Author Topic: solar panel output  (Read 2431 times)

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wiredwrong

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solar panel output
« on: May 14, 2007, 02:40:05 AM »
my daughters science experiment is "How does the angle of the sun affect output of a solar panel", OK no problem, I have several small cells from solar lights, we put panels on radios and on fans and had a other panels conected to "AA' baterries to measure current, here's where things went bad, the only meter I had that would measure dc current bit the dust, has anyone here measured the output of these panels through out the day? If so, can I borrow some numbers from you? Its due tommorow morning and as of now all I was able to get her to measure was voltage, and make observations on the fan and radio. I would really like some current readings, they do not need to be exact just meassured between 9-5 in full sun, every hour, but if someone here has that data from one of their expirements, Ill adapt it to fit our project. thanks Randy31
« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 02:40:05 AM by (unknown) »

commanda

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2007, 09:16:58 PM »
Use a small series resistor, and measure the voltage drop across the resistor.


Ohms law;


I = E / R


current = voltage divided by resistance.


I do this all the time bacause if you over-current the current input on the meter it lets all the magic smoke out.


Generally multimeters are relatively immune to over-voltage. And if you choose the resistor really carefully it can act as a fuse, or at least glow red as a warning light. Even gives off nice smoke signals sometimes.


Also, choose a resistor which is a multiple of 10.


eg: a 1 ohm resistor will drop 1mV per mA.

a 10 ohm resistor will drop 10mV per mA.

a 100 ohm resistor will...... should get the idea by now.


Amanda

« Last Edit: May 13, 2007, 09:16:58 PM by commanda »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2007, 01:06:43 AM »
the only meter I had that would measure dc current bit the dust,


Is this a digital multimeter?  Like maybe with a 10 A scale that you have to move the probe to a special jack to use?  And is it just that setting that's dead?


If so, open the battery hatch and look for a little fuse.  It's blown.  There will probably be a spare fuse in a little plastic bag next to it.  Swap that in and your meter will be back up.  (At least until you put more than 10A through it again.)


If there IS a fuse but no spare, you can get a couple more of it while you're down at radio shack picking up the 1/10 ohm, 1 ohm, and 10 ohm resistors to use for the hack Amanda described.

« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 01:06:43 AM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

wpowokal

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2007, 05:10:57 AM »
« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 05:10:57 AM by wpowokal »
A gentleman is man who can disagree without being disagreeable.

nothing to lose

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2007, 07:49:25 AM »
What's wrong with your meter, totaly dead, not working on just amps, ran over by a truck?

 I probably can't help with the solar amps problems. I would measure a 15watt HF panel today for you but I am in woods, can't set one up and just leave it all day 9-5 as it will be in the shade allot, early in morning and after about 3pm unless I move it around. I have mine set to catch the best sun, about 11-3 when sun is nearly straight up, other times they get partly shaded and that messes up your readings, so would moving it.

Looks like it might be a decent day today, so I'll try to find a spot to test 1 panel better. So check back tonight, maybe I can post you some readings? I go set one up now.


Here's a couple ideas to check out your meter, maybe you can fix it quick. Stuff that goes wrong with mine.


If your meter is like mine, a cheapo, I buy allot of those to keep laying around in vehicles and such, maybe this will help fix the meter.


If your meter is not working at all check the batteries, most are a 9V square type, make sure it's not dead of course and snaped on tight. If the 2-3 AA batteries make sure they are all ok and making good connection.

What ever type batteries, check on the circuit board at the power input pins and see if your getting the voltage you should. If you can't check voltage cause this is your only meter, just find some low volt item like a tiny DC motor or small bulb and touch the leads to the pins, it should run or if a low volt bulb light up. I have found a broke wire in the 9 volt connecter before and a bad wire or connetor in the AA types also, so with good batteries the meter still did not have power.


If the meter is working, turning on, but not reading anything, check your test leads of course. With some of the cheapies I have had a broke wire, or even the test end just falls off. Set to continuty test and touch leads together, if nothing then unplug one wire and poke around in that hole with the other lead still plugged in, you should get a conection. If the meter shows the conection then do the other lead.


If the meter was out in the rain or dropped in a bucket of water, it won't work while wet. Take back off and sit in warm sunny spot to dry, it should be fine later, mine normally are once all the water is out and it dries. Sometimes I forget and leave one laying in the back of a P/U truck so I KNOW that one well :)


If the circuit board has cruddy looking stuff anywhere brush it well with a dry toothebrush. If needed use rubbing alcohol or preferably Denataured if you have some.


If lCD diplay was knocked loose, put it back in place, it should work. It's just a press fit with a little white/grey rubber looking strip between it and the crcuit board. If LCD is showing goofey looks not readings, take meter apart and wipe LCD clean with soft dry rag and put it back in, also wipe the rubber strip gently one contact ends, it may work perfect again, mine do.


