Author Topic: About dump load resistors. (Read 7755 times)

patpinto80 · « **on:** October 12, 2012, 06:40:10 PM »

What size dump load resistors am I going to need for a 250 watt 10v-32v with dump load built inthe gti.Im using a tread mill motor 100v continuous.I know im not going to get 100 v with the rpm rating.But what you guys prefer for resistors.(IM in the process of gearing another one up 4:1 ratio)

gww · « **Reply #1 on:** October 12, 2012, 07:19:40 PM »

Patpinto80
Ghurd sells resistors, aprox 20watt each. I made a aprox. 500watt dump load using twenty four of them. He has a link at the bottom of his post here. Just use this sites search with his name to find one of his replies and click on the link at the bottom. He gave me good advice before he would even sell me anything.
gww

fabricator · « **Reply #2 on:** October 12, 2012, 07:49:24 PM »

I know it sounds like a broken record, But, is you GTI UL approved or one of those Chinese .....things off ebay?

patpinto80 · « **Reply #3 on:** October 12, 2012, 08:03:16 PM »

The chinese one that I can afford.

fabricator · « **Reply #4 on:** October 12, 2012, 08:30:27 PM »

If you grid tie with that thing you are risking a lot, utilities have been known to disconnect their service totally when they find an illegal grid tie, I personally am completely against illegal grid tie, but in your case you won't make enough power with that set up to move the meter anyway, but if you do and they catch you you deserve anything you get.

patpinto80 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 12, 2012, 08:35:10 PM »

Its a sun g 250.

patpinto80 · « **Reply #6 on:** October 12, 2012, 08:37:25 PM »

I just asked for a honest answer not a negative one.

dbcollen · « **Reply #7 on:** October 12, 2012, 10:32:26 PM »

Are you looking for an honest answer really? You were given one. It just happens that the honest answer is "Don't use a non UL listed inverter for grid tie, and if you do, You deserve what you get WHEN you get caught"

fabricator · « **Reply #8 on:** October 13, 2012, 10:18:47 AM »

Just for instance say you have your illegal setup up and running and you are not home and for some reason the utility comes to switch out your meter for some reason, they turn the power off out at the pole and come to pull the meter but they don't know they might still have 100 volts AC at the meter lugs, that could cause a problem and it would be all on you.
It might be something you would pay for for the rest of your life, is it worth it? NO it's not, just buy a couple batteries and forget about the grid tie, it's not going to make you anything anyway.

phil b · « **Reply #9 on:** October 13, 2012, 11:14:59 AM »

OK, Here's an alternative for you.

Buy an Outback inverter that can be legally grid tied OR buy a non grid tied FX series like I did.

When my batteries drop to 24 volts or lower, it can get the additional power from a generator OR from the grid. I don't use the grid for recharging currently because I only have a few days per year of running my generator.

My Outback is not capable of selling power to the grid because I realized early the equipment will be long worn out before it pays for itself.

My second windmill was a treadmill motor. I used about double the amount of wattage the mill's output. That is 500 watt. You can use resistors like Ghurd's, nichrome wire or even barbed wire if you prefer. Nichrome wire seems to fit the bill for me because I can change the resistance when I made modifications to the mill.

patpinto80 · « **Reply #10 on:** October 13, 2012, 12:24:51 PM »

Thanks phil b for an honest answer.It is my brothers grid tie at his house.He asked me for the answer.If i do it illget an outback for me though.As far for fabricator keep your mouth to yourself.

patpinto80 · « **Reply #11 on:** October 13, 2012, 12:35:55 PM »

Do u have a website for the fx series .Send it to me email Thanks phil b

DamonHD · « **Reply #12 on:** October 13, 2012, 01:07:42 PM »

patpinto80: please do not be so rude. As it happens fab is correct; the safety testing (and associated cost) is there for a good reason, such as avoiding fire and injury.

