My experience so far.

[Astro]

Magnetjuice, thanks for the video. I had not seen that one before. I am now thinking I was on the right path with epoxying them down and letting dry, before I wire them. Or I could screw them down like clockman did, then wire them, then move them to a drawing/jig to place them on a mat and align and epoxy them together, before casting them. As you pointed out and the reason I asked how am I going to keep these things from moving even a little bit, they have to be aligned very very well for it to work up to it's potential.
The only other idea I had was to have a jig routered where the center was not removable. So something like a doughnut carved into plywood. Then I could draw my lines on it, place them in there, align them and then pour the whole thing. I kind of like that idea the best so far.
 

[bigrockcandymountain]

About the renogy 40a controller, I don't think it will work for wind.  It doesn't mention wind tracking and a normal solar mppt algorithm isn't going to work with wind. 

Thanks for posting it though.  That is a great option for a solar controller.  It has great value for what it is and good reviews.  I've been looking for something like that for awhile.

[Astro]

About the renogy 40a controller, I don't think it will work for wind.  It doesn't mention wind tracking and a normal solar mppt algorithm isn't going to work with wind. 

Thanks for posting it though.  That is a great option for a solar controller.  It has great value for what it is and good reviews.  I've been looking for something like that for awhile.

 Any other ideas of a similar sized controller that would work better?

[Astro]

Just an fyi and for future reference, hot glue works to stick the coils down. I measured the hot glue gun on low setting and it is 120-130 degrees F. I am using 200 degree C or 392 F wire, so no worry about harming the coil wire insulation. A dab will do you for sure. I tested it out on a scrap coil I had an it does not take but a little bit and your coils stay right where you want them.
THANKS FOR THE TIP, Mary B.

[Astro]

MagnetJuice, this is a little closer huh?? I know it looks off, but it is because I can't seem to get a pic where the angle of the camera does not make it look off.

[MagnetJuice]

Yep, much better, nice coils!



I found out that is easier to see the template lines if the coils are placed between the lines.

I don’t remember if you said the voltage that you want to optimize this for.

If you tell me the voltage and RPM that you are shooting for, I can give you an estimate of the output.

Also, how thick are the coils? And, is the VAWT going to be a Savonius or H-Darrieus?

Ed

[Astro]

Yep, much better, nice coils!

(Attachment Link)

I found out that is easier to see the template lines if the coils are placed between the lines.

I don’t remember if you said the voltage that you want to optimize this for.

If you tell me the voltage and RPM that you are shooting for, I can give you an estimate of the output.

Also, how thick are the coils? And, is the VAWT going to be a Savonius or H-Darrieus?

Ed

 I am still wondering why the picture from my ipod makes it look like they are so far off. That is just weird.
 I might put them between the lines, I have not decided, just playing with it right now and getting it laid out.
 As for what I am shooting for, idk. I know that does not make sense, but I am thinking watts and when I am getting 60v and putting 17 amps on my #14 wire, I should be at about 1020 watts. So I was kind of shooting for 1,000 watts when I started, but I backed it down to a more reasonable 800 watts. At the same 17 anps, that would put me at a touch under 50 volts. That is about where I want to be, between 45 and 60 volts. That should play well with charging and the charge controllers. It also gives me some room for stronger winds and not send a 100v charger into fault. I have no idea how fast I am going to have to spin it to get that our of it. I was going to worry about that later. I am hoping not very fast and that is why I built it this way, but who knows. My first focus was just building a good generator.
 Like I said who knows if my vawt idea will even work, or if I will have to spin it a different way. The coils are .65 thick. I have the mags for one plate and was going to try just one mag plate and the other plate with no mags to save some money and figured I could add the other mags later, but that is still up in the air. i hate doing things halfway, so I will probably just add the mags on the second plate right away. I just do not think it is going to put out what I want if I don't. The whole thing has been a ton of thinking and learning, which is fun for me, but it is also my first one and still a learn as you go type thing. So you guys helping me figure some stuff out is a great help. Thank you.

[Scruff]

I am still wondering why the picture from my ipod makes it look like they are so far off.

+



?

 

[Bruce S]

Astro;
Scruff's pics are correct. However, it's one of those things digital cameras has issues with "lines" unlike analog (SLR) .
Hope this helps

Bruce S

[Astro]

Astro;
Scruff's pics are correct. However, it's one of those things digital cameras has issues with "lines" unlike analog (SLR) .
Hope this helps

Bruce S

Yeah I tried several angles, but it did not matter, so I figured it was the camera or the lens.