The twist dail on front of meter has 1 or 2 steel balls that pop into holes as you turn it, the click feel that holds it on a setting. It also has a small copper strip that contacts the circuit board to chose the settings. Don't loose the balls or strips, take out the circuit board and clean the contacts, clean the copper strips, make sure balls are still in there and put back together, that fixes some things. If the meter is working but not reading on 1 or 2 settings that could be it.


If a better meter you may have a fuse for the amps setting as mentioned by others. If the same type cheapy I use allot there is no amps fuse. I think there is a fuse inside but it's not for amps, at least when I run 115 amps though my meters it never blows! I just smoke the leads abit insead of blowing the fuse. Ya, sometimes I forget to check the meter leads and I was using it to test amps on something, then I set it to DC Volts and check a 115amp battery to see it's voltage, hot wire!!!

  It normally takes a few times doing that before I burn out a lead, I remove it real fast when I make that mistake! If you have done something like that check the leads good, mine normally burn out the NEG lead on the meter side, looks fine but a broke wire inside right at the plug.


I rarely have a meter not working that's not one of the above, but they do screw up or just die at times, something above normally  fixes the average problems though.

« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 07:49:25 AM by nothing to lose »

nothing to lose

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2007, 10:07:42 AM »
Well I only got open volts and short circuit amps so far, looking for a load to use. I'm charging small SLA batteries today with 1 15watt HF solar panel, as the battery charges the Volts will change and also load in amps will change. Being a small battery it grabs a surface charge and that may distort readings. I'll see what I have for a 12V fan not in use. I mean time I'll disconnect the battery to do open and short readings for ya. Hopefully I can stay home all day today, I plan to do allot around here and not go anywhere at the moment.


So far, 9:30 Am 22V open, 0.63Amps short circuit.  10:30Am 20V open, 0.66A Short.


Since I don't have any one place the sun shines all day long without being blocked by trees I put the HF pannel laying on the mini-van roof for this test. Proped up a little on one end to alough heat to escape.

 When one spot of the drive is shaded for awhile by the trees I can pull forward or backup to take a reading in the sun, panel will stay about same angle to the sun. However 2 things that will mess up the reading a little, A solar panels power is effected by heat a bit, so it will read lower when hot sitting in sun, and read more when cooler from sitting in shade then moved into the sun.

 This could be why at 9:30am the panel put out about 0.6 watts more than at 10:30. By 10:30 it was getting hot, at 9:30 I had just washed the pollen and dust of it and it was cool.

 Also the angle of the van may change slightly, dirt drive with bumps/dips and minor ruts. Should be close though.


I noticed while playing with the 50watt panel at near same time, alittle angle can make alot of difference some times. I had the panel sitting near straight up facing the sun, tilted back enough to lean it aganist the motor home, great sun on full panel, 0.90 amps short circuit. I leaned the panel back more and got it up to 1.08amp shorted and part of the bottom was in the shade then. Charging up the motor home batteries with that one today.

« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 10:07:42 AM by nothing to lose »

wiredwrong

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2007, 03:42:15 PM »
Thanks alot everyone, the meter that bit the dust was old and its not working at all, I had done some searching last night, but was un able to find what I had been looking for until this morning, I beleive that the panel we are using puts out a max of 50ma, and found a few places that suggested about what time the panel would put out the most so we rounded off the start and finish currents, and we went with that, we still have time to revise before the science fair so I'll go get another meter and get real world results, we just had to have some data to show the teacher, and I thought simply showing open voltage did not go with the project, I did NOT let her get out of doing the project, I just fudged some numbers, the 11-3 time was very close to what she had predicted, and concluded using the radio and fan as a guide. Thanks again.

randy33okc
« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 03:42:15 PM by wiredwrong »

nothing to lose

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2007, 03:52:43 PM »
Well that's just great,

Hey after all my hard work today you better use my stuff I posted for you or I'll drive over and bop you on the head, LOL.

Just joking of course, but check out the post I just made with data for you. You just posted this while I was posting that.


Hope it helps, if nothing else it's enteresting to see what happens when a panel just lays there nearly flat all day.


http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2007/5/14/214651/660

« Last Edit: May 14, 2007, 03:52:43 PM by nothing to lose »

AnnapolisStar

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Re: solar panel output
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2007, 11:21:07 AM »
I have a simulation that shows solar panel output for any time of day, at any latitude, and for any cloud cover.  It has been verified against my own panels output many times.  It is an excel spreadsheet based simulation using Visual Basic as its engine and is available for free at http://YachtSoftware.org

Regards
« Last Edit: July 01, 2007, 11:21:07 AM by AnnapolisStar »