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401
Controls / Re: Noisy Inverters
« Last post by DamonHD on February 24, 2024, 04:04:39 AM »
I have now relatively old Sunny Boys (1100s and a 1200) more than a decade old, in my loft.

I have not sat next to them at peak generation but I can't say that I've noticed any significant noise from them at all.

Rgds

Damon
402
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 24, 2024, 03:43:17 AM »
@MattM,

I think I have an idea that might work.

What if I just cut the blades horizontally at lets say 30cm spacing. And then we can just space those segments apart at leisure. So we can see in practise what works or not.

If nothing seems to benefit us we can always put them back where they are now as to end up where we started.

But now the question is. How do we determine if a blade segment configuration benefits or not?

I guess it is by using this suitcase measuring device I use to measure how much KG is needed to stop blades from turning.
But the problem with that method is that the wind is always changing so it is rather hard to come up with consistent results like that.
403
Controls / Noisy Inverters
« Last post by SparWeb on February 24, 2024, 02:04:34 AM »
For a long time I had an old Xantrex SW4024 inverter, which was a great workhorse inverter until mice built a nest in it, and it had to be scrapped.  It worked well, but it was loud.  Immediately after installing it in my "battery shed" and switching it on, I thought, "well that's never going in the house".  Louder than a clothes dryer.

Fast-forward a couple of decades and I'm shopping for another inverter, which I would install in the house if it's quiet.  But I can't find one.  All this solid-state switching power supplies replacing coils of copper, but it's still just as noisy.  If an inverter has any noise rating at all (some don't) it's pretty loud, like 60dB.  That's actually quite loud, especially for a noise that is constantly humming away.  The layout of my house puts the systems (electrical, heat, water etc.) in the center and the rooms radiate outward.  That doesn't allow the inverter to be installed far away from bedrooms, the dining room, or the living room. 

Outback doesn't give any noise data, but the installation manual for the Radian says this, "Avoid large air gaps behind the Radian inverter/charger and its mounting plate. These can result in louder mechanical noise during heavy inverting or charging."  LOUDER?

Sunny Boy is 45 dB
SRNE is 60dB
Fronius is "<65dB"

These are all about as loud, or louder, than a clothes dryer.  I can choose to close the door of my laundry room, but the electrical panel, where I would locate an inverter, is not isolated like that.

The Sunny Boy is the quietest I have found.  Can anyone report their experience of the noise emitted by a SB inverter when it's inverting heavy loads?
Another solution is to use string inverters like Enphase, but that limits my options drastically. 

Does anyone know of a quiet grid-tie inverter?
404
Wind / Re: Block diagram for our turbine
« Last post by SparWeb on February 24, 2024, 01:20:47 AM »
Hi Kitestrings,
I find myself looking at the Classics again, which drew me back to this.

I'm curious: what do you do for grid connection, if any?
405
Wind / Re: Classical US multibladed metal wind rotor....?
« Last post by Adriaan Kragten on February 23, 2024, 04:44:56 PM »
I have watched the video of Topspeed. It is a nice explanation of how such a windmill works. However, there is one substantial mistake. It is said that the vane is in parallel to the wind if the rotor turns out op the wind but this isn't correct. As the rotor has a certain eccentricity e and as the rotor has a certain thrust Ft, the rotor moment Mr = Ft * e. This rotor moment must be in balance with the vane moment Mv around the tower axis. The vane moment is the product of the force on the vane blade Fv and the vane radius rv at the aeodynamic centre of the vane blade. So Mv = Fv * rv. Fv is about linear to the angle of attack alfa in between the vane blade and the wind direction. You only get a certain Fv if the vane blade makes a certain angle alfa with the wind direction. So the vane blade is never in parallel to the wind direction for stationairy conditions. The angle alfa depends on the vane geometry and the wind speed. The higher the wind speed, the smaller the angle. The vane moment due to the aerodynamic force on the vane blade around the vane axis must also be in balance with the spring moment Ms around the vane axis.

