Rogue Waves and Quantum Mechanics

[finnsawyer]

I was watching a program on the tube about rogue waves at sea.  Mariners have reported these things for years, but scientists had denied their existence because they didn't fit the linear wave models.  Basically, in a storm with seas running at 40 feet a wave of 100 ft height would sometimes appear.  The linear wave models suggested you might see one of these every 10,000 years.  You just couldn't get the energy into the wave.  Well, one day an oil platform was being buffeted by forty foot waves when suddenly a 100 foot wave smashed into it.  The platform had a device to record wave heights.  All of a sudden there was incontrovertible proof.  Now they had to explain these things.  Well, it appeared that if a sea was running contrary to a strong current such waves could occur.  Case closed or so they thought.  Then two cruise ships in the Southern Ocean were subjected to such waves on successive days.  One was nearly sunk.  No strong current there.  Well, researchers had found that Schrodinger's non linear wave equation predicted such behavior.  When the profile from the oil platform wave was compared to the theoretical Quantum results, it was an exact match.  Quantum Mechanics provided a mechanism for the large energy to become focused in such a wave.  Subsequent satellite radar studies have detected these waves in the World's Oceans.  They are finite in extent, appear for a while, and then disappear.  

I suspect we're going to be hearing a lot more about this.  It would appear that systems of energy flow having waves could exhibit this behavior.  An obvious candidate is the atmosphere.  Many atmospheric phenomena such as wind gusts, micro bursts, thunderstorms, tornadoes, and maybe even ball lightning may get going thanks to this process. What this does is introduce an element of randomness into processes that we thought were predictable.

This brings me to the following observation.  Scientists discount human observation, believing it to be unreliable.  Unless they can build a machine to measure the phenomenon it just doesn't exist.  In many cases human observation is all that exists.  The above example shows the limitations of such an attitude.  Denying the existence of rogue waves has probably cost many lives, not to mention the loss of many ships, as steps were not taken to design ships to survive such waves.  One wonders what other macroscopic phenomena the existence of which is either denied or poorly understood may be influenced by Quantum Mechanics.    

[DanG]

Can't pass up the opportunity to share a rouge wave experience.

First time I saw Lake Superior I just had to go explore the first gravel beach I came across. I could see at least a half-mile either way up the coast line and the water was sparkling in the sun with 'egg-carton' pyramid chop, the swells breaking on the beach were making 12-16 inch waves. I was busy hunting for agate and had squatted down about 8 feet from the breaking waves when a rouge wave flopped up onto shore. Next thing I knew it had spun me around & pushed me over onto my back & covered me up to my neck with 4 inches of water OVER my chest. The water draining through the gravel glued me down sputtering until it drained down into 1-3 inch gravel on the beach. I sat stunned on the beach, scanning up and down the coast for any other large waves but all was calm and serene, the small chop in afternoon sun looking every bit like the lake was giggling.

Having grown up near the Atlantic I'd gauge that wave to be one metre or more in height so easily 4 times the height of normal surf. I stayed out on the beach another 90 minutes and found some neat iron-graphite & agate specimens but didn't spot any more 'rouge waves'. That's all, the whole story. So now you tell me it really was a superior "quantum" baptism, eh?

Now let's find the equivalent mechanism w/ flux and air core coils and harvest some rouge power!

[terry5732]

I think it has to do with resonance.

I have seen these "Superior " waves on nearly every excursion to the lake. I have a neat picture of my son as a toddler getting blasted - but it isn't digital. You have various wave speeds in the vast expanse. Occasionally they concur in cycle as the fast overtakes the slow and temporarily they are cumulative. And sometimes you may have three or more concur ! Virtually any time you sit for a while on the Lake Superir beach you will see occasional larger waves that don't match the cycle / size of 99%. These are offshore waves of a different speed combined with the inshore ones. Had they not run into the inshore cycle you would have hardly noticed them.

The same can be done with AC. You could tie two lines of 120V 60Hz for either 240V 60Hz or 120V 120 Hz depending on  you waveform matching. Or if in the case of two windmills with slightly varying cycles you tie them, you can get wild variations of voltage ! You may have mostly say 24 Volts with occasional 48 Volt spikes ! This is if you were combining ACs. With DC, you know what you would get all the time. Hmmmm.... is DC really a square "wave" ?

[hiker]

may have been a huge freighter-far out on the lake...

their bow waves are quite large--and they just keep on going tell they hit shore..

me thinks...........

[wooferhound]

Everytime I have been on the ocean beach I noticed a pattern in the waves. Something like, every 14th wave would be about twice as big as normal. My dad even pointed this out to me when I was learning to Body Surf.

[finnsawyer]

It's not a resonance phenomena.  Resonance is linear, this is not.  The rogue wave has the same width as the waves that occur before it and after it.  Draw a nice sine wave pattern.  Now increase the height of one crest by 2.5 times.  Also lower the heights of the waves immediately before it and after it (the energy has to come from somewhere).  Finally, for good measure increase the depth of the trough just before the wave.  This is basically the profile of the sea having the rogue wave.  The energy in this new pattern is spread over a band or spectrum of frequencies instead of one frequency.  This can only happen through a non linear process.  That's where Quantum Theory comes in.  It allows for a random transfer of energy in a non linear way.  There is also more energy in these waves than can be generated by the simple addition of two waves.

When a ship encounters one of these waves it noses down into the trough, the bow enters the wave, and before the ship can come back up the wave breaks over the bridge, breaking the windows.  The result is that the ship's electronic systems are damaged or knocked out.  This is what happened to the two ships in the Southern Ocean (on different days).  One of the ships also lost its engine, resulting in a very anxious period until they got the engine restarted.  

 

[finnsawyer]

I've spent many happy hours haunting the shores of Lake Superior over the years, and have never had quite the experience you've had.  Of course, I keep one eye on the wave action so as to keep my feet dry.  It's too bad you didn't see that wave coming so as to have a report on its length.  The rogue waves that have been seen from space are not very long.  Maybe Superior was just giving you its baptism.

This past summer during a thunderstorm a micro burst passed through my yard.  I know this because as it went past the house and barn it tore branches off of trees.  Just pass the barn it knocked over a good sized aspen and a balsam.  The entire path of destruction was ten to fifteen feet wide.  Fortunately the trees didn't fall toward the barn and no large branches hit my truck.  As I see it, this whole idea of rogue waves in the atmosphere is not so much trying to get energy from them as it is to keep them from destroying what we build.  Unfortunately, it still is basically a crap shoot, as to where these things will hit.  But now, maybe, we can understand why they happen.