Author Topic: Will a PMA shock me  (Read 2112 times)

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HomegrownPower

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Will a PMA shock me
« on: October 30, 2007, 10:00:51 PM »
Hey guys I know I asked to many dumb questions but figured I maybe ought to ask one more .

This thing can't shock me if it's not turning can it ?  lol  I remember reading some electronic stuff can bite you even after it was unplugged and wanted to be sure .

Thanks

Lonnie
« Last Edit: October 30, 2007, 10:00:51 PM by (unknown) »

AbyssUnderground

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2007, 05:18:30 PM »
Unless it has caps attatched to it, no. Things that shock you after being unplugged either build up a high amount of static or have charged capacitors still. However if you get shocked from the mains plug, something is wrong. Power should not back flow out of the plug.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2007, 05:18:30 PM by AbyssUnderground »

TomW

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2007, 05:28:17 PM »
homegrown;


In a word no. Of course it only applies to the alternator itself. Other devices connected to it could give you a nip. Most of the units described here need to be truly screaming fast to be dangerous. Hand turning or testing unlikely to shock much.


Cheers.


TomW

« Last Edit: October 30, 2007, 05:28:17 PM by TomW »

Flux

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2007, 01:36:41 AM »
The PMA will not shock you if it is not turning, but don't fall into the trap of thinking a nominal 12v PMA will be safe when running off load. In high winds some of the tiny 12v wind alternators will produce hundreds of volts if you loose the load.


I think you realised that when you said " not turning".


Flux

« Last Edit: October 31, 2007, 01:36:41 AM by Flux »

HomegrownPower

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2007, 12:37:11 PM »
Thanks guys I thought I was safe as long as it wasn't turning to fast .



I got to looking for ways to use " all this free gas "  and I haven't even got it yet . I have a gas water heater on the back porch though lol . A good gas stove ect , ect , I'm ready for it with the exception of a few things . We have citizens gas now  but really can't afford to use it much we supplement with wood . Getting ready to use this gas got me to thinking " How can I make out using this stuff " lol hell lets be honest thats how I ended up here .



I've already build a couple small kiln / blast furnace things  one real small one and a bigger one in a 55 gal barrel yea you guess it " GAS FIRED " . Then I got the idea of a gas fired engine making me some electric and ended up here with a lot of big ideas and no knowledge of what I even needed . I jumped right in and had to have something so I bought big magnets and wire and will build something wether it's what I need or not . I desided to just go with a wind PMA to start with and learn somethings . However in the PMA building process/thinking process I'm not sure thats my best choise .


















I drive across this bridge everyday . Most the time the water is just setting in puddles a few feet deep and looks like it sets still . It's down to a trickle now but were going through a record drought this year . This is the first year in 14 that the creek dried up . I'll have to wait till next month to measure any amount of water comming over my little rock wall . Once it does it will flow plenty of water for 9 to 10 months . It usually does slow way down in late summer but most years is already flowing by now .








It's a violent little crick though . Average it may only poor 6 maybe 8 inches of water over the complete rock wall about 12 perhaps 15 feet wide . But at times like an hour after a down poor it can be almost to the bottom of the bridge . I have seen it up over the bridge and under that storage trailer setting there . The water has never failed us . I built the wall and run my water line above ground on the solid bed rock . It's never froze in winter for 14 years now .










I'm now starting to think of a water wheel to drive a PMA not wind . If I can ever tap into my gas to produce  electrical power well find . But I can count on more water than wind in my location . probably 10 fold more days of running water .

Problems I can see now  .

Wheel will have to float somehow to prevent it from going underwater when the water level changes .

A lot of crapp goes down this small crick ,  everything from logs to kids bycicles .

I think a way to channel water to a small gate could be built in such a way as to prevent most of the floating debree from going into the wheel .

Permits , any legal ussues that have to be delt with to do a run of the river type hydro electric project .

Distance from house . On a tall enough tower I could put the tower next to my house making shorter wires . From my house to the crick is about 200 ft .

The way I see it water would be a bigger pain in the rear to construct and to get permits and so on but it would still be my best bet  for 24 hour a day pma turning .I wouldn't have to worry about wearing out engines just let the wheel turn continiously . Just turning a floating wheel about 6 to 8 feet high and running about a one  inch shaft to a PMA up on the bank . Looks like you could get some killer RPM's using a pullie  the size of the wheel and small pullie on the PMA .

I can research most things but I found a cool little wheel someone built to pump water to a cabin  here on this site once lol Can't find it now :(   The guy built one to flimzy but it worked good enough he built a better one .

Anyone know how to find this again I'll save it to favorites this time ?

Plus any info on where to look or contact to find out federal, state , local regulations governing hydro electric for Tenn .  Looked once but was in a hurry and didn't find much on it other that TVA and plenty of big plants no info for permits things like that .

Any help is much appreachated the PMa is comming along good THANKS

« Last Edit: October 31, 2007, 12:37:11 PM by HomegrownPower »

HomegrownPower

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2007, 12:47:34 PM »
Sorry I ment to explain the first two pics . The first one is my free gas if they ever get it all burried and the taps in . That pic shows it going across my neighbor lol In the second pic I'm standing on my property on the line they have it burried on me with new grass comming up . But it's lible to be next spring before I see my free gas :(

Lonnie

« Last Edit: October 31, 2007, 12:47:34 PM by HomegrownPower »

Ponderance

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2007, 11:58:33 PM »
Homegrown, as I understand it, you get a free gas tap for compensation of the gas line running a span across your property.


