Fieldlines.com: The Otherpower discussion board
Remote Living => Housing => Topic started by: JMaris on May 07, 2010, 09:10:12 AM
-
I was just wondering if anyone on here has built a greenhouse on there place? I am in the process of moving out of town and my wife and I am wanting to put in a greenhouse when we get out there.
-
Do a search of the board for "Green House" I know there is allot of storys on them and pics also.
-
Ok. Thats probably where I was messing up. I was searching for greenhouse instead of green house. I need to go back and take 5th grade english again...
-
That got me thinking about being up in Vermont a few years ago. This recently built greenhouse had lots of 6" PVC pipes coming out of the floor. A large fan and plenum feed them with air. Low cost ground heating for frost!
-
I was just wondering if anyone on here has built a greenhouse on there place?
JMaris,
Yes to your question, we have.
"Do a search of the board for "Green House" I know there is allot of story's on them and pics also".
Good advise from harley....
If you could be a little more specific on a greenhouse question, I'm sure you'll get plenty of answers.
Just my experience here and other forums.
Rick
-
I don't have any specific questions, just trying to find out who has experience with them. I am hoping to get some pointers or do's and don't do's. This is still completely in the thought and planning process. With nothing set in stone, I am open to any ideas. We are thinking about going with a 12x16 or something to that affect. We don't need it to be huge. We just want something to grow fresh produce durring the cold months.
-
I don't have any specific questions, just trying to find out who has experience with them. I am hoping to get some pointers or do's and don't do's. This is still completely in the thought and planning process. With nothing set in stone, I am open to any ideas. We are thinking about going with a 12x16 or something to that affect. We don't need it to be huge. We just want something to grow fresh produce durring the cold months.
Hi,
If you don't want to be putting a lot of energy/money into heating it, I'd go with a solar greenhouse design. Some discussed here: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Sunspace/sunspaces.htm
Solar greenhouses in colder climates usually have some form of double glazing and insulation on the surfaces not glazed.
I like the book: The Homeowner's Complete Handbook For Add- On Solar Greenhouses and Sunspaces, Andrew Shapiro
Its out of print, but available at places like Amazon.com used books.
Gary
-
The store bought stuff isn't cheap, either. The better green houses use UV protected plastics. Otherwise every couple of years you will have to replace the panels.
If you need to start plants before the last chance of frost in the spring, indoors under a grow light or by a south facing window is a lot cheaper.
-
I made a 10x10' greenhouse about 8 yrs ago thinking we'd grow some tomatoes at least. It still hasn't had any plants in it...it ended up getting used as more of a tool/potting shed since it's so small. It kind of makes me mad since I built it for Fathers Day and even got him a misting setup that's still in the box..oh well...
My advice is to use 2x4 and plywood and build it like a tiny barn. The metal strips people use to hold their trusses together aren't as nice looking as plywood. I cut everything to size first and applied a lot of sealer before assembling. Mine sits on a concrete pad so the footer is a treated 4x4. We got a roll of fiberglass sheeting for the sides and corrugated stuff for the roof...both have held up pretty well but the roofing looks a little old now.
If you plan ahead you can probably get it done in a long weekend like I did. My only real advice is to make sure it's big enough before you start.
-
Thanks for the ideas guys. We are definitely going to go with a solar green house. Given, we don't have very harsh winters, but I think a solar green house will be the best option for growing year round. Since we haven't even moved out to our new place yet, we have a little time to get everything figured out before we "break ground". I already found a good mister at Sam's Club for $35 that we are going to pick up on thursday. I priced the clear PVC "green house" panels at Lowe's today and they were $26 for a 26'x12' sheet. Now I have to do some more research and then some designing. I will definitely keep everyone updated and will take tons of pics when we get the build going.
-
I just use single layer greenhouse poly coldframes. On one I used 16 fool long 3/4 inch gray pvc conduit pipe as the hoops and used pvc plumbing tees and crosses to attach the 4 foot cross pieces. I put short pieces of rebar in the ground and used pvc cross fitting to be able to slip the hoops over the rebar. The plastic is held in place with short pieces of split pipe bent back and slipped over the plastic and pipe. Some I drilled and screwed to make permanent. The end plastic is held the same way so I can easily take off and get in or vent. I grow tomatoes and other heat loving plants in the summer and then the next spring start peas and greens. When they are well established I pick the whole thing up and move the rebar to a new spot to grow tomatoes again. So I have a 9 by 16 foot enclosed space that has dual use and then a good rotation.
I also did a small one this year with 10 foot hoops to enclose a 7 by 9 foot area with logs on the ground to hold the plastic on. That was to protect some early transplants. It was only temporary and is now done. I bought a 100 foot roll of green house plastic a few years ago and will last me for many years.
chris
-
Hey Hydrosun, do you have any pictures of your setup? Hopefully we will be closing on the land this week, so I will have some pictures in the next few weeks of my land, setup and eventually the build.
-
I don't have any specific questions, just trying to find out who has experience with them. I am hoping to get some pointers or do's and don't do's. This is still completely in the thought and planning process. With nothing set in stone, I am open to any ideas. We are thinking about going with a 12x16 or something to that affect. We don't need it to be huge. We just want something to grow fresh produce durring the cold months.
JMaris,
Ours is actually attached to the garage ("Lean-To" type).
In your planning & design, do include a ventilation system. We have found this be 1 of the most important aspects of growing
healthy plants & veggies.
-
solar green house
I hope I don't come off as Mister Knowitall ::), but I think all green houses are solar.
I think what you are after is a way to keep the heat after the sun warms everything up.
What you want to look at are things like aquaponic (fish-tanks) as thermal storage, very few well thought out and precisely placed windows, if you are in the southwest USA like us, you'll not need a transparent roof, too much heat loss through the roof, insulate the crap out of the roof and get the windows where they will get gentle morning sun, not so much of the long wave radiation from afternoon sun
On the other hand you can do like I did and use the home for the night-time heat source
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foutfitnm.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fgreenhouse2.JPG&hash=27b5621b8e2f62e14d7bd70e5390c3c0f351da06)
I employed recycled glass, yes that is a shower door ;D
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foutfitnm.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fgreenhouse3.JPG&hash=b6497beb03c89f515a440c619ba03d4660c11d4b)
Many people say forget wood, even painted it'll rot too quickly. We hope to remove the pink 1957 mobile home trailer behind the glass before this happens
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foutfitnm.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fgreenhouse4.JPG&hash=6fdc7ac4fc8253ce4f3c78feca232efb1f98503c)
BTW these sliding-glass doors I used for windows are often free and readily available, but remember something I forgot, they are big, awkward and heavy, no doubt the culprits which caused my sciatica
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foutfitnm.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fgreenhouse5.JPG&hash=337ae0ec7913de0abc70581eaddcd537473ecc1d)
This isn't my first greenhouse, second actually, the first one had a Lascolite (fiberglass reinforced composite panels) roof www.kemlite.com/pdf/2671_mb_tech.pdf It was way too hot in the greenhouse in the Summer.
