Power for motor home and camping

[nothing to lose]

I have been getting e-mails asking me about inverters/batteries/charging and such for various uses and one person at least wanted his setup for a camper to avoid running a gas genny. I bought a Matrix 5000 and took a 10 day vacation to go pick it up in Ohio.

 With the Minivan I figured the trip would cost me about $160 to drive instead of $300 for just shipping. Little did I know what all I would actaully buy though.

Another unit I bought was a rack mount UPS, 1750watts 120V sinewave inverter in it. I bought it because I wanted it and it was cheap, but I had no real use for it yet. I geuss that is why I bought the motor home

 So I would have a use for that rackmount unit!

The Motor home is a small 1966 Chevy with a straight 6cyl engine and a 4 speed tranny.

 I got an amazing 11.5-12MPG on the way home with it. Watch this diary for ways I later up that milage ALOT! For now the diary is for electric power in it.

My plan is to build the rack mount into the motorhome somewhere. I have several places I can haul batteries, a rear area or build racks under it. Running on batteries when no AC is available should give me 1750watts from the UPS inverter. Then when near Grid power plug in the UPS, the UPS will charge batteries while pluged in.

 The motor home has a straight 6cyl engine and plenty of room next to it, I will mount a DC motor next to the engine and use a belt drive, this will charge the batteries as needed while driving better than a normal alternator would. I will use a lawn mower or go-cart type setup, loose slipping belt that does nothing and an idler pulley I can tighten the belt by pulling a cable. When not in use the belt slips and the engine pulley turns free so no power is lost.

Of course for camping in one spot for awhile there will be a wind gennie mounted on the rear also.

It does not really matter the battery voltage needed for this rackmount unit. I can wire it up with the needed batteries, 24V or 48V will work fine. If I luck out and the UPS is 48V then I will also include connections so that when at home the 48V battery bank can be connected to the 48V bank for the Matrix 5000. If the rack mount is 24V then I will do something else. For charging the bank with a wind genny and the DC motor from the engine the voltage will not really matter and I will just match it up.

I would have had those #29 type arc magnets I ordered already. They were supposed to ship on the 14th. I have been without internet since the 10th while I have been away and I got an e-mail the 14th the shipping address was not correct. We corrected it today so I should have those magnets in another 3-4 days, probably after the weekend.

 For the wind gennie on the motor home I will use an AC motor conversion similar to a garbogen like Jerry's. For the DC motor near the engine I will either use an EFKA brushless 3phase dc motor or a garbogen type conversion.

At this time I am thinking about running the wires in PVC pipe under the motorhome to protect them from any road abuse or sharp edges. The wire size will depend on the voltage but I plan to use welding cable unless a visit to a scrap yard provides me with something less expensive.

Of course there will be plenty of fuses and other needed items used as needed.

After I get my neo arcs I will be shopping for a digital camera again and will post pictures and details as this project progresses. Also pictures of other things I have been working on in another post.

[drdongle]

NTL I had sent you an email about the #29's but never heard anything back from you. how many are you getting, how many available, and how much are they?

[nanotech]

 I will use a lawn mower or go-cart type setup, loose slipping belt that does nothing and an idler pulley I can tighten the belt by pulling a cable. When not in use the belt slips and the engine pulley turns free so no power is lost.

Couldn't you use something like an A/C compressor clutch?  I'm just thinking of wear and tear on the belt when not charging.  Also the possibility of the belt coming off due to lack of tension would worry me.

But I'm paranoid like that!!  

Just an idea......

[nothing to lose]

I was thinking along that lines, then just flip a switch to engage the 12V clutch. I think it will still rob a bit of power from the engine though, belt and pulley will still be running even if the gennie is not. With the loose belt it is the same as it not even being there.

The loose slipping belt I think will work well when done right. Look under any belt driven riding lawn mowers, I think they all use a slipping belt type drive for the drive train and the mower deck both. At least all the belt drive ones I have had do.

That is even a horizontal belt that could just fall off downwards. Unless something is wrong, broke or out of alignment, the belts normally stay in place and just slip.

The belts used like this don't normally get any noticeable wear from the slipping, it's not like a belt that is slipping under a load when it should be tight and working.

Being the type of use also a belt should last forever like this. Although the motor home will be driven on very long trips at times, most of it's life it will be parked either here or there and not running. Not daily driving like a car. I would expect the belt to die of old age before the slipping over a pully would harm it, but I could be wrong too.

[nothing to lose]

Sorry,

 I don't think I got the e-mail unless it was from a different address than you list here. I sent a reply to all the e-mails I had got, and saved all the e-mails too.

 I looked and don't see yours.

I should have an extra 74 still available at the moment.

 They were expensive for me to have them made. I will let forum members have them at $8 each plus shipping.

On E-bay I will be selling them at $10 each plus shipping.

Fedex tracking shows they will be here tommorow.

