Author Topic: Using an Mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 pma  (Read 2775 times)

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fabieville

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Using an Mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 pma
« on: April 29, 2011, 10:36:15 AM »
I was wondering if using an mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 low wind pma would increase the power output that is going to the battery.
Here is my theory:
We all know that Mppt charge controllers converts the excess voltage (VOC) coming from your solar/wind power to amps.
I have a windblue 540 low wind pma and the current output is so small.The most I see out of it is about 4amp. I realize thou that the Voltage at Open circuit (VOC) goes up to all 40volts most times.
So I am guessing that if the current at that time is about 4amp then the total wattage would be 40 x 4= 160. Running that through a mppt controller you would get about 13.8V at approx. 11 amps after the mppt does its conversion in micro seconds instead of getting 4 amp at 13.8V using a regular dump load controller.
Please tell me what you think. Could this actually work?

ghurd

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Re: Using an Mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 pma
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2011, 11:12:00 AM »
It would work, but your math is off.

As soon as a tiny bit of current flows, the Voc drops like a rock.
Maybe 20V x 4A?  80W.

The only MPPT for wind is the Classic.  Nice, but not cheap.
Probably better off spending that money on a better PMA.
G-
www.ghurd.info<<<-----Information on my Controller

Flux

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Re: Using an Mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 pma
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2011, 11:59:50 AM »
It would no doubt give some improvement but unless you could build something yourself it could never be cost effective on such a tiny alternator.

I suspect the alternator is impedance limited with a fair bit being reactance on an iron cored machine with lots of turns. You may find that you can't load your prop whatever you do. You may well double the output but the cost of doing so will be crazy.

As ghurd said the only wind mppt controller really designed for the job is the classic and that could never be cost effective with a tiny cheap alternator and it may not even be possible to programme it for such a tiny input.

You may get some improvement with a standard buck converter and manually adjust it to suit the wind but you would have no protection if the wind got up with the conversion ratio set wrongly.

Flux

fabieville

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Re: Using an Mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 pma
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2011, 11:53:17 PM »
What about this theory for an improvement?
This is my theory:
Run the 3 phase through a stepdown transformer. And when it produce voltage like 30VAC for eg. the transformer step it down to about 14VAC while increasing the current at the output so you have a lower voltage but a higher current going to the battery. With this method i would have a higher current going to my battery at all times.
Would my theory work?

Flux

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Re: Using an Mppt charge controller on a windblue 540 pma
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2011, 03:24:58 AM »
The improvement depends on how the alternator behaves on load. you only have open circuit volts to work from. As soon as you take any load the open circuit volts fall due to the internal impedance. Without a load curve of your alternator you can't predict what will happen.

You are dealing with very low power so I feel certain that any transformer unless carefully chosen ( and very expensive) will actually make things worse.

The buck converter alone will do the voltage transformation better than using a transformer. As I said previously there should be an improvement but it may not be great as the alternator is basically not stiff enough to absorb much additional power from your blades. For good results with a mppt converter you need a stiff and efficient alternator that if used directly without the converter will bring the blades hard into stall just above cut in speed. The real factor is that your alternator can give lots of volts but to get significant power it needs to be driven very fast even when matched correctly.

If you want to get some idea of the improvement possible try charging a 24 or 36v battery. The high wind result will be similar to the converter on 12v. You will loose the low wind power with the high voltage battery but that should come back again with your converter.

If you get big improvements in high wind with the extra batteries then it is worth trying the converter. Rember to compare wattage not amps with the additional batteries as you don't have the converter changing the current ratio.

I am convinced the 540 is far too slow for the size of blades it will support, it must be designed for some very slow blades just to get a few watts in lower winds. The slow blades and reactance limited windings probably let it survive in high winds but with miserable performance.

To get anything out of a car type alternator you have to do as in the "Air machines, ignore winds below 12mph , run furiously fast blades with cut in well over 500rpm and do something to protect it in a gale. When you do that you get useful power in high winds and for marine use it seems to be fairly good. For land use it only works on the best wind sites.

Normally 130rpm cut in would more suit a 12ft prop. Your little thing won't fully load a decent 4ft prop in high winds, the low cut in speed is pointless and detrimental. You may well do better to open the star point and Jerry connect it but not the series connection that Jerry showed, you need the 3 bridges in parallel as your winding is far slower than the standard delco alternator.