-
Jmaris
Sorry i don't have any pictures. But the design isn't very critical. Just light weight Pvc conduit arch to form hoops. snow loads can be a problem so it needs to be shoveled off or more bracing put in for the winter. Duct tape can be used to hold things together or use plumbing fittings. Look at commercial hoop houses using steel pieces for design ideas. I've also seen people using metal conduit for the hoops. I've also got a few 12 by 6 foot coldframes I made with ferro cement for the sides back and low front and then a pvc framework covered with poly for the top. The top can be be swiveled up to step into the planting area. I've used them for the last 20 years. The back is about 4 feet high and the front 1 foot, giving a steep angle for the cover. I just take the cover off in the summer heat or prop it up if growing heat loving plants. So there are all kinds of simple cold frames to give a longer growing season.
Chris
-
We've got one I built back in the late 80's and it works well. We live in a harsh winter-time area and need it to grow anything at all. What the weather does not kill off, the wildlife gets if planted outdoors.
Ours is about 12' by 22'. I used wood to frame and then glazed it with patio glass door replacement units, just the glass, which these days comes double-paned mostly. I bought a crate of them, ten in all, from a glass co.
Now there are available many options for using a plastic, double and even triple panels. If I were building today, I would go with one of those. They are expensive, but they are also easy to handle. The patio door glass is brutal to lift and move around.
You will need a larger greenhouse than you think. Everyone does. Unless you are simply using it to start seeds which will be transplanted outdoors. You never have enough room inside. Trust me.
Mine is solar heated only. Too expensive up here in the mntns to heat with gas or electricity. So, I let mine go dormant around Nov. and don't get it going really well til around April.
-
Well I live in west texas and we don't get very harsh winters, so I don't think heating in the winter is going to be a very big issue. Given, I will have to do some form of heating durring a few months, I think the water storage tanks will help out with this alot. Then if I need to have some other form of supplemental heating, we have plenty of time to figure that out. I am thinking about putting in a removable evaporative cooler for the summertime. That will keep the plants moist and help with the heat. In the warm season, we are going to have an outside garden as well.
-
Hi JMaris,
I have built a few of different sizes the smallest was 6x4 and blew away in a storm. The lastest I built about 9 years ago and has withstood all the Northern Ireland weather could throw at it. It is a poly tunnel type and is 90ft x 20ft, the hoops are made from 2inch scaffold tubes bent and covered with a rather expensive poly cover. The cover is not just any plastic sheet it is designed specifically for the job and is very tough.
My wife is the one with green fingers and spends most of her time in it, it keeps her busy and out of my workshop lol. On the coldest of winter days it is noticeably warmer inside. All in all it was a very successful project and we are now planing to put up a second one.
This is probably much bigger than you want but it is very easy to scale it up or down. I have seen them in kit form but they are very easy to build from scratch, ours took less than a week start to finish.
I will try and add a couple of pics (fingers crossed)
-
I was just wondering if anyone on here has built a greenhouse on there place? I am in the process of moving out of town and my wife and I am wanting to put in a greenhouse when we get out there.
I'd recommend the geodesic quonset design - no longer available from the original source but you'll find details of this simple but very strong frame on my website at http://gilks.ath.cx/gallery/v/quonset/ (http://gilks.ath.cx/gallery/v/quonset/).
I have three built so far, a 5 m long plastic covered house that I'm about to extend to 9m when the tomatoes and chillis have finished in a few weeks time and a 9m long shadehouse that has all the soft fruit in it. The basic design gives a width of 4.5m (14') and each section add just over 1m (about 3'6")
I'm also going to be making another 10 of them for a more commercial growing venture. I'm making that many as I want to keep the size of each individual house down to 5m long - I can pick them up and move to fresh ground each year then with my tractor :o
-
Hiltoprange,
Man, that is a gorgeous setup you have there! Do you grow all year long? What do you use to add/capture heat during the winter? How did you attach the plastic to the framework? I see some type of green netting. What purpose does that serve? I haven't made any decisions on the final build but the more I think about it and research it, the more I am leaning towards the tunnel type. It seems to be the easiest to build and fairly inexpensive in comparison to some of the other types.
Oh yeah, did I mention you have an absolutely beautiful setup!!!
-
This is something I found scouring the internet. I found it very interesting and thought some of you following this thread might as well.
http://www.eaglespringsfarm.net/id11.html
It is called an aquaponic greenhouse. It will definitely not be what I build first but I can definitely see one a few years down the road. The only thing better than fresh produce year round is fresh fish and produce year round!!!
-
Thank you for the kind comments,
We grow for most of the year except for December and January as it is to cold. We use a heated sand box for a propagator to start seeds early January, its just a buried heat cable but it works very well. We don't use any heat for the tunnel it would be nice to use some solar heating but for that you need to have some sunshine! that's as rare as hens teeth in these parts!
The green mesh is a screen to keep birds and people of the fruit beds. The Giant strawberries are irresistible to people (me) and the birds. We try to encourage the small birds as they are excellent for pest control. There is also an army of frogs from the pond that seem to spend most of their time in the tunnel eating slugs , the frogs come out and bask in the fine spray when the irrigation pump comes on. We don't use any pesticides, chemicals or fertiliser, we also make all our own compost and enrich it with plenty of cow dung and comfrey tea. The only other additive is sweat lol.
The plastic lies over the hoops of the tunnel but is not connected directly to them as they need to be able to move independently . The hoops have to have “hot spot tape†on them this allows the plastic covering to move and it protects the plastic cover from the hot steel in full sun (whatever that is)..
The plastic is sandwiched between two pieces of 4x2 D rail (pressure treated) and bolted to the hoops this puts the tension on the plastic.
The hoops sit into sockets knocked into the ground about 2 ft and at a slight angle so as to put the hoops under tension, there is no concrete needed.
I adapted a design from a book about poly tunnels, I cant mind the title of hand but I will see if I can find it and let you know the title and author.
Russell
-
Im not sure I understand how you attach the poly. Could you take an up close pic of it?
-
Hi, I will take a couple of pics for you later today and get back to you with the detail.
Russell
-
Hi, I will take a couple of pics for you later today and get back to you with the detail.
Russell
What is the hot spot tape? Maybe what I need to use in my hoop frame. I used 2" black poly pipe to build mine. and before last summer was over the green house poly melted to the pipe.
-
Hi,
the hot spot tape is essential and does a couple of things. First and foremost it provides insulation from the heat of the hoop in full sun. The tape is a type of foam rubber similar to the insulation for around a door or window. It is about an inch wide and close to 1/4 thick it is self adhesive on one side and has a shiny slippery coating on its outer side (possibly Teflon) this is its second purpose, it allows for movement between the hoop and cover in windy conditions and stops the hoop wearing through the cover.
I think you will alway have problems with the black poly tube as it will absorb the heat and get very hot. White would be a better choice as it will help to reflect the heat and with the addition of the hot spot tape your cover will last much longer. I purchased my cover and tape from an agricultural supplier locally the cover brand is Polytherm and from memory the tape was made by the same company.