This safety system is called the ecliptic safety system and more information about it is given in my public report KD 409. I have used a torsion spring around the vane axis because the spring moment of a torsion spring increases only a little for an increasing angle of rotation around the vane axis. The moment of a tension spring varies a lot because the distance of the heart of the spring and the heart of the vane axis is very dependent of the angle of rotation of the vane arm. I have chosen that the tower axis coincides with the vane axis because this simplifies the moment equations a lot.
406
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by Bruce S on February 23, 2024, 04:00:29 PM »
Mary B
With the flash point of new motor oil being above 200C , I'm now inclined to give it a try :-) too.
I think I might take the dog out for a walk and give that an extra thought.
Any leak will certainly help in during the discovery part  ;D.

I'll keep moving forward on the sand stuff since I already have a little bit of working knowledge with it. AND I was smart enough to grab a decent pair of FF gloves!!
My other concern is insulating the external tin can. 

Bruce S





407
Newbies / Re: electronics learning kits
« Last post by Mary B on February 23, 2024, 11:08:30 AM »
Quote from: SparWeb on February 22, 2024, 11:35:27 PM
I still have a bunch of those.
I was given my first Mims book (the very one in your picture) when I was 14 years old.  Learning to build little oscillators with 555's and other projects.
The 200-in-1 project kits came soon after.

Thanks for the memories, JW!  :)

I worked as a manager of a radio shack franchise when I was 16... sold a TOM of the Mims books!
408
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by Mary B on February 23, 2024, 11:05:33 AM »
Quote from: brandnewb on February 23, 2024, 09:57:57 AM
@MaryB,

I just got refunded my purchase of the F&P :(

Randy tells me that shipping is an additional 102 USD :(

I would have loved to play around with something like that. And indeed the stacking suggestion you made really is attractive to me.

Anyhow let's look forwards!

I know you can find one in EU... heck go to an appliance store and ask if you can raid a bad washing machine for parts. They were widely used there before coming to the USA.

Another possible choice is an ECM motor from a heating/cooling system. Used to drive the big squirrel cage fan on forced air systems.
409
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by Mary B on February 23, 2024, 11:02:06 AM »
Tube in tube I would use oil as the heated medium... minimal expansion that could be handled by an expansion chamber keeping working pressure low to non existent...

Just a thought. Could even recycle used motor oil as the heated medium, filtered to get rid of particulates. Oil is a pretty decent heat exchange medium, better than air./sand would be. Downside is any leaks would make a mess...
410
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by Bruce S on February 23, 2024, 10:24:32 AM »
SparWeb;
He's pretty good at details and generally answers emails and posts.
Having played around with this tin can and using heat from a few different sources, I think I'm going to stay away from any liquid addition to the sand.
In fact I'm working on  cooking the sand as dry as possible, since I'm leaning towards as close to a closed loop system as possible, along with a pressure gauge & relief valve of some sort.

Back when I had my Mercedes 5cyl 300TD I got around to "remembering" how to build a tube-in-tube system and found that the cooling system worked great  to pre-heat the Bio-D. I of course added a few extra temp probes (Both digital and analog) Analog cause I'm nostalgic for swing needles  ;D as I was curious about the returning fuel's temps.
I also remember the disaster here when a steam boiler failed and launched itself killing two onsite and two people who had just started a new job 60+ meters away.
The video liked below gives a very good recreation of what happens.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Bs6W19cLcY
I know from reading a bunch of your posts and answers to other posts, you understand THE DANGERS when doing these sort of tests and I know JW is a steam guru, BUT anyone else reading these needs to watch the video so they are aware of how quickly things can get deadly  :-[.

I'm also remembering surface contact is vital to extracting the stored energy in an efficient way. OF course all this Mechanical engineering math gets my brain to hurting again and I need to take libation breaks often  8). I still have an old 1M satellite dish that I may setup as a sorta of heliostat to gain a few extra temps.
I've also done some of handed testing of capturing waste heat from our gas dryer by using a few soldered together tins to pump a little warmer air into the house , I borrowed a few surplussed air monitors to make sure there wasn't any nasty un-burned hydrocarbons trying to give me a headache.

I do like the use of tin cans, as they are free, can take a pretty high heat and solder together nicely too. Using the surface area of them I can do these trails pretty cheaply. Also when I ran out of solder I tested a few connections using the Flex-Tape, that worked surprisingly well for a short term test.

Sorry for the disjointed reply;
It's been a busy week  :o

Bruce S





411
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by brandnewb on February 23, 2024, 10:06:29 AM »
I am glad I made your weekend brother. Love is indeed the intend.

