Author Topic: Hey all  (Read 5078 times)

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vimes1984

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Hey all
« on: January 15, 2018, 06:59:47 AM »
Hello to everyone there,
I'm really new here, I'm looking to put together a pico-Hydro electric installation at home ( I'm thinking overshoot water wheel ) I have around 10 meters of head and around 40L/S of flow.
Pictures below.
I am looking for some advice on which generator/alternator/AC servo motor to use?
And Maybe some build plans for a waterwheel, does anyone know where I can get these?




Kind regards
Chris

mbouwer

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2018, 12:08:51 PM »
Sometime ago I made a turbine for a friend who also has a little mountainstream.
He chose to make a waterwheel first.
But then your power output is probably lower.

hiker

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2018, 12:22:25 PM »
water wheel plans generator        Simple google search...
WILD in ALASKA

hiker

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2018, 12:25:18 PM »
That should have went to google....dang I phone...you get the idea..
WILD in ALASKA

vimes1984

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2018, 01:32:22 PM »
That should have went to google....dang I phone...you get the idea..
Hehehe I do get the idea, I've been searching high and low some plans and they don't seem to turn up, I have found some paid plans for decorative wheels but nothing really concrete or decent. On how to connect it to the generator...

vimes1984

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2018, 01:33:10 PM »
Sometime ago I made a turbine for a friend who also has a little mountainstream.
He chose to make a waterwheel first.
But then your power output is probably lower.
the problem is I have to make a wheel first as a proof of concept then maybe move into a turbine later, when I prove it works :D

joestue

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2018, 03:47:54 PM »
you need a 6 inch pipe (15cm) to get 50 liters per second at a head loss of 4.1 meters per 100 meters of pipe.


do you know anyone with a 3D printer?

you could 3d print various kaplan turbine blades, find one that works and then have it cast in bronze or aluminum. basically bury the PLA in plaster of paris, then burn out the plastic in a kiln, pour aluminum in.


automobile water pumps are sufficiently cheap you could harvest one for the pump seal. another option bend the pipe after the turbine, put a bushing on the leading edge of the turbine blade(and perhaps after it) and run the shaft out through the side of the pipe after the bend. you'll need a bushing where the shaft goes through the side of the bent pipe. but this will keep the generator out of the water, and if you can deal with water spraying out the bushing, you don't need a pump seal, which makes experimentation much easier.


another option is use a water lubricated well pump as your generator and directly install the kaplan turbine blade on the end of the motor. the motor will already have the water lubricated thrust bearing in it, so you don't need to add anything provided the motor is after the turbine blades.  you can leave it as an induction motor if you're willing to spend a lot of time getting it running right, or add magnets to the rotor..

problem being the rpm of a 6 inch diameter blade in 40L/s water is probably too slow for the hp you're going to have available, in a 4 inch (100mm) diameter pump motor.


so you theoretically have 4KW of power available.

you could design the turbine to drive an 8 pole induction motor directly, but those motors are hard to find. if you have 50hz native power then a 6 pole motor might be a good option too.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 04:00:31 PM by joestue »
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vimes1984

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2018, 05:00:04 PM »
you need a 6 inch pipe (15cm) to get 50 liters per second at a head loss of 4.1 meters per 100 meters of pipe.


do you know anyone with a 3D printer?

you could 3d print various kaplan turbine blades, find one that works and then have it cast in bronze or aluminum. basically bury the PLA in plaster of paris, then burn out the plastic in a kiln, pour aluminum in.


automobile water pumps are sufficiently cheap you could harvest one for the pump seal. another option bend the pipe after the turbine, put a bushing on the leading edge of the turbine blade(and perhaps after it) and run the shaft out through the side of the pipe after the bend. you'll need a bushing where the shaft goes through the side of the bent pipe. but this will keep the generator out of the water, and if you can deal with water spraying out the bushing, you don't need a pump seal, which makes experimentation much easier.


another option is use a water lubricated well pump as your generator and directly install the kaplan turbine blade on the end of the motor. the motor will already have the water lubricated thrust bearing in it, so you don't need to add anything provided the motor is after the turbine blades.  you can leave it as an induction motor if you're willing to spend a lot of time getting it running right, or add magnets to the rotor..

problem being the rpm of a 6 inch diameter blade in 40L/s water is probably too slow for the hp you're going to have available, in a 4 inch (100mm) diameter pump motor.


so you theoretically have 4KW of power available.

you could design the turbine to drive an 8 pole induction motor directly, but those motors are hard to find. if you have 50hz native power then a 6 pole motor might be a good option too.
my Problem is I need to go for the water wheel first :D

electrondady1

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2018, 12:38:57 PM »
there are a lot of videos about these vortex types of water wheels https://youtu.be/XiefORPamLU

mab

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2018, 01:57:50 PM »
Can i ask why you need to go for a waterwheel first? building a water wheel to make use of 10m head of water is a BIG project - much harder (and more expensive) than using a turbine i would think?

vimes1984

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2018, 02:28:08 PM »
Can i ask why you need to go for a waterwheel first? building a water wheel to make use of 10m head of water is a BIG project - much harder (and more expensive) than using a turbine i would think?
Because it needs to be aesthetically pleasing to my better half and half a ton of concrete is not  :D

electrondady1

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2018, 08:55:41 AM »
there you go .it's wise to please your sweety

mab

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2018, 05:07:12 PM »
Well, I can't argue with that  ::)
 ;D

SparWeb

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2018, 07:38:15 PM »
Below is something I grabbed from Powerspout (no endorsement intended) just because it was convenient and seems to be a good starting point.
You can pinpoint your site's area by head and flow rate.  You could say that you are in reach of all 3 types of wheel shown - with some compromises.
You have the flow for a large wheel, but may not take advantage of all of the head you could have.
Or you have the head for a faster Pelton wheel, but you would need several to capture all of the flow in your stream.

If the aesthetics of the open wheel really appeals to you (and I have to agree, it does) then there are many ways to make it work.  Generally you will still need to have a "pumphouse" building beside the wheel to house the structure and generator out of the elements.  Some excavation work is unavoidable to concentrate the water's approach to the wheel, make space for the wheel to spin, a spillway, and you might also need a holding pond.



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skid

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Re: Hey all
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2018, 06:27:31 PM »
Your head is the diameter of your wheel, the bigger the better within reason. I used aluminum for weight reasons but the material of choice is Corten steel plate. Go to the Borst engineering web page which will help you to determine the best size, number of buckets, etc.

Make a wooden flue (with a bypass gate for when you do maintenance) to direct the water into the wheel buckets, and hopefully accelerate it a bit for more energy.

Looks like a fun project