In my case the cover cost close to £600 GB Pounds ($1000 U.S.) and the tape was about £50. The cover had a 5 year warranty but only if hot spot tape was used. The tunnel has now been up for 9 years and is still as good as new and very supple, we have had a couple of minor cuts from storm debris but there is a repair tape available that works very well.
If you do a search on ebay for hotspot tape you should find it.
(prices quoted are from 9 years ago)
Regards Russell
-
Hi JMaris,
I have taken a few pics for you of the tunnel construction and how to attach the cover. I have also sketched out roughly how it all goes together as a picture is worth a thousand words lol. The whole construction is very simple and only requires the use of a hydraulic bender for the hoops and a power drill. Best to pic a flat and level site but as I live on a hill I had to make do with a slight slope uphill from front to back. A certain amount off unevenness can be adjusted out once the frame is up.
I have been told by she who must be obeyed that I have to build another one same size and next to the first for veg only and she wants a third but smaller one covered in black polytherm for a mushroom house probably about 20ft x 40ft. I need to find a cheap source for scaffold poles!
If you decide to build or buy a polytunnel you wont be disappointed one word of advice is to build it twice as big as you think you will need! you will fill it very quickly
I hope you can follow my sketches, if not let me know and I will try and help as best I can. You should be able to build one from these couple of drawings, just decide on the size you want and keep adding hoops. If you visit a garden centre or plant nursery you will see how simple they are, there are many styles to choose from and many ways of doing it. I sort of designed this as I went along and to be honest I don't think I would change anything about it as it has more than payed for itself. I am in a high wind area with regular vicious storms and severe gales so I used 2in galvanised tube but you could use smaller dia tube, but keep in mind the wind load and also the weight of the cover, mine was over 1/2 ton when rolled up.
The sketch should be self explanatory but just to be sure the polytherm cover is secured to a D rail of pressure treated 4 x 11/2 timber that is bolted with coach bolts to the hoops all the way around and is then clamped with 2 x 1 slating lath and 2in galv screws. The cover then goes down into a shuck (trench) with a drainage pipe and is backfilled with gravel. My drains run into an underground sump that holds about 5000 gallons, this catches any rainfall and is used for the irrigation system.
I hope this helps
I was intending to add the pics with text between, but I cant figure out how to with the new software!
Note to edds if I have added to many pics please delete, I will email them direct.
BTW if anyone wants the full size images drop me an email to hilltopgrange at tesco dot net just change the at and dot.
-
Is the poly you used the 6mil thick stuff? The 6mil is all I have been able to find online.
-
Your best bet is to contact a local horticultural supplier, if they don't have it they will at least know where to get it. I cant remember the spec on the cover as it was so long ago, I have just had a look to see what it says on it and it just carries the trade name politherm plus.
Russell
-
There is a company by the name of FarmTek which has been sending me catalogues for years. I've never done any business with them, but they carry a lot of hoop, or tunnel, greenhouse supplies. I have no idea how their prices compare with any others, but they do list many items. Might be worth a look to get an idea.
Again, I've never done any business with them, though I've been getting their catalogues for at least fifteen years so they've been around at least that long. They have a web site.
-
Thanks for the website. They have a ton of stuff on there! Im really interested in their hydroponic systems. Ever since I read about them, I really want to give it a try in the future... but Im not trying to get ahead of myself. I need to get the greenhouse going first. We are supposed to close on the land tomorrow. I have a long "to do" list for after we move in. The greenhouse isn't #1 on the list but it is fairly close to it.
-
So what do you guys think about using some thick wall PVC for the frame rather than metal? I was thinking like 1&1/2" or 2"id schedule 40. That would be a lot cheaper and easier to use than steel.
-
So what do you guys think about using some thick wall PVC for the frame rather than metal? I was thinking like 1&1/2" or 2"id schedule 40. That would be a lot cheaper and easier to use than steel.
I think you would find it was too brittle in the cold and too pliable in the heat. Was my experience anyway. Our temps can be 100+ F in summer to -40 F in winter, however.
On a hot day here you could clamp one to a post vertically and by days end it would bend over from getting soft in the heat of the sun in the open. Behind heat retaining sheeting it would be worse.
Just my experience with PVC as structural elements here in the upper middle coast area.
Tom
-
I personally would not use plastic tube for anything bigger than a cloche. As Tom pointed out it is going to be susceptible to temperature both high and low. I toyed with it before I built this one but it failed miserably when the first storm hit it, mind you a glass 8x4 glasshouse from the diy store also failed here. I am in Northern Ireland, we don't get very hot or very cold conditions but we do get a lot of wind and rain but even in our cool climate it can get very hot inside. My main concern with this one was the wind, if a hoop was to fail in a westerly gale the whole cover would take off and land somewhere in Scotland. The other snag with plastic is UV as some types just disintegrate in a very short time.
If you don't fancy bending the steel for the hoops you could get a local fabrication shop to do it for you. I bought a hydraulic bender for less than £100 delivered and bent them myself. The whole thing bent, built and covered took less than a week to complete, its not as big a project as it looks but it does require some planing. I built mine on my own but I did enlist the help of my wife when it came to fitting the cover.
The other option is to buy a factory made tunnel but they are not cheap.
Where are you and what sort of size are you thinking about?
If it is smallish you could use a smaller diameter tube or maybe even aluminium.
If you are in a hot climate you will need to think about how your going to cool it. A hot day in our climate is about 70f maybe as high as 80f but that would be exceptional and rare but even at 65f outside you could not spend any length of time in it without ventilation.
Plenty to think about! keep us updated.
Russell
-
We want to build a 20x50. We live in west texas and the temps range from high of about 100-110 F in the summer and as low as 15F on the coldest winter nights. Given, we get a lot more heat than cool. I am going to put a "swamp cooler" in on one end and have vents and fans on the other end during the summer. The winds out here do get fairly bad during certain times of the year. I wonder if aluminum coated steel tubing (muffler shop tubing) would work... or would it be to weak?
-
The larger diameter the tube is the stiffer it gets.
For cooling there are also shade - reflector arrangements to cut back on peak hours solar heating.
http://tinyurl.com/2g8htxw <--- twin wall polycarbonate panels 4 & 6 foot wide on supposed closeout.
If you live within a days drive of Cedar Rapids Iowa those panels might be a viable solution - they sell a lot of them but freight shipping and crating is killer. I've been daydreaming of projects with them for years.
-
So what do you guys think about using some thick wall PVC for the frame rather than metal? I was thinking like 1&1/2" or 2"id schedule 40. That would be a lot cheaper and easier to use than steel.
4 by 1 timber - I reckon you could park a truck on mine since just a single section will take my weight (about 190lb) . Rigid enough with 5-6 sections that I can pick one up with the tractor (bucket at one end, timber post on the 3 point rear link) and move it about on the garden (200' from construction site to veg plot!!).
I've costed out a shade house of 14' wide by 17' long at less than NZ$300 using H4 pressure treated timber (ground contact), all the nails and screws and including the shadecloth (half a 50m roll). I'm sure you could get the timber cheaper by looking round or stripping down old pallets. It takes me a full 8 hour day to cut all the timber and nail it up - if I had some help I could probably halve that time.