So I actually mean Hz in voltage waveform. Like on the oscope pictures I share from time to time.

Given there are 96 magnets on a single rotor disk that rotate fully every 12.something {1}closer to the 13 mark{/1} seconds that equates to around 4 RPM and around 3.7Hz of full voltage waveform.

I realize it is a bold goal. I think I can get there.

Now I am ok if we forget about magnets to watts. Let us focus on how to quantify things this early in the prototyping stage yes?

All I care about is to be able to say something that people will believe. And also not to just build and build only to find I missed something crucial ending up with an alternator that does next to nothing.

Quote from: MagnetJuice on February 23, 2024, 02:36:24 AM
Quote from: brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 08:14:19 AM
Also Ed, You know that I love you so that is why I have not send back the 16 magnets yet.

That's the second time that someone told me that they love me today. Cool, that's a good way to start my weekend.  :D

Hz is cycles per second. 3.7 cycles, or magnets passes over the coils in 1 second equals 222 RPM.

Is that how fast you want the turbine to spin?

I am sure that you mean 3.7 RPM and not 3.7 Hz. Right?

Ed
412
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by brandnewb on February 23, 2024, 09:57:57 AM »
@MaryB,

I just got refunded my purchase of the F&P :(

Randy tells me that shipping is an additional 102 USD :(

I would have loved to play around with something like that. And indeed the stacking suggestion you made really is attractive to me.

Anyhow let's look forwards!

413
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 23, 2024, 09:31:04 AM »
also, please allow me to be perfectly clear.

I am complaining a lot about charlatans and snake oil.

None of the people that interact with me here are addressed. It is mostly the endless videos I can find online and also of course the cheap products sold as a gazzilion KW alternator from our friends in the east.

On top of that I have seen quite a few "start ups" selling/promoting their "new" design. It's out there and it's rampant.

I am mad because I fell victim once. Because back then I was just as clueless as I am to this very day. Hmm ok a bit less now than back then.

So hence my nagging about how to quantify things.
In essence it is not about me being able to show that I have something great. Of course that would be great if that results from all of this.
But the real goal is to be able to fend off or hold accountable the many many scams out there.

Wind has a bad reputation because it has been abused for far too long.

it is my mission in life to do something about that!.
414
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 23, 2024, 09:10:37 AM »
@MattM,

So these original cups are holding on longer than I expected. I had expected them to be pulp by now.

So now is a good time to start punching holes in them.

Can you suggest some kind of pattern? Or how much surface area should stay intact. those kind of things.

And as always. Even if we do not get it optimal or even right the first try. It is the thought that counts!
415
How to work with images / Re: How to attach pictures
« Last post by JW on February 23, 2024, 07:09:43 AM »
Hopefully Flavio will see this. When we were finished with all work we did I took him off the PHP database. I did this so no one can get blamed if something bad happens. Also he wouldn't accept any ,payments for work being done, I don't like that. He is a professional sub contractor for us.
416
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by MagnetJuice on February 23, 2024, 02:36:24 AM »
Quote from: brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 08:14:19 AM
Also Ed, You know that I love you so that is why I have not send back the 16 magnets yet.

That's the second time that someone told me that they love me today. Cool, that's a good way to start my weekend.  :D

Hz is cycles per second. 3.7 cycles, or magnets passes over the coils in 1 second equals 222 RPM.

Is that how fast you want the turbine to spin?

I am sure that you mean 3.7 RPM and not 3.7 Hz. Right?

Ed
417
How to work with images / Re: How to attach pictures
« Last post by SparWeb on February 22, 2024, 11:51:25 PM »
I'm unable to post pictures.

When I click submit, I get "path cannot be empty" error.  If I try to submit a second time (even if I delete the attach reference and clear the file from the upload) another error pops up: "you already submitted this post!".

It gets stuck there if I don't back out to the forum, re-open the thread, and try to post again, fresh.

For the same reasons I can't attach screen-shots of the problem, but I did take a couple. :/
418
Newbies / Re: electronics learning kits
« Last post by SparWeb on February 22, 2024, 11:35:27 PM »
I still have a bunch of those.
I was given my first Mims book (the very one in your picture) when I was 14 years old.  Learning to build little oscillators with 555's and other projects.
The 200-in-1 project kits came soon after.

