Author Topic: Another failure!  (Read 2252 times)

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DanB

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Another failure!
« on: October 31, 2004, 07:43:23 AM »
Matt's 15' diameter wind turbine had some problems after the high winds last weekend.  Actually, I believe this problem started about 6 weeks ago, when Rich and I were up there and it was making a loud 'clunking' noise.  At that time, we shut it down.  Matt came home and we turned it on... and the noise was gone - so we let it run for another 6 weeks.  After last weekends high winds (which it seemed to handle fine) - it started making a similar clunking/scraping sound on Sunday night.  So we shut it down and got around to dropping it on Friday Morning.

(this was adventurous because we dropped it during extremely high winds!)



Even though the winds were high, it came down nicely and the landing was uneventful.



Perhaps this explains it.  We suspected something like this when we started finding stainless nuts at the base of the tower.  We'd never put lockwashers around the stator and the nuts at the stator brackets came loose even with lock washers!



One of the studs that held the stator in fell completely out!

My bet.. is this one fell out 6 weeks ago and it's been running with only 2 studs - that would explain the weird noise and why it stopped.



Ok... this is the last time I'll put one up without a bushing or bearing at the top of the yaw bearing.  Although it still seemed to yaw, and furl fine while up on the tower, once we lowered it - it seemed as though somebody had welded the machine to the tower top.  The machine wouldn't budge - I finally had to use the 7.5' long tail as a lever to break it loose, the crowbar I used in the picture above wouldn't budge it.  The top pipe of the tower had cut into the thick washer at the top of the yaw bearing deep enough allready, so that it locked itself on the tower top.



There it is, all taken apart.  The stator is fine - barely scratched, which is amazing.  The noise was from the studs scraping on the back of the plywood hub that holds the blades together.  I believe this has been running quite loose for a while now.  This machine is really effective in low winds, and it's pretty much either making power, or shorted out - so there is almost always current flowing through the stator if it's turning.  When there is current flowing through the stator, I believe it 'self centers' itself between the magnet rotors because the coils are repulsed from the magnets on both sides.  Kind of interesting...


I think this thing rattled apart partly because of... poor use of hardware, and vibration.  Since this alternator has the magnets fairly close together - the sine wave has tall narrow peaks, and it vibrates a bit more than most 3 phase alternators.  (nowhere near as bad as a single phase machine though)  We put it back up yesterday.  Same hardware - but this time we've got lockwashers on the stator, and locktight on all the nuts.  We put a throwout bearing (from a volvo) in the top of the yaw bearing - it was a perfect fit in the 2.5" pipe.  Although it was not a problem, we also improved the tail stop for the furled position by mounting a rubber motor mount to serve as the stop.  It's back up for now, and seems to be working nicely.

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 07:43:23 AM by (unknown) »
If I ever figure out what's in the box then maybe I can think outside of it.

Flux

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2004, 08:23:51 AM »
Loctite always seems a good idea. There's no better fatigue testing thing than a windmill.


I am pleased there was no real damage.


Flux

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 08:23:51 AM by Flux »

DanB

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2004, 08:33:29 AM »
This is also a really slow machine, and the torque on the stator must be quite a lot more than it is on the smaller 10' machines.  I think in the future, on machines this size I'll use more studs.


One thing that always concerns me about this design (Although its not been a real problem yet) is the strength of the resin - it's kind of brittle, and Im always afraid of tightening the nuts too much and breaking it out around the holes.  I have had it crack several times.

But I thought it kind of amazing, considering how the studs came out - that the holes in the stator were still a tight fit and there was no real damage to the stator at all.

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 08:33:29 AM by DanB »
If I ever figure out what's in the box then maybe I can think outside of it.

RobC

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2004, 08:51:43 AM »
Glad to hear it wasn't a big problem. Let us know as time progresses how the yaw bearing on top works out.RobC
« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 08:51:43 AM by RobC »

juiced

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2004, 09:52:02 AM »
Could i recommend drilling a small hole just above your nuts (lmao.. sorry) and using a 'R' clip to assure the nuts dont move?


  I just did something similar for a small project. I also used Steel Resin Goop.


  Glad to hear everything is good and no one got hurt!

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 09:52:02 AM by juiced »

hvirtane

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2004, 11:16:00 AM »
It is really good to hear that

there was so little damage.


Nylon locknuts and locktite

is one solution, which

also would work?


Loctite is good to prevent

nuts and studs from rusting, too.


- Hannu

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 11:16:00 AM by hvirtane »

commanda

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2004, 01:34:23 PM »
One thing that always concerns me about this design (Although its not been a real problem yet) is the strength of the resin - it's kind of brittle, and Im always afraid of tightening the nuts too much and breaking it out around the holes.  I have had it crack several times.


What about cutting a piece of steel tube for the bolt holes, and embedding it in the resin.


Amanda

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 01:34:23 PM by commanda »

Norm

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2004, 06:40:25 PM »
   Make your own locknuts....take a hacksaw saw slot on side of nuts after it is tightened you take a small punch and collapse the slot...to remove take a small chisel and open the slot again.

               ( :>) Norm.

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 06:40:25 PM by Norm »

RZ

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2004, 09:03:01 PM »
You may want to look into wireing the nuts in place like they do on race cars and aircraft. Good Luck!!!
« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 09:03:01 PM by RZ »

pwmvsi

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2004, 10:32:36 PM »
You may to use air craft bolts and nuts with seizing wire to keep things tight to gether...  Its common in even TG's down 500Kw that dont have vibration problems.


PWMVSI

« Last Edit: October 31, 2004, 10:32:36 PM by pwmvsi »

MattB

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2004, 07:35:48 AM »
Hard to say for sure, but I think that bearing up there is a big improvement... especially for such a heavy machine. No longer is top of the tower cutting into that top washer, inevitabley cutting through eventually, but I think it allows the mill to seek the wind much quicker and more smoothly, as well as furling more quickly and smoothly.


I used to see the amp meter bounce around a fair amount in light winds. Now it seems like its always sitting at 10 amps steady, and increasing or decreasing smoothly. Also seems like I'm seeing more power in lower winds.


Might just be that the wind is more consistant today and yesterday though... We also balanced the unit a bit better, which surely helps as well.


-MattB

« Last Edit: November 01, 2004, 07:35:48 AM by MattB »

nothing to lose

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2004, 01:58:00 PM »
Another way to lock a nut is simply hit the threads with a punch, sort of peen the nut and threads into each other. It stops the nut from just spinning off on it's own, but no problem with taking it off with a wrench.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2004, 01:58:00 PM by nothing to lose »

Ward

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Re: Another failure!
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2004, 11:44:58 AM »
How about a castle nut and pin.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2004, 11:44:58 AM by Ward »