-
We want to build a 20x50. We live in west texas and the temps range from high of about 100-110 F in the summer and as low as 15F on the coldest winter nights. Given, we get a lot more heat than cool. I am going to put a "swamp cooler" in on one end and have vents and fans on the other end during the summer. The winds out here do get fairly bad during certain times of the year. I wonder if aluminum coated steel tubing (muffler shop tubing) would work... or would it be to weak?
Swamp cooler is good, and you'll need a very large one. Well, you may need two very large ones. Our greenhouse is 12 x 23, outside temp's top out at mid-90s, and our 4,000 CFM swamp cooler barely keeps it liveable for the plants, takes it down to about 80 F. or a little higher on the hottest days. You will likely want to plan for some shading material you can roll up out of the way. You will need shading even with the cooler. Our shading is on the inside due to very high winds now and then, and you may need to do the same. Shades cool better outside, but they are then subject to wind damage and also can flap hard against the structure and damage it.
[Is this sounding more complicated all the time? It will be worth it.]
-
It sounds more and more complicated every day. As much fruits and veggies as we eat, I know it will be worth it! Not to mention it is something we have wanted to do since we married.
-
DONT use pvc for a frame a chemical reaction between the pvc and plastic covering will destroy it in the first year
-
It sounds more and more complicated every day. As much fruits and veggies as we eat, I know it will be worth it! Not to mention it is something we have wanted to do since we married.
No pix of the inside, but this is a small part of what came out of it...
-
Having just posted my first picture to the new board and seeing it totally out of the context I was aiming for, can someone give a clue as to how I preview attaching an image? The text was supposed to be below the picture...
Cheers
-
can someone give a clue as to how I preview attaching an image? The text was supposed to be below the picture...
Cheers
Right now, you can't. >:(
We have some plans to make that possible.
Otherwise you can use web hosted photos "inline" like you want but that is a bit more effort. This has been covered elsewhere so I don't want to divert this thread explaining it here.
Tom
-
I shouldn't get a chemical reaction using hot spot tape right?
-
So I scored a ton (probably literally) of pipe and angle iron yesterday. It is mostly structural pipe and angle iron but there are some 20 or 30 foot long sections of galvanized pipe. Im not sure how many there are or what condition they are in. I will take inventory as I unload all of it this week and get a better knowledge of what I got. Hopefully there will be enough of the galvanized to build my greenhouse. If not, at least it will be enough to get a good start on it. Good news is that thus far all that it has cost me so far is the 2 hours it took me to load it all up on the trailer!
-
People on here are talking bad about PVC pipe green houses
I have built about 5 of them and except for replacing the plastic every 3 years or so they have worked wonderfully
These were built in Alabama where the weather is generally mild.
we would use clear plastic in the winter then Black Shade Netting in the summer like this picture shows
[attachment=1]
-
Looks like you used 2" schedule 40? How long were the joints of pvc you used? Looks like you are having to duck to walk through... What is the height at the peak? Im not sure if the pvc will withstand the west texas wind we get out here. Which is why I am glad I have some galvanized pipe. I don't remember how many I have though. I will count them tomorrow. If I don't have enough to make it as long as I want to, I will alternate between pipe and pvc. I am hoping to have the greenhouse built before summer ends. We have been ridiculously busy getting our house setup. I just poured the slab for our water well house today and we are still waiting on the power company to get us hooked up... So needless to say the greenhouse isn't quite at the top of the list, but it is close!
-
Well, it looks like I have 3 pieces of about 30ft galvanized and then some shorter pieces. I have 2 more long ones, but the finish on them isn't the best. I need to clean them up and see if it is just junk on top of the finnish or if the finnish is damaged. I figure I can alternate galvanized pvc galvanized pvc etc... or galvanized pvc pvc galvanized pvc pvc etc... depending how many of the pieces of galvanized clean up good. How far apart do you guys think I should space the support ribs? I was thinking 6 or 8 feet. What do you guys think?
-
I have a small greenhouse, built from an old shed and a raft of used windows. Roughly 7' x 8'. With it, I start my plants in the house, then start up the greenhouse on the 1st of april, which is 7 weeks before we usually set out bedding plants. a 1.5 Kw heater gets me through the cold nights.
This is a good way to start -- see if it's fun.
I want to build two more: One will be a 'conservatory' attached to the house. Used as a sun room, and a place to start seedlings. I also want a 30x60 foot gothic hoop house for production use -- forcing lilies for the spring trade
If you are in a cold climate (We're zone 3) then running a greenhouse in winter isn't reasonable without a bunch of supplemental heat. If it is well made running it for 8 months a year can be done.
Consider building a greenhouse attached to the south side of your house. Even if you shut it down for the winter it can provide heat to the house during sunny days.
Build as much water storage as you can into a green house. This reduces temperature swings.
Your aisles should be wide enough to move a wheel barrow down them and squeek by it.
A good cheap way to make benches is a double row of barrels (filled with water) and used pallets. Note that the cracks in the pallets make wonderful places for pests to overwinter. There is merit in closing the greenhouse up and get the temps as high as possible for a few days at some point each year. (140F will kill many eggs)
Reaching over 2 feet into a row is hard. Wall benches should be 2 feet wide, center benches can be 4 feet wide. With 3 foot aisles this makes for certain magic numbers for width:
* Two wall benches + 1 aisle = 7 feet.
* Two wall benches, 1 center bench + 2 aisles = 14 feet
* Two wall benches + N center benches + N-1 aisles = (N+1)*4 + (N-1)*3.
Watch kijiji and craigslist. Sometimes you can get a used greenhouse frame for cheap.
The usual problem with a greenhouse is NOT heating it, but cooling it. In summer you need an air exchange a MINUTE to keep from cooking it.
This can be done with high speed fans, or roll up sides, or complicated roof mechanisms. In the southern US they often remove the plastic for the summer.
In your research google "high tunnel" Cornell has a good set of resources for it.
Building an attached shed to the green house is a good idea. This is where you do your potting, keep the watering hose, all those bits. In the trade it's referred to as a head house, as it was usually on the north end of a bunch of N/S running greenhouses.
If you want an interesting take on low energy cold climate greenhouses google solaroof (Note only 1 r) This is a technique using soap bubbles as insulation/sun shade between two layers of plastic.
If the greenhouse is seasonal then being able to separate it into chunks has merit. In early spring when starting seeds, you only need a small chunk at one end that is kept warm. As plants are moved to larger and larger pots, the partition is moved down. In this way a moderate heater can heat a small area during very cold times, and a larger area in not so cold times.
On a sunny day, a greenhouse needs an air change every 10 minutes just to provide CO2 for the plants. This varies with the amount of green in the house. In winter you want makeup air to be well mixed with the existing air before it touches a leaf. In commercial houses this is done with a 2' diameter poly plastic tube with small (about 1 cm) holes every few feet. The tube is hung from the ceiling.
If you are clever, you can reduce outside air by using a compost heap for your CO2 source. You have to watch the C:N ratio as too much N and the heap will produce ammonia gas which is tough on your plants.