Thanks for the memories, JW!  :)
419
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by SparWeb on February 22, 2024, 11:29:51 PM »
Hey, that's the same video I just saw, Bruce.  The Youtube algorithm knows we know each other now.

I've been mulling over the usefulness of water, just like Mary suggested.  I think the ability to heat the sand up above 300F, or higher than boiling water is an advantage that you can't use if you add water.  If it's a closed loop, some glycol in the water would help use higher temperatures.  The mixture of sand and water might also be a problem if it needs filtering, silt traps drains, etc., to work for a long period of time.

Tube-in-tube heat exchange is the standard, taught to every mechanical engineer in thermodynamics class.  If you build one, remember to include temperature sensors on inlets and outlets.  A simple feedback control makes a big difference in the efficiency, worth the effort.

To keep it as KISS as possible, what can be done with a simple tank of sand with an electric heater in it?  One thing is to just use it like an old-fashioned cottage stove - it heats the room by radiating its heat through the sides.  Careful not to touch it though.  For a small insulated building, this could make a big difference.

Another way is to pass the ductwork in your house through a sand tank.  This sounds like it would work, as long as the sand makes lots of surface contact with the duct, or else the air will blow by without picking up much heat.  Think of a basement air duct about 8 inches diameter and you fit a 12" duct around it, filled with sand and some lengths of nichrome wire encapsulated.  Wrap the outside of the 12" duct with insulation so that the sand doesn't just heat the basement.  When the central heating blows air from the furnace, it will be heated a second time by the sand heater.  The central thermostat will detect the house warming up faster, and will shut off the furnace sooner.  The furnace would not run as much, saving on heating.  If the sand heater is driven by PV, the electricity is free.  It would take some math to figure out if the amount of energy collected this way and the heat-exchange process would add up to a noticeable effect.
420
Wind / Re: Classical US multibladed metal wind rotor....?
« Last post by topspeed on February 22, 2024, 07:33:45 PM »
Explained: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BugXmDxC0WM
421
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 03:39:54 PM »
And please all you have got to see this!

It is about how difficult it is to back down to a statement one made early on.

Especially if it has gotten a lot of traction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6R9cIDjXH2k
(JW, you and I both know this is just and ID QS yes?)

Now I for one am just so blunt that it is rather easy for me to admit when I made a mistake.


Yet what if I had to back track after acclaim?

422
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 03:31:36 PM »
I am at the service of the greater good.
423
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 03:12:14 PM »
I am actually thankful JW. Now I have again in my playlist this song!!

And in some ways I think what you tried to tell me is that I am needed.

Thank you JW!


Quote from: JW on February 12, 2024, 04:25:32 PM
Reply

Here my obvious looking/.

For Me its ben posting videos

The system, login
424
Newbies / Re: electronics learning kits
« Last post by Mary B on February 22, 2024, 11:55:22 AM »
Many of the Radio Shack electronics books in PDF format for free download... the Mims books are about halfway down... TON of very valid info in here!

https://www.worldradiohistory.com/BOOKSHELF-ARH/Technology/Radio-Shack/
425
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 11:53:19 AM »
nooooooo. even before the storm hit, yeah sure things are picking up already here, I already have to take her down.

It is the part that prevents the upper bearing from slipping down that is in serious need of redesign.

nooo. Now I have missed this window op opportunity to see thing horribly go wrong :(
426
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 10:34:15 AM »
ohh wow,

Now I am getting nervous!

I tried keeping the Phoenix on a diet. So far that has been working out rather nice.

But what If the guy wires decide to go on a strike?

Then the whole bird will actually fly!!


hmmm.

hmm.

I will reconsider going full steel or maybe even lead ;) who cares about the health impact of lead anyways ;)
427
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 10:09:51 AM »
So I have some time again now.

I am back again at an IR (inner radius) of 600mm because that will roughly double the velocity at which the magnets spin over the coils and roughly double the area we get for the coil wires to play in.

But to my shock I was unable to measure/demonstrate the expected effect.
You see I tried using a 25 winds coil at the original (600mm IR, 3.75 interval, traditional, dual rotor, single stator) and got crap results. Not at all what I expected.