Rgds

Damon

fabricator · « **Reply #13 on:** October 13, 2012, 03:13:43 PM »

It's not mouth pard it's truth and sometimes the truth is a bit$h, I have three of those chinese inverters in a pile myself, two died quietly one could easily have caused a fire that could have burned the house down had I not been right there, right then and there is where I learned that you simply can't trust those things.

tanner0441 · « **Reply #14 on:** October 13, 2012, 05:22:16 PM »

hi

Patpinto if you are going to gridtie a 250 W generator, you aint never going to need a dump load. The grid will sink every watt you can get, because I doubt you will ever see 250 W.

Dump loads are normally used to stop the turbine from running away when a battery bank is full and you don't want to boil the batteries.

As for illegal grid tie if you know something someone wants to do is illegal or dangerous you have a duty of care to advise them of the fact, not help them to do it, while you go down a more legal way, and what ever inverter you use it has to be installed by a certified installer.

Brian

gww · « **Reply #15 on:** October 13, 2012, 07:00:18 PM »

I must say (step in it) that I found the illegal gtis interesting and handy in the begining. It was nice when I built some solar panels to be able to hook them to something and see how they acted. I also thought the gti did well at disconecting when there was no ac imput. I love the ideal of plug and play. It's neat to see how a turbine on a test stand reacts hooked to one. I am not convinced the circuitry couldn't be made as safe as say a generator bypass that put electric into a house when power is lost. They may not be able to be used in this climate of society of rules but I am not compleetly sure that I like that. I did however find the output compared to imput compleetly dismal. The price if you add it up in a watts comparison is not cheaper then a quality ul aproved inverter. You do have to hide or suffer the punishment if some one decides to take you on over it. It was fun, maby should be leagle but the other way atleast untill it can be taxed or outlawed keeps the man out of your buisness.
I wont use the ones I have when I hook up the outback inverter and then I may think it was money wasted or a good learning price.

Brian
If I wire my inverter to code I bet they won't make me unwire it. If I don't wire to code it will have to be changed. They may make me pay somebody to say its ok.
I'm going to wire mine knowing I will have to pay for mistakes and it might not be cheaper. When I worked on my own rental properties I never got bit but I won't say it is impossible.
Good luck everybody
gww

tanner0441 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 13, 2012, 08:35:02 PM »

Hi

GWW The way things have gone here in the UK is becoming stupid. No matter how long you have worked in the trade or what your qualifications without a piece of paper call a "Part P" of Part L or M (?) Building regulations you cannot carry out work on a domestic property, there are some exceptions,.

It is all to do with testing and certifying and the penalties are punitive.

I have been in electrics and electronics most of my life I have the papers to prove it. I can work on schools, restaurants, factories, but because I can't issue the relevant certificate, I am not supposed to extend or modify the wiring in my house.

A few years ago we had a major storm which took the power out where I was living for three weeks, when they came to work on the overheads because I had a generator running my house, They removed the fuse from the transformer pole so there was no chance at all of having an accidental feed back into the grid. I had wired the generator properly into the panel, a neighbour with a generator used a suicide lead, they were not impressed with him.

Brian

fabricator · « **Reply #17 on:** October 13, 2012, 09:54:20 PM »

As far as I know in most places in the US the home owner can do his/her own electrical installations, if you are doing new construction you need a permit and you will need a rough in and final inspection, so it has to be to code.

gww · « **Reply #18 on:** October 14, 2012, 05:43:15 AM »

I know I am probly being unfair when I post things like I did above as I live in a place that I don't have to get permits to do anything. I must say I love that about where I live. I will hate it when it changes. I know the argument that zonning and code protects people from shoddy work. I do believe this can go too far. Here they have all these rules and yet most people still hire an inspector to look at everything before they buy it. I like haveing a chance to decide what will work for me and don't apreteate when every body noses in. I don't want cameras in my house and bedroom cause it might be safer. I don't know where the line should be drawn. In my case less is more.
thanks
gww

PS I mean the rule makers above nosing in, not you guys who have been so great in the help that you have given me.

fabricator · « **Reply #19 on:** October 14, 2012, 09:57:20 AM »

