battery costs

[go4it]

I keep reading about the cost of storage going down, but I don't see any cost saving in batteries in my area (Winnipeg MB)  Are these articles just referring to large installations using lithium batteries?

[dnix71]

It can't be lead acid. They haven't gotten any cheaper or better here in the US.

[SparWeb]

I agree, it's probably the price of Lithium-ion batteries that's been going down, not lead.
However, there are more ways to get older lead-acid batteries that aren't dead and still have some life than there are for Lithiums.

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

I agree, it's probably the price of Lithium-ion batteries that's been going down, not lead.
However, there are more ways to get older lead-acid batteries that aren't dead and still have some life than there are for Lithiums.

Also:  Most deployed lithium variants age by deterioration of one of the plates by oxidation, and the rate varies little with state of charge or cycling (short of major abuse).  So essentially their clock starts when they're built, after a certain time they die, and the only thing you can do about it is make it worse by abusing them.

[kitestrings]

My understanding is that most everything in FLA's gets recycled.  Are they able to recycle Li-ions?

[XeonPony]

Best way to get a good bank is to buy a salvage leaf from the states and harvest the pack, so far that's my plan, seems like with some effort I can get one for 5k, that gives you the cheapest possible 23kwH Li pack!

add 300 for bms and some other bells and whistles

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

My understanding is that most everything in FLA's gets recycled.  Are they able to recycle Li-ions?

Most everything in FLAs CAN be recycled.  The big nasty - lead - has some value, too.

Whether they ARE recycled is another can of worms.  (My wife, part American Indian, claims that many/most of them end up in big piles on certain reservations where the tribe has permitted them to be dumped, rather than actually being recycled and the toxic materials reused.)

Lithiums are made mostly of cheaper stuff, which is (allegedly) not nearly so toxic as FLAs.  So on one hand they may be less of a hazard if dumped, but on the other there's less incentive to actually salvage and reuse their contents, rather than dumping them somewhere and making new ones from scratch.

[Mary B]

I can't imagine LA batteries just being dumped when they are worth $10 at a junkyard!

[dnix71]

Mary B pictures of some of those dumps here: https://archive.epa.gov/socal/web/html/tribes.html

lead acid batteries were among the less toxic stuff dumped.