So now I need to figure out what it is I am doing wrong. And yes I did check the proper connection to the oscope  ;D

{1}I would love it if anyone would just blurp out any random thought of what can be going on here and/or how to zero in on a possible root cause.{/1}
{2}Also the most important revelation to me is that one should not be looking for a straight line in magnetic fields in between rotors. Some dispersion adjacent wise will actually help for the coil shapes I am considering.{/2}
428
Logged in diaries / Re: VAWT backyard experiements
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 09:49:23 AM »
brace for impact!!!

are going to be my infamous last words if storm Louis, that will be here tonight, has anything to say about that.

Now I am going to do something stupid. I am leaving the Phoenix errect. I did fortify the guywires though.

I just need to see what will happen so I can learn what to focus on next iteration.
429
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by brandnewb on February 22, 2024, 08:14:19 AM »
So gang. first most please accept my humble apologies for being stubborn.

It is one of those self defense mechanisms that kick in when information gets too difficult for me to process in a, for me, suitable time frame so I just default back to where I was.

It is nothing personal nor will it ever be.

So here is my update thus far.

!!If at any time someone feels I should demonstrate because something does not make sense then please do so to signal that. Because then I will and maybe we find I blundered again.
If it all makes sense to you then I am also content to just go with this flow!!

Context: 300mm radius ID of magnets spaced at a 3.75 degree interval.
Considering non stacked (traditionally spaced with an air gap of around 20mm (4 times that of the magnet thickness) 24 coils per phase) coils even though wider of nature than stacked coils will need about 280 winds to end up in the 2.something volts sphere.
While when stacking coils (48 per phase) in this context only needs coils to be 50 winds to end up in the 1.something sphere of volts.

And I think I can explain why.
You see magnetic fields when induced by electromagnets (the coils) they do interfere with each other. But then in a good way. In where overlapping phases compound.
And here comes the kicker!! The adjacent pole in the same phase does not counteract the other. Not al all!

I just love magnetic fields soo much ;) If only I understood them ;)

Overmore the field around said coils is non biased for direction. It is a sphere so that means that my earlier worry of having tilted coils would harm the interaction with the magnets seems debunked.
But I know for sure once I start the torque tests. Now I am still in the finding out what configuration actually stands a chance of getting where I need to get.

Anyway all this has set me back on track with the original plan to go for a large diameter. a 300mm ID {1}inner radius{/1}was just to see. Now I have seen and I can tell. Nah that diameter will never work for my goals of having 52vAC at 3.7Hz (yes it is 3.7Hz not 3.8Hz like I have been mentioning earlier)

Also Ed, You know that I love you so that is why I have not send back the 16 magnets yet. I will keep them ready and waiting so that later on once I have some real life data I can setup a gear ratio to have this suggested setup spin around 20 times faster than what I am making. Just to compare results.
In case my configuration lacks behind then we have a clear indication why not to go with a direct drive for a low RPM VAWT.

I have more to say but no time to write it now.


430
Newbies / Re: electronics learning kits
« Last post by JW on February 22, 2024, 03:15:33 AM »
Forest Mims  "mini notebooks"
 https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2540003.m570.l1313&_nkw=forest+Mims+mini+notebooks&_sacat=0



https://www.ebay.com/itm/254495705263?itmmeta=01HQ7Y65PC89JS7MP9PKA5NHNV
431
Newbies / Re: electronics learning kits
« Last post by JW on February 22, 2024, 02:47:48 AM »
 




 https://www.ebay.com/itm/404797311302?itmmeta=01HQ7WA3DF5FSZJDCFPSC4S1HV
 

HAAA!
I knew I could find the kit with the bread board  :)
432
Newbies / Re: electronics learning kits
« Last post by JW on February 22, 2024, 02:28:39 AM »
https://www.ebay.com/itm/134940591650

433
Newbies / electronics learning kits
« Last post by JW on February 22, 2024, 01:46:37 AM »

 https://www.google.com/search?q=electronic+learning+kits+200+and+wiz-serp
 https://www.ebay.com/itm/116017994233?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/9VgAAOSwOnRlhhgO/s-l1600.jpg



https://www.ebay.com/itm/116017994233?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0
434
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by Mary B on February 21, 2024, 07:54:01 PM »
Saturate the sand with a liquid that works well to transfer heat... if it is a closed system you could even use waste oil from changing it on the car/truck/SUV...
435
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by Bruce S on February 21, 2024, 11:47:42 AM »
machinemaker;
The little "test" units I built convinced me that going the route of tube-in-tube . Might be called heat exchangers.
My old Mercedes had two copper tubes, one inside the other, I plumbed the outside pipe through my coolant system that in-turn warmed up the bio-diesel.
The guy who bought the car was schooled on how it all worked and why I had two separate fuel tanks.
 I'll dig around and see if I still have a pic of the setup.