I've also heard of using chickens as your CO2 source. Chicken crap has a big ammonia problem.
If you get a used greenhouse, take a LOT pictures of it. Bring a pad of paper and make signs: "Top end connector" "Mid wall perlon"
As you dissasemble, take another set of pictures of the piece, and the bolts. Not all the bolts are the same. Use up the 2.25" ones where the 2" ones should have gone will leave you short later. It's a good idea to put the bolts back into the connectors.
Do some careful measuring. Some greenhouses are sent with all holes in place, some you have to drill on site, some are a mix. If the holes are drilled on site, they will vary in position. E.g. if one rib is an inch out of line, it's holes will be an inch out of line. This will make reassembly tricky.
If the holes are predrilled, you move the pieces to meet. If they are site drilled, you can mark every piece with location and hope, or you can resign yourself to drilling new holes. Drilling new holes isn't usually a big issue.
If you live in a snowy climate get a gothic arch. Round tops collect snow.
Do your homework: Research the brand, and check the rated snow load. Snow will usually slide off a gothic arch roof in a few sunny days. If you ever get 2 feet of wet snow at once, you need a roof that will support that. A cheap greenhouse will have a 10-15 lbs/sq foot load capacity. Good ones run about 40-50 -- same as a house. You can compensate in part for this by putting the ribs on closer spacing.
Larger greenhouses are easier to control for temperature. So are taller ones.
-
DONT use pvc for a frame a chemical reaction between the pvc and plastic covering will destroy it in the first year
PVC is also one of the most evil compounds made. Really hard to dispose of in a green way.
If you must used PVC, paint it with latex paint to inhibit the reaction between the outgassing plasticisers and the poly.
If you are in love with plastic, use ABS (drain pipe) instead. Paint it white.
For the strength, metal isn't that much more expensive. The steel conduit used for the top of chain link fence is a good place to start -- it comes in 30 foot chunks. There are benders on the web to make your arches.
-
Frackers here's your pic. A lot of the pix in this thread are not displaying inline I think because they are 640x480. I think the limit is 600x480 but it doesn't say anything below except 150kb limit. I used the GIMP to resize yours to 600x450 at 90%. The GIMP is free and comes in handy for this. I own a Mac but don't want to pay for Photoshop. The GIMP does more than I will ever need. Inkscape does vector graphics for free if you need that.
http://www.gimp.org/
http://inkscape.org/
[attachment=1]
-
Yes we have both. One is attached to the dome and one is outside and portable.
I will have to take some pictures as I can't find any in my album at the moment.
There is a picture on my website, if you want to look ;)
-
I made this greenhouse out of 4" fence posts and covered it with 40% green shadecloth. The concrete goes right around and at the rear it's pretty high and the inside was first covered in black plastic then 5 ton of 10mm rocks were placed in. At the rear is a sump where excess water flows into and when the drum is full it is filtered then sprayed back through the micro sprays. My wife is pretty happy with it as she can grow her herbs all year round and not worry about heat or frost.
Cheers Bryan
http://www.anotherpower.com/albums/album65/2010_06130002.sized.jpg (http://www.anotherpower.com/albums/album65/2010_06130002.sized.jpg)
-
Looks good! That's about the size of my whole garden.
Rgds
Damon
-
Well, it is a greenhouse thread... ;D
Maybe this is the better place to ask, rather than starting my own thread... We just moved out of town, new house came with a 16' x 8' x 10' tall greenhouse. Love the theory, scared of power bill :) Wife and I both have plans, but we need to make it reasonable to operate...
2x4 construction, translucent corrugated fiberglass sheeting. Has 15amp service, and natural gas furnace (early 80s vintage?).
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi74.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fi277%2Fcgyreefer%2FGreenhouse%2FDSCF0616.jpg&hash=cead83c4e74b3266f3ac87b433872a482c335144)
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi74.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fi277%2Fcgyreefer%2FGreenhouse%2FDSCF0618.jpg&hash=5dd912ca079f790aad27054588a759ea9d7306c4)
(https://www.fieldlines.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi74.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fi277%2Fcgyreefer%2FGreenhouse%2FDSCF0617.jpg&hash=45be613037ecfb5e87e860468e70b875e27da047)
Now we'd like to get close to 4 seasons use out of it (now we are at 51' north - north east of calgary) - I'm most likely going to do some rework on it... Add a layer of 6mil poly to each side of the 2x4 framing (keeping the fiberglass too) to get some 'insulation' for what it's worth... Thinking about a 6' or so extension - basically a utility room to store all the gear I'm going to be adding (and get some of the aquaponic tanks out of the sun). Yes I will be replacing that screen door :)
While I'm in re-working, I'm thinking about installing: http://www.sunnyjohn.com/indexpages/shcs.htm . Using the 'standard' greenhouse calculators, looks like I'll need about 40,000btu of heating on the coldest days we typically get around here; trying to make heads or tails out of what I'll need for solar water heating to keep that CNG furnace off (albeit with all the solar water I've been contemplating; I might replace it with a more typical hydronic boiler scenario?) - we're probably going to tie in a hot-tub (wife wants one - and likes it HOT (as in 40-45C hot)- so perfect candidate to hold ~800g of toasty hot water) as a heatsink... I was thinking a paver floor, possibly with some PEX floor heating loops...
Still waiting on my hugh piggott book; been in customs for a month now... Obviously this customs agent who's reading it is a slow arse reader... But we're in a perfect spot for wind, Category 3 in the winter - basically still in summer though, no local restrictions, and we live close enough to trains, that we have no noise restrictions...
I'd love to hear some advice/suggestions on how to do this...
-
While you're waiting on the book to arrive ;).
Have a look at this website.
http://www.builditsolar.com/
The site owner is a regular poster ehre and generally answers emails directed to him.
WARNING, once you go to that site HOURS will disappear without notice.
BUT the money you will save will be well worth the time 8).
Nice GH you got there!!
Bruce S
-
Yeah, I've already lost a few ... days (might be closer to weeks) between builditsolar and scoraigwind... :) And this place sure isn't helping either... :)
-
If you don't get more posting help I can always split this one off and repost it in the Newbies area.
There you'll have more eyes.
However, my thought is that with that much room you should be able to make up enough trough style heaters or beer can heaters to keep the use of NG down to the bare min.
I'm also finding that using the PEX style lines for underground water piping to be a better route.
I've tested some open water 30gal HPV tanks this past winter and they certainly help with keeping the air moisture up. Last winter was a mild one so I'm not ready to go with it just yet.
Bets of Luck
Bruce S
-
I've flip flopped as I've navigated the site, as there's no real appropriate (or consistantly used) place for greenhouses - they just seem to pop up wherever :) I'm good with it here... I'll start a build log once I figure out just what I'm doing and put shovel to soil...
Right now I'm still trying to feel out my overall budget for what I need to do... Pricing out the basics are easy enough - SHCS, 6mil poly, expansion, new door that was easy... It's trying to calculate out the SWH etc sizing etc that is causing migraines :) Should I just run with a lowball 600btu/sqft number - and run with the greenhouse calculator's 40,000btu? So 66sqft minimum, make it 10x8 as overkill (and make up for the hot tub)? Or split it up and run evac tubes on the east side (ridge of the roof runs N/S) then plate units on the west side - where they'll get the best heat of the day?