The NEC is an absolutely necessary evil, without it there would be no universal oversight for electrical contractors and houses would be burning down left and right like they were before the NEC came into effect.
Another necessary evil is the Underwriters Laboratory, without them we would have houses burning down left and right like they were before it came about, that is exactly the problem with those things that come out of China, there is no regulatory agency to make sure the things they sell that you plug into your wall here will not at some point burst into flame and burn your house down.
Thats is the simple truth, and the NEC is exactly what it says, a National electrical code, if you install something that is not to code or run a wire run that is not to code an it over heats and burns your house down your insurance company can say, to bad, we can't cover that because it was not to code.

gww · « **Reply #20 on:** October 14, 2012, 03:59:31 PM »

Fabricator
I don't disagree with you one iota. I do think things can be taken overboard ie; Some tower regs, color of your house, What you can keep in you front yard, whether you have to use a water saver toilet or sink, etc...

I would also say that more people are probly using the unregulated gti then the ul aproved and you don't hear much about big problims. I wouldn't want to be the test case if the electric, insurance or goverment tried to take it on though.

Even when you are inocent, litigation cost.

Chineese junk: walmart used to advertize all their american made products and now you couldn't fill up a shopping cart with american made stuff if you when through the whole store.

I can't wait to hook up my outback system.
thanks
gww

tanner0441 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 14, 2012, 06:57:10 PM »

Hi

I do agree with fabricator. As for tower regs. it is not too long ago on here that there was a tower build that could have had a far different outcome than the one that actually finished up. Wiring regs. I have done work on properties that people have attempted themselves. Wiring on a campsite with no earth fault protection, and the owner didn't see a problem.

One of the problems is some of our DIY stores sell all the electrical cables and fittings you could wish for, and with noone qualified to advise. People run long cables from their houses to workshops, a cable that has a rating when strung out like a washing line, has a different rating when threaded down a conduit with other cables.

No! No matter how annoying regulations are they would not have been introduced if there had never been an accident. It's OK saying ooops when you blow a fuse it doesn't cover burning your house down or zapping someone.

Unless your generating a lot of power I can't see the point of grid tie, one reason what's the point of having a private electrical supply that goes off when the grid goes down, and in a lot of cases you will never recover the investment.

Brian.

ghurd · « **Reply #22 on:** October 14, 2012, 07:00:00 PM »

Quote from: fabricator on October 13, 2012, 09:54:20 PM

As far as I know in most places in the US the home owner can do his/her own electrical installations...

Here, I can do my own simple repairs... IF I take a test first.. pay for the test... and pass the test.

Been a while... Seems like it cost $100 to take a 100 question test?

IF the person passed the test, then they could change a ceiling fan, light fixture, outlet, or light switch, in their own home.

Every 1~2~3 years, the homeowner has to retake (and pay for taking) the test.

Not sure the test includes allowing new wires or opening the breaker box.
It sucks to be here.
G-

fabricator · « **Reply #23 on:** October 14, 2012, 07:20:14 PM »

That's just nuts, I can do anything I want to do here as long as it is to code and passes any inspections, including installing my main service panel and meter socket.

gww · « **Reply #24 on:** October 14, 2012, 07:32:13 PM »

G
I am sorry for you. I say less is more. It still pays to be carefull but I would hate to pay to prove the same knowladge over and over and over again.
gww

PS Sometimes when things are inacted because of accidents it still could be wrong. Take my work, numerous places in my plant have had no eye injuries but get one in a bad place and all of a sudden after 30 years of records, every one in the plant has to wear safety glasses even if its 100 deg. and they get so fogged up that somebody will really get hurt when they run into something or trip. If common sence could dictate I may not hate rules so bad. Hate isn't the same as not reconizing them and not wanting to pay more just to violate them.

admin · « **Reply #25 on:** October 14, 2012, 09:29:00 PM »

Everyone has pretty much covered the various safety issues that I was going to mention when I first saw this thread.

A couple other points though--

~ It's important to discuss these issues with our members in the USA, but we have lots of people in other countries where such laws and codes don't exist...

~ With a lot of utility meters, any electricity you make in excess of what you are using at the time (running your meter backwards), the utility will bill YOU for all the energy you produce. So, a grid-tie agreement and special meter from the utility are, in many locations, essential GTI system components.

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Author Topic: About dump load resistors. (Read 7755 times)