience with lighting.


CCCFL is or works the same as florescent lights, I have never seen one reported to be more efficient than a CFL or florescent light. I don't think I would trust the report.

Now if they were explaining they had a better drive system to achieve the higher efficiency then I may accept their numbers. Or some explanation of why theirs is better...


What I have seen is the larger florescents will have the better lumen/watt than the smaller. 30-60w.


CCFL is used as internal lighting in PC mod kits, if you look at the current draw along with light output you can see they are not as good as CFL. Mostly due to the electronic drivers used. Cheap.


Considering Base line efficiency is great but, when adding in the cost the numbers can change. Depends on goals. For very limited applications a 12v light can be the best choice.

For others inverter + $2 CFL makes for a better deal.


The link above has a 3w LED at 65 lumen/watt, I wonder if the 5w LED will be better?


I used a 12v CFL in the entry way to a hunting lodge, where the inverter was.

Maybe I will change it over to a 3w LED!

Rest of the lighting is inverter + 120v CFL (14) + LED night lights.

The choice was:

15 * $14 = $210 (best price for 12v CFL 11w, smaller than I wanted)

$14 + 14 * $2 + $28 = $70, one third of the cost.  120v CFL were 14 -22w.

Not quite as efficient, but the 10% loss could be tolerated.

The price difference paid for the 24w solar panel, battery and charging controller.

Used on weekends, recharged during the week. Not a typical application.

Inverter off at night and most of the day.

Have fun,

Scott.

« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 02:10:05 PM by scottsAI »

Clifford

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Re: Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights(CCFL)
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2006, 07:10:11 PM »
Tried running 120V lights off of an inverter for a while.  It was a hassle to head down to the basement at night to turn off the power, and then heading down there to turn it back on the next day (often in the dark).


12V is easier to deal with, just flick the switch.


Of course, CFL's and CCFL's all run on small microinverters.


There are a few 5W LEDs on E-Bay.  They claim that they put off 90-120 lumens (18 to 24 lumens / watt).



  1. W LEDs are showing up at 20-40 lumens.  
  2. W LEDs are up to 60 Lumens...  (20 lumens / watt).


There seems to be a lot of variability in reported LED power with colored glass cutting down the power significantly.


It probably would be worth doing a side-by-side comparison, perhaps with an old photographic meter taking readings in a couple of places (or, perhaps a solar cell/panel would work just as well as a meter).

« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 07:10:11 PM by Clifford »

scottsAI

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Re: Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights(CCFL)
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2006, 08:29:48 PM »
Clifford,

This is a fun problem with many solutions.

Using 12v lamps is definitely one of them.


Have you considered putting the inverter on a timer?

Then you wont have to go turn it on.

If you don't keep a schedule, how about a remote switch?


I have a 2kw 12v inverter, the on / off switch controls little current.

Very easy to put a remote switch. 12V Relay...

If opening the inverter is not to your liking.

Use a solenoid plunger to press the switch on / off for you.

Much cheaper than using 12v lamps.


I have run across much miss-information about LED and other lighting.

One problem with LED lighting is the light comes out in a small cone.

Other lighting is full circle, so if someone reports the output of LED how was it measured?

Not fair to report it only in the cone...

I do like the LED for a flashlight, which I use in the dark.

Found the shake light to be fake.

Have fun,

Scott.

« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 08:29:48 PM by scottsAI »

BT Humble

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Re: Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights(CCFL)
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2006, 02:40:21 PM »


Found the shake light to be fake.



The shakey lights work as advertised, but if you see someone shaking one they look a bit vulgar!


BTH

« Last Edit: February 06, 2006, 02:40:21 PM by BT Humble »

TomW

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ShakeLight...
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2006, 02:48:15 PM »
Scott;


Our shakelight works great. Calling it a "flashlight" is a bit of a stretch but it beats hell out of no light.


Cheers.


TomW

« Last Edit: February 06, 2006, 02:48:15 PM by TomW »

dinges

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2006, 04:33:53 PM »
You should compare the output not to flashlights but to e.g. a Photon microlight. That's more in the area. Calling it a flashlight creates an image of 6D-cell mag-lights...


I consider the shake-lights to be nice gadgets, and have one, but prefer the photon that's permanently on the key chain. (plus the spare one in the other pocket ;) )


Peter.

« Last Edit: February 06, 2006, 04:33:53 PM by dinges »
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scottsAI

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2006, 12:59:53 AM »
Hello Humble, TomW,


I have two, took one apart.

There are two CR2032 batteries in there.

This is a primary battery as in NOT rechargeable.

Removing the batteries, the light does flash on, but you have to keep it going very fast to get any light out of it. Just opened it again to verify the battery.


I did this after, leaving it on for 1:20.

If it was a shake light it should have gone out after 20 min or so...


What have you done to verify it is real?

Think I will try a crank light next. Suppose to charge your cell phone to.

Have fun,

Scott.

« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 12:59:53 AM by scottsAI »

ghurd

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2006, 07:50:58 AM »
There are a flood of semi different shaky lights now.

I have 2 or 3 brands, AA size, which were all promptly dismantled. None of these have a battery. All use caps. None makes too much light. At the max charge, the light output falls off very fast at 30 seconds or so. At 2 or 3 minutes the LED is on, but you have to look into it to tell.


I'll stay with a decent AA LED flashlight. A lot brighter and easier. The batteries should last me for a few years, if they don't get put in the camera like usual.

G-

« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 07:50:58 AM by ghurd »
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scottsAI

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2006, 01:42:02 PM »
I agree.

When the batteries die, I may pull the magnet and put two AA inside, looks like should fit. The two CR2032 are +3v each, when loaded the voltage drops to 3.15v, so two AA should still work.


Harbor freight tools has a 3 cell 4 LED flashlight for $5, think I will get one.

Have fun,

Scott.

« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 01:42:02 PM by scottsAI »

ghurd

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2006, 04:08:40 PM »
Don't waste the $5!
« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 04:08:40 PM by ghurd »
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ghurd

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2006, 04:15:24 PM »
I should add to that.  

If you turn it on before bed, and in the morning if you have 3 LEDs still working, you got the cream of the crop.  If 2 are still working at bedtime that night... It was 'creme de la creme'.

I took the batteries out of them at 12 hours. No use wasting good batteries any more than that.

G-
« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 04:15:24 PM by ghurd »
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scottsAI

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2006, 10:09:06 PM »
I take it you bought some cheap LED flashlights?

Scott.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 10:09:06 PM by scottsAI »

ghurd

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Re: ShakeLight...
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2006, 11:15:37 AM »
LOL!  Literally hundreds. Occupation related.

Cost doesn't seem related to quality with LED flashlights. A decent light at a good price is the $10 Brinkman (2AA, side by side, short & fat, silver & black, #809-1050-0) available at the local Wally-World.  Lasts longer and makes more light than some $60 LED flshlights. Batteries last about 55 hours. The more normal looking brinkman is 'fragile'.

G-
« Last Edit: February 08, 2006, 11:15:37 AM by ghurd »
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AbyssUnderground

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Re: Cold Cathode Compact Fluorescent Lights (CCCF
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2006, 01:02:50 PM »
I use an 8" cold cathode tube as tent lighting when camping. It only draws half an amp and happily lights up an 8 manned trailer tent. I can run it for over 20 hours on a 17.2Ah lead acid battery. I use a 1.5w trickle solar panel to keep the battery topped up during the trip and charge it on the car every few days or when we go out.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2006, 01:02:50 PM by AbyssUnderground »