[Astro]

Now MagnetJuice has me curious as to what I am going to get out of this thing. I mean the higher the voltage the better. If I get 140v at 15 amps, I would be over 2000 watts with no harm done to my #14 coils. I am going to have to find out what it puts out at what rpm before I go thinking about what charge controller is best for the set up. If I am going to get 2000 watts instead of 1000 (or less), then I can see spending a little more on a charge controller.

[bigrockcandymountain]

The only controllers i know of that has mppt for wind is the midnite classic.  They have a 150v 200v and 250v input model available.  That is what i use and kitestrings has 2.  They are great, but expensive.  I got mine second hand for pennies on the dollar, otherwise i would just direct connect to the batteries and use a diversion controller.  That's how i had it set up originally, and it worked great. 

If I put up more solar, I might just steal the classic controller back and hook the turbine directly to the batteries again. 

Maybe somebody else will tell us about a cheaper option for mppt with wind. 

[Astro]

The only controllers i know of that has mppt for wind is the midnite classic.  They have a 150v 200v and 250v input model available.  That is what i use and kitestrings has 2.  They are great, but expensive.  I got mine second hand for pennies on the dollar, otherwise i would just direct connect to the batteries and use a diversion controller.  That's how i had it set up originally, and it worked great. 

If I put up more solar, I might just steal the classic controller back and hook the turbine directly to the batteries again. 

Maybe somebody else will tell us about a cheaper option for mppt with wind.

 My original idea and may still be, is/was, to take a solar charger and have a voltage relay hooked up to energize some resistors if the voltage gets to high. I have a adjustable relay that is good from like 8v to 80v dc. So I was going to have it kick in the resistors at 80v to protect the 100v input of a solar charger.  Now the best part is that if a guy put a tdr in line with the voltage relay, and said resistors, tada, you have made a clipper. If it hits the set voltage, it energizes the resistors for a set amount of time and slows the mill down for that set amount of time. In strong winds, it will just keep hitting the limit, energizing the voltage relay, which energizes the resistors for a moment, and slows the mill down and then repeats itself. You have no worries of the resistors getting hot and burning up under constant load and tada Bobs your uncle and everything is working well. Lol.
 However the million dollar question is what kind of volts am I going to get out of it at different rpms. Maybe I will never see 100v and maybe it is easily capable 150. Idk. Obviously I do not want to limit what it is capable of and choke it at 80v if I really can get 140v before I need to choke it down.
 I just did a quick (wire nut job) and one phase comes out to be .07 ohms or about 275 ft of #14.
Something else I have learned is these frigging magnets are strong!!! I am only using 1 x 1/2 x 1/2 n52 and I am kind of glad I started with those. You guys running 2 x 1 x 1/2 are not kidding when you say be careful. My little mags will stick together right through my hand. lol.
 I understand that the faster I spin it the better results, but I am trying to build a fairly slow spinning vawt. If I hit 800 watts I will be happy. 1000 and I did what I set out to do. BUT again, I do not want to choke it down if I can do more. So while idk what rpms and the calculations for all that, I do know I need about 50v to hit 800 watts, and about 60 volts to hit 1000 watts. So I need to spin it at whatever rpm I need to to get 60 volts. Again idk what rpm that is. HOWEVER and to repeat myself again, if I can spin it up to 140v, well I would be a idiot not to and then I would probably spend the money on a good controller. If I am going to have to spin it to fast for my liking then I do not want an expensive controller capable of big numbers, if I am not going to ever use them before I choke it and slow it down.

[JW]

choke
https://info.triadmagnetics.com/blog/chokes-vs-inductors-whats-the-difference

[MagnetJuice]

Astro, here are the approximate figures of the output of that alternator.

These figures could be + or – 10%

If you have 2 rotors with 32 magnets each, open DC volts would be:

56 volts at 214 RPM and 28 volts at 110 RPM.

If you have 1 magnet rotor and 1 steel rotor without magnets on the other side:

56 volts at 305 RPM and 28 volts at 156 RPM.

If you have 1 magnet rotor only, and no steel rotor on the other side:

14.5 volts at 120 RPM.

The maximum that you can squeeze out of 64 of those magnets would be about 900 watts max.

Those coils are a bit thick for those small magnets, but should work ok.

