Changing generator motors?

[captainward]

I live in California and have light winds sometime moderate winds.
I bought a permanent magnet dc motor but it just stalls on my lenzs 4foot vawt.
I am thinking of getting a permanent magnet alternator from Missouri wind and solar for 139.00 will I get no clogging with this motor?? will it turn in light winds?

[birdhouse]

without bashing...  i personally would stay away from MWS.  i believe they have been involved in selling snake oil. 

any chart showing "open" volts and "shorted" amps is worthless.  any reputable company will show rpms and watts going into a battery.  just as the unit is meant to be used. 

but then again, if were into getting power from the wind, i would also steer away from a VAWT.  power can be harvested from VAWTs but it's an uphill battle. 

3 phase servo motors can be had on ebay pretty cheap, and many have near zero "cog".  just a matter of finding the right match. 

just my thoughts.

adam

[captainward]

O gosh I already have a room full of snake oil.
Could you point me in the right direction for those motors on ebay not sure how to find them or what to call them in the search window?   Thanks   please see my photo album on the photos page for the turbine photo.

[birdhouse]

i made my mill from a fanuc AC 3 phase servo motor.  it's a 60lb jobbie than can easily pull in 1000w in the right wind.  guessing that's stiffer than what you want. 

some folk call them stepper motors. 

if you're running 12v look for something around 200v and 1500rpm??  it really is a guessing game.  i just happened to guess right.  allen bradley and fanuc make good motors.  there are other brands, but i can't think of them just now. 

i did actually look into the MWS site.  seems they have upped there game a bit, but still not a company i would want to send money.  re-branded chinese 3ph rectifiers, utility trailer wiring harness plugs for turbine transmission wire, dinky looking slip ring setups,  17mm shafts on their "big boy" wind turbine PMAs.  cough,  cough...

adam

[captainward]

Well that is some help. what kind of wind turbine do you have?

[birdhouse]

it's an 8.5' dia.  typical furling type.  took some info from hugh piggott and some from the dans.  sits on a 70' guyed pipe tower.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYgva48juZ4

adam

[captainward]

Wow......... nice machine, So does your alternator have much resistance compared to a dc generator?

[birdhouse]

i've never played with a DC generator.  so not sure.  the motor sun very freely.  you could just barely feel the cogging.  definitely not enough to keep the blades from starting.  my blades spin up long before i actually hit cut it. 

fanuc also makes DC motors.  i've always wanted to get my hands on one.  there was a 300lb motor i lost a bid on ebay to.  i figured it might be a good candidate for a giant geared VAWT.  something that would never put out stellar numbers, but might trickle charge in the smallest of winds, yet hit decent numbers in higher winds. 

FYI:  my system is 24v.  the motor i used is a fanuc, 2000rpm,  140v, 20A.  seems near a perfect match to the 8.5' blades.  i originally was going to just carve the blades (chainsaw style) and paint them.  then i decided to put a layer of fiberglass over the laminated wood.  so basically they ended up thicker than i really wanted.  i think i could have gotten a fair bit more performance had i made them a bit thinner. 

here is almost an identical motor to what i used.  it looks pretty beat, and would be WAY to stiff for 12v.  but just to give you an idea. 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fanuc-AC-Servo-Motor-Model-20F-A06B-0352-B731-w-Encoder-A860-0320-T111-/190966754115?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c76816b43

adam

[Mary B]

Maybe a 1/2 to 1 HP GE ECM motor?

[Isaiah]

do the math on the servo or stepper motor by dividing the rpm by the volts and multiply that number  by the volts you want to run at !
2000dev 140 = 14.2857 x 24= 342 rpm roughly for cut in charging speed .
if shopping on e bay take your time and you will find one at a reasonable price.
if you get one then you will most probably want to take the back off and remove the break system, there will al so be a encoder thingy on the end you will have to remove first then the break.
 I bought one some time back and I got it cheap . when it arrived we found it wouldn't turn and in taking the break out we found it locked up so  once I got the old break out it turns goodHope this helps .
Isaiah

[Smithson]

You could also use a fisher and paykel motor as an alternator.  The advantage is that there is a large support group at THE BACK SHED in Australia.  They have done all the research on the subject.  There is a man on the web in the US who sells the motors for 95$.  He also sells a horizontal furling frame to mount the motor on direct drive, light weight.  That is if you ever want to go horizontal.

If this was 30 years ago you would just buy a permanent magnet dc motor 3 times the battery voltage and with an armature current of at least 20 amps.  Of course you would have to gear it up.  I don't know anything about those ECM motors except they came with my furnace.
 Arch

[captainward]

Arch,  WOW I think you got it for me. I found the internet site for the mods but where to buy them?
Please give me the name and internet address of the seller WOW Thank you, your my friend for life.

[Smithson]

I sent you a message where u log in on this site.  Tell me if you get it.   I don't know anything about them but Gizmo on back shed is on this other power site.  You could send him a private message.   Arch

[captainward]

OK Arch I got it all Thanks you have solved my problem. I will post pictures when I get it done in a month or so  BYE Your friend...:O)  captain ward.




Don't give op the ship.

[Mary B]

ECM motors are a DC permanent magnet motor with a AC to DC controller that varies the motor speed with the heating/cooling load needed. Strip off the electronics and you are left with an easy to modify motor. There are a couple articles on here that show how to separate the coils and set them up for 3 phase. One I have is all in series and will hit 80 volts with a 1300 rpm input. Only issue is the shafts are not good for hawt use, a bit to small. But for a geared turbine it would be great.

[tomloods]

Hello,

One year ago i bought a dual PMA from MWS. i am very Unhappy with it! Cogging is tremendous the power output very poor! Now making my own Axial flux alternator....

[electrondady1]

have you changed the dimensions of ed's lenz2 mill ?
why not duplicate the alternator that ed uses?
i think he sells all the parts.

[captainward]

Well the dementions are on my wings are the same as his as I used his plans to build it but it was the cost that turned me away anyway from magnets about 200.00. I am going to try this washing machine smart motor which I just bought on ebay and see if it works. it is the same direct drive idea as the one the he built so if it doesnt work I guess I'll have to give in and build his. I'll keep you posted as to my progress with pictures ect there will be some machining to be done to get in attached.
Thanks for the heads up on mwp, I got whomped by windzilla the same way to the tune of 140.00 buckos.
although if i lived in a real windy area the windzilla probally would have worked .  Thanks guys and gals.....:O)