Author Topic: Converting 3 phase to single phase???  (Read 3197 times)

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StanB

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Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« on: May 15, 2005, 05:23:01 AM »
Hey guys, I just bought a 20KW inverter system from a Cellular company. I also got the associated battery system.

It puts out 208VAC in 3 phase.

What will it take to make it's output into

single phase? Or is that possible?

Could I run a 3 phase motor and turn a single

phase generator?


Thanks!

« Last Edit: May 15, 2005, 05:23:01 AM by (unknown) »

wpowokal

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Re: Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2005, 01:46:51 AM »
208V sounds like single phase voltage. each phase to neutral is single phase so essentially you have three single phase supplies.


I don't know how your inverter goes with unballanced loads ie more load on one phase than the other, others more experienced will answer that, though I suspect it will not worry it.


allan

« Last Edit: May 15, 2005, 01:46:51 AM by (unknown) »
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tecker

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Re: Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2005, 05:41:13 AM »
It sounds like the inverter was spected to match a ups You have to look at the output to make shure each phase will give you 120 to neutral .In a comercial setting this is the case .
« Last Edit: May 15, 2005, 05:41:13 AM by (unknown) »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2005, 10:09:58 AM »
Hey guys, I just bought a 20KW inverter system from a Cellular company. I also got the associated battery system.  It puts out 208VAC in 3 phase. What will it take to make it's output into single phase? Or is that possible?


It already is three phase 120V.  A 20 KW 208V three-phase inverter is actually three 6 2/3 KW 120V inverters, constrained to operate at 120 degrees from each other and connected in a wye with neutral in the middle.  Instead of two hot wires (black and red) "208Y/120" has three hot wires (typically coded black, red, and blue, though the NEC doesn't actually require that).


Obviously this inverter is intended to power racks of 120V single-phase equipment without further conversion, as well as three-phase devices.


You should be able to get a three-phase distribution panel from your local hardware store.  It's like a two-phase except it has three hot wires.


In runs to individual circuits you make the hot black regardless of the phase feeding it, just as you lose the black/red distinction in a single-phase 220V distribution panel.


208 is close enough to 220 that typical "220V" appliances can use either.  So you can pick any two phases to feed your 220 appliances.  (Again make it red & black hot to the appliance run, like a single-phase 220 circuit.)


Could I run a 3 phase motor and turn a single phase generator?


Actually you could use just a motor, spinning away in a corner.  Motors, when running and excited, ARE generators.  This is a standard hack to transfer power from one phase to another (or to generate three-phase from a single-phase feed, using a starting capacitor to get the motor running in the right direction.)


You'd need a BIG motor.  If it's wye connected internally it would have to be wired for 2/3 of 20 KW on each phase to avoid overheating when pulling the other two phases worth of input into the output phase.  That corresponds to a 30 KW motor, about 40 HP.  Maybe waist high, and a full load for a half-ton truck.  And it would burn maybe a KW into heat as it spins.  Like having a space heater turned on in your equipment room 24/7.


But why bother?  You've got THREE 55A 120V feeds coming out of this inverter and can use them as is with no further conversion.  That's as much power as an 85A 220V utility feed (if there were such an animal), just arranged a little differently - but no less conveniently.

« Last Edit: May 15, 2005, 10:09:58 AM by (unknown) »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2005, 10:18:13 AM »
You should be able to get a three-phase distribution panel from your local hardware store.


Or just use a single-phase 220V panel and 2/3 of the inverter and wire your house the normal way.  And maybe add a third, separate, single-phase panel for any circuits you want to attach to the third leg.  (And maybe have the 220V panel connected to a cutover switch with the utility feed while the separate panel feeds loads that only take power from the inverter.)

« Last Edit: May 15, 2005, 10:18:13 AM by (unknown) »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2005, 10:26:10 AM »
You should be able to get a three-phase distribution panel from your local hardware store.  It's like a two-phase except it has three hot wires.


Oops.  Should have been "... It's like a single-phase 220V distribution panel except it has three hot wires instead of two."

« Last Edit: May 16, 2005, 10:26:10 AM by (unknown) »

Nando

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Re: Converting 3 phase to single phase???
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2005, 11:34:32 AM »
Please guys stop guessing 3 Phase systems, it is dangerous.


The 20 KW may have an isolation transformer and if so, the star output winding may have the common ( NEUTRAL) Point that can be brought out, this way 3 outputs at 120 volts out that need to be isolated to each load.


Better to explain in detail want you want to do, be specific, then we may be able to tell you what to do.


Regards


Nando

« Last Edit: May 21, 2005, 11:34:32 AM by (unknown) »