I hope this will be useful to you in choosing the charge controller and VAWT to go with this.

Ed

[Astro]

Astro, here are the approximate figures of the output of that alternator.

These figures could be + or – 10%

If you have 2 rotors with 32 magnets each, open DC volts would be:

56 volts at 214 RPM and 28 volts at 110 RPM.

If you have 1 magnet rotor and 1 steel rotor without magnets on the other side:

56 volts at 305 RPM and 28 volts at 156 RPM.

If you have 1 magnet rotor only, and no steel rotor on the other side:

14.5 volts at 120 RPM.

The maximum that you can squeeze out of 64 of those magnets would be about 900 watts max.

Those coils are a bit thick for those small magnets, but should work ok.

I hope this will be useful to you in choosing the charge controller and VAWT to go with this.

Ed

 That helps a tremendous amount. It makes several decisions much easier. Thank you so much. That is about what I was going for. I knew I was going to have to go with the original design of dual axial with mags on both plates to get what I wanted. It should pair well with a 24v 2-400ah battery bank. The whole set up should work well for the wind conditions I have. So I am shooting for about 4 rotations per second in building the mechanical part of it. I also can get by with 100v charge controller and really probably a 30 amp would do fine. No need to spend big bucks on something I can't use. Also when making a braking circuit for it, I really only need to worry about big destructive winds and that makes that much more simple. I have a few ideas about that as well, but I think I will get it up and going before I spend more money on stuff for that idea.
Thank you guys for all your help with this. It is quite the project and like I told my wife, if anyone ever says they want to build a mill, my advice is start small. Like 12 #16 coil small. Lol. I am glad I did not bite off anymore then I did, because there are times I think what did I get myself into here. So again, thanks guys.
 

[Astro]

Now you have me wondering if a 12v system would not work better, with those voltage numbers. What does everyone;s experience think about that? Should I go with a 12v system or a 24v system if I am probably only ever going to see a top of 60v? Seems to me that I will avg probably about 25-40v and then with a load on it......... What do you guys think? 12v or 24v???
 I really wanted to go with a 24v, but if it is not going to work as well, then I guess it is what it is.
I am thinking a 12v system will give me more hours of charging, even if it is lower watt output. If the goal is 36 volts for a 24v system, and I am only putting out say 55v on a good day......... I think I would get more out of going with a 12v system.

[Astro]

Yeah, I think running a 12v system, with a 40A (520 watt) controller, I am going to be ok. Still on the fence about a 40 or a 60, but that is really no big deal.
My desired load to cover is about 10.5kw per day (10,400 watts, a 1300 watt load for 8 hrs a day) (actually 1260 watts and maybe 8 hrs a day or 10,080 a day, but I like to estimate a little high that should cover some of the start up current) . 10,500 + 24 hrs means I need to make about 438 watts per hr.
I have no idea on battery bank size just yet as the load is actually 3 loads that run sometimes and sometimes do not. A fridge, a freezer and the furnace.  I am not looking for reserve power, but just enough that it can catch back up charging between all the things kicking on and off.
 I had this idea to just kick the furnace fan back to grid power when battery voltage got about halfway discharged, but decided to just have them all (the entire load) kick back to grid power if the batteries get discharged.
 I am not so worried about back up time, as I have a generator if the grid power goes out anyway. I am more after keeping said load off the grid, when I have the wind to do it (avg wind here is 15 mph). So pretty much all the time, except the rare days when we do not have much wind.
 I am also thinking that while I am going to build a well insulated battery box, it gets really cold in the garage where the batteries are going to be. 0 degrees F for sure during the winter ( I eventually want to solve that by insulating the shop). So I might need to think about battery pads and that is going to use power. Maybe not, maybe the charge discharge of the batteries will warm up the inside of the box enough, I just do not know yet. Plan for the worst type thing.
 So in my experience so far..... I should be ok as far as my payback time frame goal. But I really have to wonder if I would not have been better of buying a small wind turbine and calling it a day. That has crossed my mind, but I do not think I can buy one that puts out what I think the one I am building will at low wind speeds ( as consistently is a better way to say it). Remember, my goal was to just have a mill that just chugged along putting out a decent wattage and voltage almost all the time. While I may not be able to put out quite the voltage I wanted and thus have to go to a 12v system, I am still thinking that I can win this race if I can just chug along putting out 500 watts almost all the time. I think that is very attainable. With MagnetJuices calculations, that means I need to be at about 110 rpm (or a bit faster) as much as possible. Especially when the wind is 12-15 (avg) mph and while it is under load.
I have high hopes it all goes pretty well, because it has been a great learning experience and I am already thinking "the next one I would change this". Lol. Thanks for all the help guys, because I am quite certain that I would not have done what I set out to do without your help.
 

