Fieldlines.com: The Otherpower discussion board

yeah no, this is proving rather impossible.
I am already at 8 seconds per revolution while the weather station registers 3.4m/s.
Now it is all about wind direction I think.

needless to say this will be difficult to really lay a finger on.

I think that when orienting magnets traditionally then it be important not too close. I think a lot of the field is not going through the coils but is diverted in between adjacent magnets.

Well that is what I will be testing next. To see if repelling without back plating (back plating in a repelling setup only hurts the field rather than benefit it)

But even so traditional with but a 15mm spacing between rotors already packs a punch. A hard one at that!

Look how crazy.


1.76 VAC at 3.6 Hz if I interpret the readings correctly. Now I would like to know if this is impressive or not.

{1}
So here the coils are 200 winds very narrowly wound @ 0.4mm diam wires.
They are not stacked yet spaced in such a manner to roughly end up with a 3 phase shift between them.
The reasoning (but open to debate as per usual) behind this configuration is that the heat dissipation ability can be more easily achieved than with while stacking coils.

And also regarding stacking coils, I still fear that the magnetic fields induced will suffer from interference. This phenomena one can see with waves.
But then again I first need to see that it in order to believe it

{1}

{2}
Also I am worried that once the coils start behaving like electromagnets (as is the intend after all to actually produce power) then the magnets on the rotors might become persuaded to let go of the back plating Not at all something one looks forward to when a PMA is in operation.
{2}

I think mostly these mills were designed to be hauled back to the farm with a horse drawn wagon and then assembled by hand with no additional lifting apparatus etc.  That is part of the reason for the angle iron tower.  It collapses nicely for shipping, and then is light enough to erect by hand with minimal tools. 

These type of windmills have a rotor which is much heavier than the 3-bladed rotor of an electricity generating wind turbine with the same rotor diameter. The rotor is heavy because of the many steel blades and the supporting structure. The head is heavy because of the cast iron reducing gear box and the crank mechanism. These type of windmills make use of a 4-legs angle iron tower with a wide base because the tower must be placed over a well with mostly a rather large diameter.

So these towers have a large base and therefore a high natural frequency. The maximum rotational speed of the rotor is low because of the low tip speed ratio and the used safety system. The rotational speed in rev. per second is therefore always lower than the natural frequency of the tower. For fast running rotors of electricity generating windmills, one often uses a slender tower with a low natural frequency and this frequency is passed by the rotor at already a low wind speed for which there is only a little vibrational energy in the rotor. So fast running rotors normally turn at a rotational speed much higher than the natural frequency of the tower. It is no good idea to use the wide base tower of a traditional water pumping windmill for a fast running rotor because then the rotational speed of the rotor in rev. per second can become the same as the natural frequency of the tower in Hz for high wind speeds and this will result in strong vibrations of the tower. The rotor will always have some mass imbalance or some aerodynamical imbalance and this imbalance starts the vibration of the tower if both frequencies are the same.

It IS his! I remember him testing that system to lower it...

I'm building a new CHP unit with, that will be big enough to heat both my shop and the house.

That'll be big enough for you and dozen of your neighbours!

doesn't require use of DEF

Good thing.

 https://www.sfu.ca/~mbahrami/ENSC%20388/Notes/Intro%20and%20Basic%20Concepts.pdf

Thw waterwheel in this video looks like yours.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCNcwsglZP8

I got a John Deere 6068T diesel that I'm building a new CHP unit with, that will be big enough to heat both my shop and the house.

These are from Deere’s industrial lineup of G-drive and marine engines. They are HPCR with electronic unit injectors. Rated for 50,000 hrs to overhaul on irrigation or generator duty. It is 180hp @ 1,800 rpm and holds 45 liters (11.9 gallons) of oil, making it possible to run 500 hrs between oil changes. Used drain oil from the engine can go into the fuel tank, diluted with fuel and be burned. It is suitable for driving a 125KW split-phase generator and considerably more fuel efficient than our Caterpillar DE50. The 6068T is a Tier II engine, doesn't require use of DEF, 106mm bore x 127mm stroke giving it 6.8L (415 cubic inches) of displacement. It is 17:1 compression ratio, turbocharged and designed for intercooling, so heat can be extracted from the intercooler as well as the cooling system and exhaust.

The cooling loop for the engine (heating loop for the house and shop) will go thru the intercooler, then thru the engine's cooling system, then thru the exhaust cooler. Exhaust temperature @ rated load is 1,000F. The cooling system will be high pressure (25 psi) so the final stage in the loop will be heated to 280F 50/50 glycol-water that goes to the heat exchangers. We need enough radiant heat from the engine to heat the generator room and fuel system when it's below -20F outside so the engine block and exhaust manifold under the turbocharger won't be insulated. The engine weighs 1,820 lbs wet, so it has decent thermal mass as well, for continued heating of the generator room/fuel system when it is shut down without having have to use auxiliary heating to heat the room in sub-zero temps.