I found that heating the sand is actually quite easy, but getting the sand to give up the heat was much harder.
So I'm going to rebuild it and use the tube-in-tube heat exchange setup to see if it's a bit better.
I'm thinking of building a heliostat to use the sun directly to heat the sand area rather than rely on diversion dump loads to connected to a NiChr bank heater.

Cheers
Bruce S
436
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by machinemaker on February 21, 2024, 10:55:10 AM »
Back in the 60s or 70s I used to see articles and ads for plans for sand heat storage. This was before outdoor wood furnaces became as popular. The idea was that you had a wood-fired stove in a small building, the exhaust from the stove went through a system of stove pipe above the stove. All of this was enclosed in a well-insulated small building. The space around the stove and the walls of the building was filled with sand. In the sand, tubing was laid out to heat water or ductwork to heat air. The idea was that the wood stove would burn hot and fast, and the heat transferred to the sand for storage.  I have considered doing something similar to heat a greenhouse, but surround the wood stove with old and patched water heater tanks, plumbed in series or two series. Then fill this well-insulated building,( 2 x 6 walls with 2” bead board on the interior) filled with sand. I figure I can get 8 forty gallon tanks around the wood stove. All the tanks would be non-pressurized and vented.
437
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by Bruce S on February 21, 2024, 09:45:48 AM »
Yes I have  ;D.
I used an old toaster NiChr to build one using a couple tins and cheap play sand.
Worked pretty well to heat the sand, but getting the heat back out of the sand is a lot harder than even I expected.
I'm currently working on redoing it by using a tube-in-tube setup like I did for my bio-diesel heating system.
Below is a link of the vid that I used to model mine from.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Icai6OOIh2M

Hope this helps
Bruce S
438
Wind / Re: axial generator with lamination core
« Last post by mbouwer on February 21, 2024, 08:06:21 AM »


9 coils / 12 magnets.
According to the Bavaria Winding Diagram Table, 9 coils / 10 magnets would be a better combination.

Attachments: mini axiaal ..JPG * mini axiaal ..JPG

439
Wind / Re: Classical US multibladed metal wind rotor....?
« Last post by MattM on February 21, 2024, 06:46:27 AM »
Primitive central American versions

440
Wind / Re: Classical US multibladed metal wind rotor....?
« Last post by topspeed on February 21, 2024, 03:23:11 AM »
Quote from: mbouwer on February 13, 2024, 06:32:10 AM
(Attachment Link)

In the eighties I made a multi bladed mill with a downward drive and there a transmission drove a dynamo.

Awesome where is this ?
441
Wind / Re: Classical US multibladed metal wind rotor....?
« Last post by topspeed on February 21, 2024, 03:21:53 AM »
One displayed on this music video.



442
Storage / Re: Sand Batteries
« Last post by DamonHD on February 21, 2024, 03:16:32 AM »
Heard of them.  I have a small non-sand heat battery at home.

Rgds

Damon
443
Storage / Sand Batteries
« Last post by SparWeb on February 20, 2024, 11:29:37 PM »
Anybody heard of them?  Tried to build one?

I just heard about this, and saw a video about building one.  This "battery" is meant to store heat, not electricity.  There are a few examples in commercial use or experiments, and I found a DIY video on Youtube.
444
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by JW on February 20, 2024, 02:06:19 PM »
Here check this out don't be afraid of the link...