[Astro]

Now if I can get mine to spin something like this...... then I should be in business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlAnf3nDc7s

[Astro]

Alright. Now that I have had a couple drinks, (it is the weekend you know) and calmed down from my melt down about only having to run a 12V system on this rig, what if I?
Make the top plate out of 1/4 in. Made the other plate out of 1/2 in. (like a flywheel, once moving, hard to slow down and also hard to speed up. So constant)
Then later I could add another 1/4in plate below it, make another stator same as the first, I would already have the plate (flywheel) in the middle and the mold for the stator.
Then I could center tap for more amps, or wire it together for more volts and move into a 24v system. Just leave the ends outside the mold.
The mags and wire were not all that bad priced since they were smaller, so the cost of adding stage 2 to the rig would not be anything compared to the original cost of building the thing. But would double output.

[Astro]

Then if I was really smart or was friends with Tesla (or rich) what I would do is design the outer 2 plates on a clutch system. Much like a snowmobile clutch. So they release when the wind is low and tighten up when there is more wind available.
 Unless something amazing happens, I doubt I will ever get that far into the build.

[SparWeb]

Now if I can get mine to spin something like this...... then I should be in business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlAnf3nDc7s

Ha - I think a link to this was posted to FL many years ago.  It's still there on YT!
I made videos just like it of my own many years before that.

[DamonHD]

Hi Astro,

I'm sure you know this, but to avoid tangling yourself up in units and mixing power and energy...  When you say:

My desired load to cover is about 10.5kw per day (10,400 watts, a 1300 watt load for 8 hrs a day)

I think you mean 10.5kWh load cover per day?

Rgds

Damon

[Astro]

Now if I can get mine to spin something like this...... then I should be in business.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlAnf3nDc7s

Ha - I think a link to this was posted to FL many years ago.  It's still there on YT!
I made videos just like it of my own many years before that.

 You made vawts that spin like that? Good job. Most of the ones you see out there are a 55 gallon drum cut in half or something. There are not very many impressive ones to look at, that is for sure.
 If you were/are into vawts, can I ask what you think about the Lenz type wing? While I have seen many videos of them and they are spinning, I have seen only a couple where it looks like they are spinning at a decent speed for the wind mph. My thought is, that those wings would be easy to make and since I am going to have some weight with 18in discs (back to the whole flywheel thing), a Lenz wing would catch the wind and give me a decent start up while also being able to achieve the desired rpm. I love the airfoils that are like an airplane and they seem to spin the fastest of any I have seen, but I wounder about start up wind needed.
Thanks

[Astro]

Hi Astro,

I'm sure you know this, but to avoid tangling yourself up in units and mixing power and energy...  When you say:

My desired load to cover is about 10.5kw per day (10,400 watts, a 1300 watt load for 8 hrs a day)

I think you mean 10.5kWh load cover per day?

Rgds

Damon

Yes, that is what I mean. It takes a special kind of person to be around me for long, because much of what I say is often misunderstood due to my lacking ability to express things well. I just never really had any desire to learn writing or speech or verbalization in general. Figured if I had something to share the right people would know what I was talking about.
But yes, how you said it is what I meant and the better way to say it.
 Now for the big question, do you think I can do it with what I have been laying out?? I know I can if I add another stator, but I think it should work to cover that load without the second stator. I think if I add the second stator I am going to run my fan on my AC. I was hoping to cover that also with this build, but it just is not going to be big enough for that. I figure if needed, I can put a tdr on it so it does not start at the exact same time as the furnace fan (idk if it does or not) so as to reduce the start up current on the inverter. So I kind of planned for a bigger inverter then I need. Or do you think it would be smarter to go with two inverters in a set up like that?
(oh and yes I am aware that if I add another stator and more load, I am going to have to have different blades, wings or whatever they are called on a vawt. Hence my whole lets just get this part built and working first, but make sure that in building it, expansion is thought of)
Thanks.

[DamonHD]

I can't judge your turbine design, but consistently extracting more than 10kWh per day usable after all losses for anything you can do at your home is a fair achievement.