I chose this engine because it is near the pinnacle of current technology in diesel engines for thermal efficiency. It has 42% brake thermal efficiency at full load (fuel energy converted to mechanical power), with 28% wasted in exhaust gas, 4% going to pumping losses in a four-stoke cycle engine, 26% of fuel energy dissipating to cooling media as heat rejections to the ambient, including 3% going to mechanical losses as heat. It can be run at partial loads to adjust electrical and heating output as needed, just as efficiently as it runs at full rated load. Modern electronically controlled diesels are a total different world from the mechanical injection diesels of yesteryear, as the electronically controlled units can adjust both fuel rate and timing on-the-fly to optimize cylinder and turbocharger boost pressure and minimize emissions at partial loads. Unlike Otto-cycle engines, diesels run at peak volumetric efficiency because they are un-throttled, so they are an inherent lean-burn design with air-fuel ratios as high as 200:1 at very light loads in modern electronically controlled engines. The best an old Lister thumper could manage was ~40:1 air-fuel ratio at idle and around 15:1 at full load - not much better than a Otto-cycle engine. These new diesels run so clean they don't even leave any black soot in the exhaust pipes anymore. This particular engine can't qualify for on-road use because of NOx emissions, as it doesn't use SCR and runs extremely high combustion temperatures because it doesn't have cooled-EGR. But for a CHP unit it is perfect.

Total cost of the project I estimate at around $105,000 - the engine itself was a $27,000 component. Unfortunately, none of our existing plumbing or heat exchangers will work because they are a low pressure system. So we have to start over from scratch on the heating/cooling loops. It won't be running for this winter, but hope to have it completed for initial testing by next fall, and in full operation for next winter.

Edit: another plus with this engine is that is classified as a heavy duty industrial engine. It is used in John Deere ag and constuction equipment as well as G-drive and marine applications. It has replaceable wet cylinder liners, four valves/cylinder, the inline-six configuration has perfect primary and secondary balance without use of balance shafts, and the water pump is gear-driven instead of belt. It is very similar in design to the big block Cat (3406E/C15), which I think John Deere copied it from. But like the big block Cats, which became the first 2 million miles to overhaul engine in heavy duty trucks, this engine is designed to last with minimal maintenance.

Ok now my insecure nature kicks in again.

Am I adviced to just leave as this place is not it? What ever that meant.

I rather just keep on plowing through and share what I find out along the way.

If nothing else it will be a great journey,

But I think we already see it coming yes? Something wonderful!

Until they come up with an extreme cold friendly battery NOPE! And a cabin heater that works at -25f... guy I know who has one put a small propane space heater inside the cab t keep from freezing and to thaw the windows inside... his trips are all in town with it so range isn't the issue, not freezing is! He has an F150 for road trips...

Quote from: supernewbe

hmmm I must be overlooking something glaringly obvious yet for me not yet visible.

I will update this thread/edit. Im cooking some food to 

Anyway JW, Let me just state that sharing food is a good way to bury hatchets.
So please accept my invitation that should you ever come over to the wrong side of the pond and be near by. Then please be my guest. I will make sure the dining table is full of abundance.

ohh my now I have to start practicing else risk yet other way of reputational damage if my food is not of quality

I really mean this all light heartily and with intend to just be cool and frivolous.

Perhaps if you would extend me the courtesy of editing my own logbook/dairy? It would feel less of an invasion of personal space that way. I am sure that you intended it that way this section yes?

Am I getting an EV yet?  Sadly, no. 
The prices are coming down a bit, thankfully. 

hahahahhahh



brandnubell

I love how you take effort to change my avatar name.


hahahha

it is a novel twist. One I have not ever seen before in all my years.

hahahha

The device I was referring to is called a "governor." In elevator systems,

When it comes to Wristwatch, my grandfather was a repair outfit.

I was talking to him about the "regulator" he said NO its the escapement... 

no, lift only comes into play when the self destruct mechanism has been proven to be reliable and also that the whole structure can float on water.

Only then we will see how far lift can increase things.

hahah this makes me realize that sometimes one does not need to understand something fully in order to use the effects of it

I mean I am still breathing yet know sooooo little on how it actually works.

ok so early test results suggest that a back iron plating does not benefit a repelling configuration.

So that means that unless I find counter evidence the coming days then traditional still reigns supreme in this dual rotor setup.

 
There is just no way around hard work!! endless measurements and mistakes.



To arrive at an PMA that at least does something then there are no shortcuts to be made I am afraid. You see whether repelling or traditional i can defend both configurations with equal passion and data.

I guess the only real way forward to know for sure is to make use of the process I described in my public thread. I just do not see an alternative yet ;(

The device I was referring to is called a "governor." In elevator systems, the governor is a speed-sensing device that activates the elevator's safety brakes if the elevator car moves too fast. When the elevator exceeds a certain speed, typically indicating a free fall or a significant overspeed condition like cable failure, the governor triggers mechanisms that engage the brakes, bringing the elevator car to a halt. This safety feature is crucial for preventing accidents in the event of mechanical failure.

This section of the forum was invented by me. I am glad to see it works. Any user can use this as long as there logged in.

JW

Yes indeed. It is a nice addition!

So please allow me to rant for just a second.

The turbine is spinning again all night. Next to near completly silent. It is mesmerizing to watch the blades glide.

Yet at around 1.6m/s wind speed I arrive at around 14 seconds per revolution. While at 3.3 m/s I arrived at 13 seconds per revolution.

There is just no consistency. This is ridiculous!!

How is one supposed to design a PMA like this? ;(

 What I got out of this,  is the one who suggested a nose cone (center)

Hello Leheim,
Welcome to Fieldlines.  That's a fine looking project.
I have some follow up questions.  I hope you come back and acknowledge what's been suggested so far.
Depending on what you have chosen as the generator, I think I can point you to some "rules of thumb" to simplify your test plans and how you will recognize progress, as you develop your MPPT controller.