   Maxitronix 200 in 1 Electronic Project Lab - Educational Fun Basic Electronics


https://www.ebay.com/itm/325986261679?chn=ps&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1w69pfJeBT_G2HVVkGUhmcw63&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&mkscid=101&itemid=325986261679&targetid=1585159290171&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9013362&poi=&campaignid=19894961968&mkgroupid=148855406073&rlsatarget=aud-1317302328205:pla-1585159290171&abcId=9307911&merchantid=603800276&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg6Obms26hAMVUBmtBh0skwz4EAQYBCABEgJ0A_D_BwE

Before there was Forest Mims

The projects will at least teach you how to read a schematic diagrams
445
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by brandnewb on February 20, 2024, 03:48:15 AM »
So preliminary results show that a repelling {1}double density single rotor, dual stator{/1} setup is indeed a dead end and quite frankly a bit of a foolhardy idea to begin with ;).
I can only get a few winds in a coil at best before the coil gets so tall (2 maybe 3 layers only) the field already drops to unusable values.
So finally I can close the books on that concept.

Now it is still the question "to stack coils or not to stack coils".
But I am leaning against it because although I have not yet demonstrated it I am not sure what the magnetic field in the coils will do when they are tilted diagonally slightly. I can only imagine it will not benefit the interaction between that field and the magnets.

Another, perhaps far more important reason not to stack coils. One that I have demonstrated already is that with having coils stack then heat dissipation rates drop to near zero. Ok truth be told I have not really sunk my teeth into that problem yet to see if I can fix that.

Anyway. I can generate around 1.17vAC at around 3.8Hz with a single stacked coil pair when each coil in that pair has 50 winds (I am ignoring coil{2}wire{/2} size for now).
And theoretically we can have 48 of those stacked pairs per phase making for around 56vAC at 3.8Hz. In practise I will need some empty coil slots at every stator segment else not be able to (de)install it in a modular fashion.

For traditionally spaced coils we can have 24 coils per phase. But the good thing about the coil shape in this scenario is that it can be wider. Maybe even enough more wide to compensate for the extra winds needed to be able to reach around 2.1vAC per coil at 3.8Hz.
And then of course all the added benefit mentioned earlier.

reporting back once I managed to figure out how much winds that is.

446
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by MagnetJuice on February 20, 2024, 02:03:59 AM »
QUOTE from MagnetJuice:
After your many requests for help, I'll agree to help you with the design of the alternator for your Phoenix VAWT.

QUOTE from brandnewb:
Thank you Ed,
This means the world to me!

QUOTE from MagnetJuice:
I don't know how successful I will be in getting you back on the road, but I am going to give it a shot.

I failed.  :(

QUOTE from brandnewb:
Now what I am looking for is either to hear "sounds like a plan" or "nah this is a bogus plan and I will tell you why"

I told you why but somehow you missed it.

QUOTE from brandnewb:
I will report back once I have reached my goal.

I have no idea what your goal is but carry on, and the best of luck.

Ed
447
Coil winding / Re: How to determine the lmits of a coil / magnet configuration
« Last post by brandnewb on February 19, 2024, 10:17:39 PM »
the topic seemed to be headed into the right direction with early contributions of Joestru and MaryB but then got really confusing with images of alternators that clearly will not help both getting an answer to this topic and second to my overall goal of reaching a high voltage at low RPM.

And then to think all I wanted was to stay focussed on a clear goal.

I even reminded about that here in this thread.

I will report back once I have reached my goal.

Quote from: brandnewb on February 08, 2024, 01:42:10 PM
Thx guys for the input.

Yet I feel we are diverting from the matter at hand.

Please focus solely and only on the matter at hand as outlined below;
 
1) create a bunch of different test coils varying from 0.4mm diam wire size to 1mm diam. and also in shape.

Do make sure that the 0.4mm wire coils are at all times 4 x more winds than the 1mm one. As one can fit only 4 times that wire in the same space of a 1mm one.

2) run various magnet configurations over all variations of the coils at the intended frequency. for single density that would be around 3.8 Hz and for double density that would be double that.

3) record what voltage each coil can produce at said frequencies,

4) hook up an Variable Frequency Drive to the variac at the intended frequency and at the voltage level it would have produced while induced by the magnets spinning.