It's roughly what I get (on average) with my whole house roof full of PV!  It cost a fortune (5 figures) when I did it.

Rgds

Damon

[Bruce S]

Astro;
Luck for this forum, Ed Lenz was/is a forum member !!
Most of his builds can probably be found somewhere within the the deep recesses of this forum, just search for Lenz or possibly Lenz2.

his website is Winstuffnow.com and last I looked his plans were still up there.
NOTE: I'm not sure he still answers emails, but you can always try :-)

Hope this helps

Bruce S

[Astro]

 Yeah I have looked around the internet and youtube for a long time before I decided to take this challenge on. One thing I like about the Lenz design is it is simple. I tend to over think things and so I like it when simple works. Plus like I said I think start up is going to be better with that deign.
 One of the first things I noticed about 99% of vawt attempts, was that they just do not spin very fast. So I decided to try and make a genny that did not need to spin very fast. That solves several issues in my mind. from g forces to the fact that they just can't spin as fast as a hawt. I mean look, if I took the Cummins out of my truck and put in a motor from a Hellcat, I am not going to be able to pull my rv. So torque and hp numbers need to be thought of when building these things. On here, you guys call them tip speed and furloughing. I know it is not the exact same, but many of the properties are the same.
 The thing about my old diesel is it takes a bit to get it moving, and once moving it is hard to slow down, BUT it also just purrs going down the highway at a surprisingly efficient rate for it's size. IF I am in the right gear for the load. Ding ding ding, sounds like something I want my mill to do. That is exactly what the giant mills right outside of my town do. Granted they do it with rotating the blades and such and are more high tech about it all, but that is still the goal in my mind. Now if you have ever looked at a ft.lbs/hp chart for a motor, you will see some similarities to the charts for wind turbines. So to me the ultimate goal of a turbine is to be built so that the ft.lbs and the hp intersect. That is about as good as she is going to run. Since I know the avg wind speed in my yard and area, I know how much "fuel" is available.
The whole thing is rather complicated, even for me and I have a lifetime of experience and am somewhat intelligent. Like I said I have always had team members that were each assigned different parts of a project and so right away I had months and months worth of non stop learning to do. The "flywheel" aspect of all this plays a large part as well as does the blades/wings. Because the easiest way to keep it steady is by thinking of it as a flywheel.
 But I think I am close. I did not like the projected voltage numbers at first and that is mainly because there just is not any good mppt controllers out there for smaller builds. You either have a little box 400w (regulator) with a light on it, or you have the top of the line Midnite capable of 150v. But I think I found something that will work well with my projected numbers. Because the controller is a big part of all this as well. Well, I am done rambling this morning, I am just saying what you all know anyway.
In the end, good news is we are pressing forward. I still think we will be close to having built what we set out to build for our garden art.
Back to my original point, I have been working on or learning about different aspects of this project for about 9 months now and I just wound the coils. Some of that is low funds, but most of it isn't. I have had the magnet wire for months now, because I knew if I had to go any smaller then #14, I did not want to build it. It had to be capable of 20 amps.

[Astro]

Anyway, long story short, I am not saying the Lenz design is the absolute best, there is always room for improvement. BUT II have watched enough of them spin on youtube to notice that no matter how they are built, they tend to spin at a more constant speed. They do not pick up or lose speed fast. Which is what I am after. I have seen some spin at a rpm that should work well with the design of my genny and I have seen others that look like they are huge and weigh more then my genny and turn very slow. So there is a happy medium there for sure.
 But I like the design because they do tend to spin more constant, They are simple. They should provide better start up then a airplane foil style wing. Plus the way I am making mine is so that I can adjust the pitch and that will give me the ability to "tune" the thing better.
 

[Astro]

I wonder if this guy ever found the right combination. This is about the speed I am looking for I think. Notice how he said "it's spinning all day long at this speed". That is a common theme with the Lenz design. Like I said some are faster and some are slower and a lot of that has to do with build quality of the entire unit. But if MagnetJuice's estimation is close, at the speed this is turning, I should be putting out 28 volts or so and that is decent for a 12v battery bank.
 Taking all this into account and the guy in the video saying it was a 5mph wind, I should be able to put out some decent wattage in 12-18 mph winds. (avg is 15 mph here). As the harder it draws amps the slower it is going to want to spin.
 Again the problem is not the mill, it is finding a good controller. Because since it is designed to spin slower, some sort of braking system is needed. We do not want it flying apart in 30mph winds, but we do not want it to completely shut down either. It also should have mppt for optimal performance. Between mppt and a more constant rotational speed, it should perform well.