My question is this:  Why not create a homegrown (sorry for the pun) steam gen. that makes use of the 'free gas' tap? (similar to this one here -- http://geothermal.marin.org/geopresentation/images/img038.jpg )


Granted, the task would be a bit more difficult than a wind turbine, but it would undoubtedly be a huge contribution as opposed to just venting it to a normal water heater....  just a thought.  And it would also be quite as opposed to a gasoline-converted-natural gas engine....


Other variations of steam turbines:  http://library.thinkquest.org/C006011/english/sites/dampfturbine.php3?v=2

« Last Edit: November 02, 2007, 11:58:33 PM by Ponderance »

HomegrownPower

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2007, 04:47:38 PM »
Ponderance

If they ever get the line done I'm suppost to get it free . They will get it done someday lol . We dickered over the gas for a few months . Then they said they would and we dickered over the papers we signed lol . Finally we reached an agreement we both could live with .

You know some type of steam sounds like an idea . Would be easy to boil water with gas and I plan to convert to heating water outside and pumping water through the house at sometime . Quite is nice also .

 The pain with wind is ( no supply ) maybe a few good months a year . Water we would have most of the year but I have no interest in getting permits and what ever they want to use my own crick .

Steam is sounding good thanks for the url I'm going to check it out now . I'm still working on the PMA right now but will figure some way of using gas to turn it  . Figured my wire would be here by now but no still in the mail somewhere .

Thanks
Lonnie
« Last Edit: November 03, 2007, 04:47:38 PM by HomegrownPower »

Ponderance

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2007, 07:17:09 PM »
sorry for going off topic on your post, it was a spur of the moment thing that was sparked by your earlier comment in the same thread on the gas ;)


either way, i don't know what kind of rainy seasons you have, maybe use a collection system like rain gutters and bulk storage tanks for the "raw steam" water needed?


again, i really do apologize for going off topic =(

« Last Edit: November 03, 2007, 07:17:09 PM by Ponderance »

wdyasq

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2007, 06:01:42 AM »
There is a very good reason the entire industrial world went from steam to internal combustion engines. As far as I know there are no SMALL steam components still available at reasonable costs.


I think  lot of folks are selling 'dreams' and raking a good percentage off the top from the fools buying them. I realize steam sounds a bit romantic. The sound of an exploding steam boiler is a bit louder and is not very romantic retrieving injured or dead pets and family members. There are very good reasons all industrial steam operations require certified boilers and regular recertification. Above a certain level, certified operators are required.


Just a bit to think about before you commit to steam.


Ron

« Last Edit: November 06, 2007, 06:01:42 AM by wdyasq »
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HomegrownPower

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2007, 07:34:17 PM »
lol shesh is their anything safe enough Ron ?? Next I guess you will say  the free gas probably wouldn't be worth the risk the hidden dangers expose us to  . Fact is I accept the risks I take in life and so should you . If you don't take certain risk thats ok as thats your choise but please let me take the ones I feel ok with . Some people fear the risk of walking outside and stay in the house  depending on others to do for them ( deal with life ) take a chance is my motto



Steam or hot water will be used in heating my house we will eventually remove the stove from inside the house . Heat water and then pipe the hot water / steam into the house . This should be safer than a fire in the house and be better for the breathing .



I'm not sure why steam went out but I'm sure you can find a formula explaining it's demise to me . Fact is all them numbers are not what some crack them  up to be lol All I can say is that Steams going to rise again lmao in certain areas of the south  lol . As a out side heating system is in the planning now . So like someone mentioned in another post , " buy old steam equipment " will probably be the road I go . I kinda like the idea of two cookers on one burner anyhow lol



May you all have juice made from steam lol

« Last Edit: November 14, 2007, 07:34:17 PM by HomegrownPower »

zeusmorg

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2007, 10:01:08 PM »
 You're getting access to free gas? of what type? If it's natural gas, converting an existing gasoline internal combustion engine to use it typically is rather simple.

Most gas engines will run off of it easily with a simple jet installed into the intake stream, however increasing the compression, and re-adjusting the timing will create more efficiency. That would be a LOT easier than building a steam engine. Also a lot safer. The pressures involved in steam engines are high, and DANGEROUS! The only downside to what I describe is this isn't R.E. You can also buy gensets that run off of CNG without building the system yourself.

 Your hydro-electric idea has merit, what you need to do is find out your flow rate available and head. (flow rate in gallons per minute and head is the distance you can create the water falling vertically. The easiest way to utilize hydro is to create a diversion dam, which will also filter out debris. then pipe it to your hydroelectric system. There is a lot of information circulating about hydroelectric design so a simple google search should turn up tons of info. http://www.homepower.com/files/featured/IntroToHydroPower.pdf
« Last Edit: November 14, 2007, 10:01:08 PM by zeusmorg »

ghurd

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Re: Will a PMA shock me
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2007, 07:34:22 AM »
"In practice, a steam engine exhausting the steam to atmosphere will have an efficiency (including the boiler) of 1% to 8%"- Wiki


Just for heating use, stuck valves, worn parts, rust, maintenance...

Or change the filter 3 times a year for a furnace, maybe oil the blower motor every decade if I remember.


Just my take on it.

G-

« Last Edit: November 15, 2007, 07:34:22 AM by ghurd »
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