-
Howdy, neighbour!
I'm close enough to WALK to your house.
If that book doesn't arrive, I'll bring my copy over.
My first suggestion, for your research, is to look up Gary's Build-it-Solar website. A variety of solar space-heating projects, some of which may work for you.
The rest... I'm a wind turbine person, and defer to the experts on solar.
-
Is there a turbine in town I haven't noticed? :o
-
What an interesting structure.
It has the appearance of a medieval church. I am astonished to observe that the structure sports what I take to be the Canadian national flag. I presume the purpose of this stately symbol is similar to that of an aerodrome wind sock - wind direction in anticipation of a wind turbine yet to be built?
David in Hong Kong
-
Is there a turbine in town I haven't noticed? :o
Nah you'd never see mine, I keep it hidden in tall trees ;) I'm a few sections east of Keoma.
I guess you live in one points of the K-I-K triangle, or maybe the outer suburbs of metro-Beiseker?
Send me a private message if you need one of those books.
Does that shed have a foundation? Or is it on skids? I have a couple of sheds that size on skids that I've moved once or twice.
Maybe you don't have to leave it pointed N-S if you want sun on the sloped roof?
David,
You'll just have to get used to it. There are Canadians everywhere. Probably, there are some in your home town right now...
-
I'm a short stumble from beefsteaks... I can hear the karaoke as I type 8)
Its on skids, but has the 15amp & Nat gas so less moveable...
What does David have against Canucks? 2 of my great uncles are buried in hk, royal navy circa '42...
-
I don't have anything against Canadians at all.
I took great care to write in a humorous vein.
By the way I am British (Hong Kong Police retired) in case you thought I may be Chinese.
David in HK
-
heh, no - I assume everyone is alien until they prove otherwise :P
I couldn't do HK, heck I could barely survive life in calgary (and I think it's way too crowded). :)
-
I built two greenhouses onto the south side of my basement. A porch is in the middle. They protrude 8' and are each 16' wide. I fabricated the frame out of steel, primered and painted, then used silicone and fasteners with 3/8 poycarbonate twinwall. The greenhouses are the most enjoyable part of our house and they light the entire basement plus heat.
I use one to start my garden plants in the spring (have tomatoes, peppers, etc, going right now). Found a stainless cabinet that fit inside one from end to end (set it in with a crane before building the cover).
We use them for living space and cannot imagine a better way to build for multiple use. One must plan for cover in the summer to control overheating.
Toby
-
What do I (not David) have against Canuks?
Snowed here 2 days ago.
They need to keep that crap up in Canukia where it belongs!
Then today was almost 80F, which is 26.7 in Canukian.
G-
-
Only if you keep those snowstorms down in montana from when'st they come lately :) Was in the 70s, then montana goes and sends us snow... It's all that Californian hot air y'know ;)
Found the inside glass for that screen door today, tossed together a quick arduino project, 3 DS18b20's (1wire temp sensors), one inside (floor) inside (Ceiling) and outside (about 3' off the ground). See if we can't get a little baseline data (and curious if I can kick some of the strawberries and sunflowers out of my kitchen ;) )
-
At the UFA (Airdrie) on the weekend and I noticed they're building a greenhouse like yours in their back-lot.
A little wider, less roof slope, but otherwise same basic idea. Your GH may be a kit.
Uh-oh, here comes aduino data....
-
Yeah, heard a rumor it's actually a 198*'s Acme farm & Building kit :)
I wont torture ya's with data :) Thats what blogs are for
-
Here's my favorite. http://aes.missouri.edu/swcenter/research/Solar-heated%20greenhouse.pdf
(http://aes.missouri.edu/swcenter/research/Solar-heated%20greenhouse.pdf)
Size is 12'x24 and 11' tall at peak, 22- 55gal drums of water for 1100gal thermal storage, in 10 years of testing the lowest outside temp was -13F and inside stayed above freezing, all kinds of cool weather crops have been grown in it, winter soil temps between 40-56F.
I plan on building something similar on the south side of our cabin. Double duty as solar heating. The one above is freestanding.
-
Yeah, heard a rumor it's actually a 198*'s Acme farm & Building kit
Lasted a lot longer than the usual kits ordered by Wile E. Coyote from the Acme Company.
-
::)
Temp only went down to 3c overnight, that's a good start (-10 outside), guess we're not clearing the plants out quite yet...
-
Hilltopgrange
Thank you for taking the time to share the construction details of your greenhouse. Could you explain your water collection / storage system? I would guess that it's buried under or along side the greenhouse? How is the water pumped up? Does it cause much additional condensation, if under?
Thanks in advance.
Pete
-
My buddy's house had a green house attached to it. Upon his dad retiring he got a green thumb big time. The house had a basement which was half above/below ground. The basement also had a back door like all basements should that led to the side of the house. All he did was simply dig out the sides of ground to if I remember 8wide by 12 long. From there he used cinder block and made 2 rows high with a doorway. Simply framed out with 2x4 and used double paned windows for walls and roof which he got free from a house remodel. It actually produced enuff organic heat to heat his entire house in winter and during the summer opened up the door and the front door and made cross ventilation.
-
Hi,
I've been working on getting our greenhouse into a four season one.
It started as this sort of test space for low thermal mass sunspace for space heating: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Sunspace/LowMassSunspace/TestsLowMassSunspace.htm
I've added some sand and concrete pavers over the floor insulation, added some 55 gallon plastic barrels along the north wall for thermal mass, painting most of the inside surfaces white. Also got an air to water heat exchanger (similar to a car radiator) and plan to mount it in the peak of the GH to heat water in the barrels to store more of the daytime solar heat in the barrels for use at night. Thinking about some kind of night time insulating system for the glazing -- any ideas?
Mine is also modeled after the U of Missouri GH mentioned above.
For the rest of the summer, the big issue is going to be getting enough ventilation -- I've added a 14 inch solar vent fan at the peak in the east wall, and and AC fan powered vent fan in the west wall (using the 10 inch Grainger fan that does 600 cfm for 27 watts). Looks like it will still need some more venting or shade cloth.
Just putting in our first plants today -- based our our past record in growing things I'm not envying the plants.
Will be interested to see how the Calgary GH performs as I think you guys have a bit tougher winter than we do in Bozeman -- but, maybe more sun.
Gary
-
Hi Gary,
I enjoyed reading through your sunspace experiment pages when I discovered them a few months ago. Hope it works as greenhouse for you.
How well will shadecloth work to insulate the glazings overnight? If stretched continuously across the entire glazing, the shadecloth would create a barrier to both convection and radiation. Make one sheet large enough, or for starters you could cut several pieces to size and hang them over the windows at night. Pull them tight to stay close to the slope of the glazings.
...But I'm sure you are ACTUALLY asking about how to AUTOMATE the covering of the windows at night. That's trickier...