https://youtu.be/N7XpXRXv-CQ

 In essence, a guy could probably make something that basically keeps track of the voltage and regulates it by allowing more or less amps to be drawn. That is exactly what a mppt does. I have not given this much thought though. So in 5mph winds and 28v (if that is what we get) it may only be allowing 5 amps (or 2 or 7 depending on how much torque one is capturing from the wind.) But in 15mph winds if it was allowing 5 amps to be drawn at 5 mph, it should be allowing more amps to be drawn at 15mph winds, to keep the voltage at said 28v. Then once you hit your max amps (we do not want to melt the coils), you need to brake it with some other form of resistance. Be that turning it out of the wind, mechanical braking or electrical braking to some degree. That is, if you can ever hit max amps. Other then that, you just need a voltage sensing relay and a contactor that shorts all 3 phases when the voltage gets to high (ie big winds).

[Scruff]

[Astro]

Lol.

 Well, what is killing me about the projected voltage is, it falls in a bad spot. A little higher and I have more options at 24v. But I found a controller from China (everything seems to be made there anyway) that handles from 8-80v and does 12v @ 500w and 24v @ 1000w.
 So my plan is to hook it up on a 12v bank and see how it does. It should not be hitting the brakes much as my voltage should not ever hit 80 and yet if I can keep my voltage at 25-30, I should get some amperage out of it. (25v x 20A is 500w)
 I think you want around 18v for a 12v bank and 36v for a 24v bank, but that changes when you put a draw on it. IDK what the real world numbers would be with a 15-20 amp draw on it, but it is safe to say that a guy is probably going to want 10-20v above those 18 and 36v numbers, so something like 28-38v (which is where I should end up at running 120rpm) for a 12v bank and 46-56v for a 24v bank.
Is that about right for voltages in you guys experience with your set ups??

 That 500w is lower then I was shooting for, but it is not far off and hopefully I can run a little more rpm and get up around 150-160. That would help a lot. In the dead of winter or in July when the furnace fan is running more often, I might end up a little short, even if the mill is maxed out, and I might have to kick the load back to the grid for a few hours a day (or more depending on the wind). Or I might just buy a cheap little hawt and put it up next to the garage (there is a 1 1/4 pole there already from what used to be a driveway light I think). It won't do much except when the wind is strong, but it really will not have to do much. I do not like those little things though, they make a lot of noise. Or since the controller is a hybrid, maybe add one solar panel and another 100ah battery or two.
First we need to finish building this one. Lol
AND wow did wire ever get high priced. I need to run 100ft from mill to controller. To keep it under a 2v loss, I need #6 and my God the want 400 plus dollars for 100 ft of #6 UF. Crooks. With the price of wire and lumber, I expect we will go through a building slump here pretty soon, and that is never good for the economy.

[Astro]

Gold plated wire or what?
https://www.menards.com/main/electrical/electrical-wire-cable/outdoor-electrical-cable/uf-b-cable-with-ground-wire/sku3692347/p-1474478927121.htm

Here is the controller I am thinking about. It has the best specs and features of anything I could find in a 12v system.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003430605316.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000014.8.4340c55cKpDCSS&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreOtherSeller&scm=1007.13338.183347.0&scm_id=1007.13338.183347.0&scm-url=1007.13338.183347.0&pvid=e8001379-c4b6-495b-9bb5-368f92ab17fc&_t=gps-id:pcDetailBottomMoreOtherSeller,scm-url:1007.13338.183347.0,pvid:e8001379-c4b6-495b-9bb5-368f92ab17fc,tpp_buckets:668%232846%238115%232000&pdp_ext_f=%257B%2522sku_id%2522%253A%252212000025752056513%2522%252C%2522sceneId%2522%253A%252230050%2522%257D&pdp_pi=-1%253B109.2%253B-1%253B-1%2540salePrice%253BUSD%253Brecommend-recommend


Edit. So It looks like we go this route for wire. That keeps me at about 1 volt drop.
https://www.menards.com/main/electrical/electrical-wire-cable/electrical-service-wire-cable/2-2-2-4-aluminum-mobile-home-feeder-per-foot/3692059/p-1473854610601-c-1525874617506.htm?tid=-4298887979218478272&ipos=4