5) now measure the magnetic field on each coil making sure to also take into account the depth and area it encompasses ( larger is better for breaking ability)


Now what I am looking for is either to hear "sounds like a plan" or "nah this is a bogus plan and I will tell you why"
448
Temporary power / Re: When the power goes out
« Last post by JW on February 19, 2024, 07:56:56 PM »

 I feel the same about these battery bank systems. These battery systems are just too new. Also I don't like the 600v to 800v running volt systems. there's been concerns from first responders with auto accidents. I've seen fire trucks hose down the batt banks and after 10 hours they still cant put them out.

I preferer a low voltage systems(100v max DC) myself. We all know there is a need for better battery systems. During with my work with my invention of a "4 cycle steam engine" I also patented (for education) a variable lift direct injection valve. In order to make  it lift it needed water cool the electromagnetic coil conductor. We can do better with high amp low volt systems.

I actually patented the thing   https://patents.google.com/patent/US8261575B1/en
It uses centrifugal force at running speeds to self pump the coolant thru the armature coil wires. 

its a low voltage traction motor design for an EV. Why cant we have EV that will burnout and smoke the tires like a hotrod.

There should different types of EV's       
449
Temporary power / Re: When the power goes out
« Last post by ChrisOlson on February 19, 2024, 10:18:40 AM »
Quote from: XeonPony on February 19, 2024, 09:51:28 AM
Tesla used the worst possible battery chem to claim the range, Compare to the Nissan leaf has never had a battery fire, but they can't boast the range, just bullet proof reliability, sadly most them are copying Teslas sh*t battery system, so we'll be seeing more fires.

the more energy dense the battery is the more fragile it is to keep it from spontaneous release of said energy.

For our daughter it was a rather expensive lesson. These things are piling up on car lots and they can't sell them. I think I read where one of the major car rental outfits is dumping their EV fleet and going back to gas engines because the EV's are too expensive to operate and maintain. Which is going to further depress the used market for them. Like all fads, they hit their peak and then reality sets in.
450
Temporary power / Re: When the power goes out
« Last post by XeonPony on February 19, 2024, 09:51:28 AM »
Quote from: ChrisOlson on August 04, 2022, 10:27:15 PM
We had a Tesla that caught on fire here on County V over the weekend. It reportedly quit going down the road. The two people in it got out and noticed smoke coming out of it. They got away from it before it exploded. It caught on fire just after lunch last Saturday. The fire dept worked on putting it out, but it was still burning on Sunday morning. It got so hot it melted the road and set that on fire, set the ditch on fire, thankfully it was by a swamp so they kept the fire from spreading. But they used 13,000 gallons of water just to keep it cool enough so the asphalt in the road wouldn't keep burning.

It is now like a superfund cleanup site. The amount of water required to control it resulted in groundwater contamination right by a swamp. A few thousand yards of dirt, and a section of the road have to be dug out and hauled to a toxic landfill someplace, and then replaced and the site restored. They've been testing the material removed and it was more extensive than originally thought. There's toxic materials still coming out of the site and they've hauled 30-some dump truck loads out so far. Out here in the country they didn't have the convenience of a storm drain system like they have in cities that could capture the toxic runoff.

Plus not sure who's going to pay for it. Lithium batteries are hazardous materials and are subject to DOT's Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR; 49 CFR Parts 171–180). It's illegal to even ship one under 49 CFR section 173.185 without all the proper hazmat insurance and paperwork. And then they put them in electric cars? They're going to have to include an environmental hazardous materials surcharge on EV insurance because when one catches on fire they are an environmental disaster, and they are extremely dangerous. This is well known, but little is done about it because they are the latest political posturing statement that politicians can use to claim they're gonna "save the planet".


Daughter has had zero luck getting rid of her Tesla. We bought her a nice Jeep Compass and she's stopped making the payments on the Tesla. She's gonna let the bank take it. Not really all that great for her credit rating, but at this point she has no choice. Elon Musk is a fraud anyway that has sucked millions of people into his scams that he funds with taxpayer dollars thru government subsidies, including Tesla. If you're interested, there's a pretty good series that presents the facts.

https://youtu.be/c-FGwDDc-s8

https://youtu.be/DopFo1rjAr4

Tesla used the worst possible battery chem to claim the range, Compare to the Nissan leaf has never had a battery fire, but they can't boast the range, just bullet proof reliability, sadly most them are copying Teslas sh*t battery system, so we'll be seeing more fires.

the more energy dense the battery is the more fragile it is to keep it from spontaneous release of said energy.
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