I'm thinking it should be light-activated, not temperature activated. Since the morning sun is the source of heat that will warm it up for the day, using a temperature differential would delay the opening of the blind. Likewise, in the evening, the greenhouse will cool down before the blind closes if you use temp differentials to activate the closure. So use a photocell.
Assuming you still like using shadecloth, it can roll up at the ceiling for the day, and unroll for the night. Keeping it tight may take trial-and-error. I don't have a magic-bullet suggestion.
There could be too much solar heat for the greenhouse to work, considering how thoroughly it's insulated. By July, you will know if what you really need are venetian blinds partly closed all day!
My next-door neighbour is going to build a greenhouse this summer (supposedly). If so, it will be my first chance to regularly see how one works in this climate.
-
Oh, I see you already have a pyranometer mounted on the building. That will be more accurate than the photocell. Though more complicated, because only a microcontroller or a computer can drive it, or know what to do with the readings it spits out. It does not sound like that would daunt you at all, though.
-
Oh, I see you already have a pyranometer mounted on the building. That will be more accurate than the photocell. Though more complicated, because only a microcontroller or a computer can drive it, or know what to do with the readings it spits out. It does not sound like that would daunt you at all, though.
Hi,
Its an Apogee pyranometer -- pretty easy to use. It puts out 0.002 volts per watt/sm. I use it with a Hobo logger that scales the pyranometer volts into watts/sm and logs the watts/sm readings. The plots are from the Hobo software.
Gary
-
Hi Gary,
I enjoyed reading through your sunspace experiment pages when I discovered them a few months ago. Hope it works as greenhouse for you.
How well will shadecloth work to insulate the glazings overnight? If stretched continuously across the entire glazing, the shadecloth would create a barrier to both convection and radiation. Make one sheet large enough, or for starters you could cut several pieces to size and hang them over the windows at night. Pull them tight to stay close to the slope of the glazings.
...But I'm sure you are ACTUALLY asking about how to AUTOMATE the covering of the windows at night. That's trickier...
I'm thinking it should be light-activated, not temperature activated. Since the morning sun is the source of heat that will warm it up for the day, using a temperature differential would delay the opening of the blind. Likewise, in the evening, the greenhouse will cool down before the blind closes if you use temp differentials to activate the closure. So use a photocell.
Assuming you still like using shadecloth, it can roll up at the ceiling for the day, and unroll for the night. Keeping it tight may take trial-and-error. I don't have a magic-bullet suggestion.
There could be too much solar heat for the greenhouse to work, considering how thoroughly it's insulated. By July, you will know if what you really need are venetian blinds partly closed all day!
My next-door neighbour is going to build a greenhouse this summer (supposedly). If so, it will be my first chance to regularly see how one works in this climate.
Hi,
Interesting idea on the shade cloth. It does seem like it should have some effective R value.
A nice side effect would be that it might be used to provide some partial shading in the daytime for plants that don't want the full sunlight?
Gary
-
Try looking at the variety of blinds/shutters made for skylights for ideas, since your windows are inclined. If the shadecloth doesn't work.
-
Just tried to contribute to this thread and the server times out. The server on Fieldlines is always slow to connect for me,compared to other sites I go to. Might have been a photo upload thing ??
Anyway, I will try the text and maybe add the photos another time ?
I live in Costa Rica and have put together a small green house Aquaponics system. We built the wooden frame and covered it with 7 mil plastic sheeting.
We also built the fish tank with wood and lined it with the same 7 mil plastic sheeting. All the grow beds are wood with the 7 mil plastic sheeting.
We have a portable sawmill and lots of trees, so, we are stocked up with lumber. We pulled shade coth over the roof to help take the suns rays from wilting the plants. Now, we have it off.
Soon, the rains will taper off and the sun will get stronger so, we will need to put the shade cloth up again.
The system is powered by a large car battery and a small computer UPS battery for the 2 air pumps that are located in the fish tank.
The water is pumped to the grow beds using a boat bilge pump, submerged in the fish tank. We have trouble with the power company and have burned up 2 computers and several light bulbs,
from the constant outages and surges as the system comes back online. This is why we use the 12V battery system. Right now, I keep the batteries charged with the power company and 2 battery chargers.
Works very well. Pumps are reasonable and easiy obtained. Soon, we will have more Sun and 3 solar panels,once I get them built. Then, I will start upgrading to better batteries.
We have a string of LED lights over the grow beds on one side of the green house. Tha has made a big difference in growth rates. They are on all night and off during the day.
Cleaning the fish tank involves using another pump as a vacuum cleaner, and dragging a hose around the bottom of the tank, pumping the solids into a bucket, then, using that water on fruit trees, etc. I also use a whole house cartridge filter, with a pup, to run aabout 4-5 hours every 8-10 days, to filter the water.
That cartridge is washed off and all that residue is used on outside plants.
We started the fish about 9 weeks ago. We bought 20 Tilapia from 50-65mm in length. We had put water in the tank and ran pumps for a little bit, each day, to keep the water from stagnating, then, we put the fish in.
The plants we had going were not doing very well, even after the fertilizer factories were introduced. The little fellers just didn't get the job done, in the beginning. After about a week, we started seeing the yellowish colored leaves start to show signs of greening up and new leaves were forming.
Lately, the plants are standing up and blooming. We have several long shape bell pepper plants with peppers from just past bloom, up to 60mm long. Other planys are doing well but, no blossoms.
Bees have not found the plants, so I hand pollenate for now, with a very soft small paint brush. Seems to be working, I guess.
We have 8 grow beds wit 5 in use. We are having problems getting seeds to germinate, even several different varieties of lettuce? We are going to go back to using dirt and transplant once the small plants are strong enough. This has held us back quite a bit.
We tried cabbages, brussel sprouts, Broccoli, Radishes, etc. Tomatoes are no problem getting started. We have moved some plants outside the green house, since they were getting too tall and falling over.
Our biggest problem, is mosquitos. The water from the beds goes directly into the fish tank. We know the fish are eating them, because lately, they clean up more feed. We only feed them what they clean up, but, several times a day. We have used 2 kilos of feed, so far.
I have worn out the keyboard on this computer, trying to find something to kill the mosquitos on the walls and ceiling, without killing the fish. All i find is scientific babble. No laymans talk, at all. If anyone has any helpful advice, we would greatly appreciate it.
We live way out in the campo, so, it's difficult to find a lot of things we want, until the wife goes into San Jose.
On the Internet, I see a lot of aquaponics systems out in the open. How do they keep the rains from diluting the fertilized water and the fish from jumping out of the overflowing tanks ? This is why we built the green house.
Any advice as to our system is good or needs changes, we welcome. We are very new to this.
Thanks, Harold in CR
-
Harold thanks for the report I saved it to my computer because I am wanting to do something similar in the future
-
Glad to help, Frank. I could not get the photos to post. Might try another post with a couple if you want a look, or, could email them to you.
I read all your much earlier posts and learned a few things.
Harold
-
Harold CR;
Posting can be confusing, took me 5 times and 1/2 hour of string at computer on my first tries.
1st: Make sure they are under the 100kb size, along with 640x480 max size.
Then select the Attachments ,etc, browse to pic, then most importantly change the end-of-post, to inline expandable to the right of browse .
After the first one press Preview, make sure it shows
"attach=" yours will not have quotes around it, but instead brackets and starting with number one after the equal sign
Then follow for more by selecting "more attachments"
You should be working then
Let us know if you're still having problems we can look into it from here.
[attach=1]
Cheers
Bruce S
-
Bruce
I checked all the photos but 1 for size. They were all under 640 X 480 and all were under 65K. The one I didn't check might have been oversized. Anyway, I checked them all again, and I did follow the instructions for the first post.
Lets try this one more time with 7 photos. Well, not perfect but it did go this time.
[attach=1][attach=2][attach=3][attach=4][attach=5][attach=6][attach=7]
-
your fish should be about half way to harvest size assuming you harvest them at a little over 1 lb each
I like them to go a little longer to reach nearly 2lbs but it takes nearly twice as long to add the 2nd lb as it does to reach the first lb and a full year to reach 3 lbs in most Tilapia species or this is what I found while helping a friend increase the size of his farming operation in Romania
-
You are close enough on your estimates, Frank. I assume Romania has a cold climate, like snow and freezing temps ?? We don't have that here. ;D ;D Right now, they are about to cover my open hand from wrist to finger tips. They eat like Piranhas when I throw some pellets at them. :o ;D They should grow faster, here.
I just found out, a local guy gets $9.00/lb or $20.00 Kilo, so, I almost have the 2nd tank frames ready to install. I could use more colonnes ($).
The 2nd tank will go in the center of the green house, providing walk around space all around. Right now, we are having rain day and night for the past 9 days. very little Sun, and, it's chilly here. Wind is blowing nearly all the time and, does slow down during the night, sometimes.
Here is a photo of the fish tank and rats nest wiring or the pumps.
[attach=1]
-
Harold;
Glad to see the pics!
I gotta ask though 8) what do you consider chilly :o.
IF you begin to see wilting on the larger plants, try getting some of the RED LED light strings already set for 12Vdc, they come pretty cheap on ebay, even by the roll.
The red will help in Cloro uptake.
-
AHA, thanks Bruce. My wife saw a program on the tube that showed using both Red and Green LED's. Different color for different reasons.
Chilly= 60°F or 30 something degrees C ? 8) ;D ;D ;D
The rolls of LEDs I use come from Hong Kong. They are plenty bright if one gets the ultra brights. That's what I am slowly changing the house over to. I pay less than $10.00 per roll that's 5 meters long, about 300 LEDs per roll, free shipping. They are self stick, also.
Have no idea how to put spacing between the photos. ::)
Speaking of lights, (yeah) it's my post, ;D The morons that have banned incandescent bulbs after Jan 2014, have not told us where to get oven and refrigerator bulbs. Fluorescent won't work well at severe heat and cold, from my experiences.
-
Oh for some 60F right now, then of course 1/2 the city would come down with pneumonia ;).
Green is bad juju for plants, purple for flowering like tomatoes are awesome. Green is opposite of sun , I found out too late for French Thyme :(.
For spacing merely press enter.
The trci I found was to attach photo, then cut/paste the attach= part where ever you want it, just add extra return for better spacing.
The Mods can fix spacing if you ask, and they're not out throwing snowballs at the dogs ::).
Cheers
-
Most plants are green, because they don't need the green light from the sun... (They reflect away the green light.) It's Red and Blue light they crave... (Which makes a nice purple.)
I think i read somewhere that they prefer more of the blue light as seedlings, then more of the red when they start the flower/fruit business - or was it the other way around? :?
-
Thanks Simen.
I found Purple LEDs last night and will order a roll and some red ones, also. It's so cheap, I can't imaging everyone not using these things.
-
Some links on the topic of led for grow light.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grow_light#LED
http://www.ebay.com/gds/LED-lighting-for-growing-plants-/10000000010850157/g.html
It seems that one cannot escape using some power to the lights, even with the use of led's.
I have one 8W led 'grow light', with red and blue high intensity leds, and it's barely enough for one plant when placed 15 cm above the plant...
-
The white LED's I have over the one side of the plants lights up the area around the green house, outside. It's part of a strip light ribbon.
I just this evening, ordered a 5 meter roll of SMD Purple Ribbon strip, for $10.40 USD delivered to my sons house in Florida. He will be sending a crate down around the end of Jan. so, I will see how that works. It may be that the darker colors don't give off much light.
These super bright whites do though.
Thanks for the links, Simen.
Harold
-
Time for an update.
Been eating green peppers for a while from the plants. The plants are tall and spindly, so, we pick the peppers at around 4" long. They grow long peppers here, not the block type.
Have a couple tomatoes getting big enough to eat in another 3 weeks or so. Outside tomatoes are putting on blossoms and small tomatoes, also. I use a whole house filter, inside the fish tank, so the pump doesn't clog with fish poop, which comes out in a clear tube, like intestines. That gets caught up in the rubber valves of the pump. The filters get clogged after a few changes, so, to make them last longer, I cut up a coupe of old socks, and put the cartridge down inside the sock and hold it n with a rubber band. Then, screw on the top and lower the whole thing down into the tank. Makes it easier to clean and then, set the cartridge out on some yard debris, and the ants clean them up pretty well, so they are usable again. ;D The washed off pop water gets poured over the outside tomatoes that are pot planted with dirt. Also, we have a few pot planted peppers on the ground, inside the green house. They also get that poop water. Must be 40 blossoms on the pepper plants, right now, along with about 15 peppers. The peppers are really tasty.
I add water every week or so, because of the evaporation, and, sometimes forget to shut it off, and, over flow the tank :-[ Last time, one of the fish jumped out. I found it still alive, covered with dirt, so, washed it off and did some CPR. After an hour, I decided it was futile, and, the animal lover wife was happy that I tried so long.Then,I let her eat it for supper. She was hesitant, but, afterwards, she said it tasted GREAT. ;D
Fish are over a pound or so, now. I need to get the second tank built in place, so we can start cycling the water. Pumps are in the crate that should finally be here, in a few days.
Still having trouble starting plants from seed. We have no east-south facing windows in the house to start seeds in. No grow lights, either.
Still waiting for that crate with the purple LEDs. It finally got picked up, yesterday, so, figure another 15 days until I get it. Have 5 modules of Nissan Leaf Battery modules in the crate. They are 7.7V @ 33A, so, 2 modules will make 15.2V packs for the house battery set. IF they work out, I want to buy a whole battery and use it for my house and my electric bike-motorcycle. These are used, but, should last me forever, being high Amp and lithium chemistry. They are pretty big pouch cells, though.
On another thread, I was informed by Xeonpony to use shower heads for the growbed drains, to break up the solid stream of water and add air to the water tank. Shower heads are hard to find here, except for the suicide shower heads, so, yesterday, while in town, I bought a few ¾" PVC pipe caps, and drilled some small holes in them. Works like a champ. Thanks for that idea.
Rainy season is about to begin, so, another chapter of modding to keep the plants going.