[Bruce S]

Hey NTL;

 Came Right past STL without even a howler.I could've introduced to the the Alky , I just finished "drying" a small patch resulting in a full quart of the fuel type.

Oh well next time.

I love those old straight sixes, they have tons of low end torque. Does it still use to the single carb?

Couple things about the UPSs if they are APC units, they'll either be 24v or 48v .

Most of the larger units have an addon ports in the right rear you could try measuring the DC voltage there.

 On using the slipping belt design, you might be better off using a centrifugal clutch. This would be way better than having a belt flying around , unless you intent on using an electric pulley to engage a tensioner.

On using the PVC I'm sure you're going to use the black stuff "CPVC" so it can stand up to the extreme hot & cold under the bed, you could also , since it's pretty cheap and easy to find around construction site use conduit too.

Cheers!

Bruce S

 

[DanB]

I dont like the loose slipping belt idea very much.  I think it works fine on lawnmowers and such - but they don't see the hours that a car/truck or van does.

The DC motor/generator idea is OK if you find the right one I suppose, but if its a perm. magnet motor then itll not be efficient over the range of rpm like an alternator would be.  AT full output - car alternators are pretty efficient over a range of rpm.  I'd keep it simple and perhaps install a larger alternator in the van and use it to charge all the batteries.  It's likely to be more efficient and lots less complicated.

[Norm]

NTL, I disagree with the ones that say there is

a small amount of wear,

 If designed properly ...

when the idler pulley isn't tightening the belt

slips into the c-shaped parts surrounding both

pulleys  something like this  BR>


 A little bit exagerated but basically it works

like that.and the belts aren't touching the

moving pulley...of course the other pulley

doesn't really matter but when adjusted properly

all belt driven lawn mowers are designed this

way ...

            ( :>) Norm.

[nothing to lose]

"Came Right past STL without even a howler"

Not quite, would have though. I run down from I70 near effingham.IL on I57 to MO.

Should e-mail me a contact number, I thought about driving that way, no way to call you though. Then I could have ran down I44 to Springfield.

Yes right now it is a single barrel carb, old oil bath aircleaner too.

I pulled the batteries out of the rack mount unit. It's a 24V setup. Never trust low meeter readings as a sign a battery is shot either. I read out I think it was 4-6V each for the 4 12V batteries. After charging over night, unit plugged in turned off, I flipped it on. Battery Leds showed full charge. I did some low power testing first then hammerd it hard with a 1500watt heat gun. WOW, 24V at 14amp hours was running the 1500watt heat gun and UPS, I was draining batteries fast though at that load.

Well I know that the UPS works fine now! 1750watt sinewave inverter in there. Having a bit of trouble getting it to turn on when not plugged in though. I need to download the manaul for it still.

The Matrix 5,000 does power up when uplugged, I think this rack mount should also. Could be a battery problem, maybe to much start up surge for those small bats. and they may be week even tough they power the heat gun a few minutes?

[nothing to lose]

You might be correct about the alternator vs DC motor. But a few advantages I am thinking is able to kick out the load when not wanted like up long hills, if grid power will be availble at a campground or flea market no need to waste any gas on the way charging either, etc...

 Though I could do the same thing I geuss using a second alternator.

 The Motor home won't be driven as much as a normal car in normal use. I don't think the slipping belt will be a problem. But I will try to make sure it can't slap the radiator or such if it does jump off.

Another thing is I will have 2 different voltages, 12V for the motorhome normal stuff, 24V for the rackmount UPS. This perhaps complicates things again as far as using 1 heavy duty alternator.

[nothing to lose]

Thanks, that drawing is kinda how I had it figured also.

Another thing with this type system that I dought I would try, at least not right now, is a way to change the ratios. I never can remember what the pullies are called, but it is variable, like 2 pullies together but the center section slides. So when pulled towards one pulley that belt loosens and the other belt tightens, this causes one belt to ride higher in the groove and makes a larger pulley basically while the other belt rides lower and makes a smaller pulley. Those require 2 shorter belts and more work to set up. But this variable pully is used to change the ratio between the engine and the rearend on some mowers. I don't think that is real common, but I have 2 junk Craftman mowers here that use that varible pulley as the way to drive faster or slower without changing engine speed.

Another way can also be setup sort of like a ten speed bike. An idler pulley on spring tension and a type of derailer to guide the belt. Slide it one way to get a larger pulley on the engine and smaller on the DC motor, or slide the other way for smaller pulley on engine and larger on DC motor.

Either of the two systems would let you choose between a ratio best for idling rpms or for highway speed rpms. The advantage is you could spin the motor faster at low rpm when idling if you needed to charge batteries while parked remotely, then change ratio to prevent over speeding it at 60mph rpms when driving and charging.

Dis-advantage, more to break and alot harder to setup correctly.

 I won't be doing that myself, at least not now. Far to many other things to do, but it could be done either way.

[nothing to lose]

I will try to get some pictures tommorrow of the Motor Home in general. Camera is not good for small items or indoors, but outdoors for large stuff it may work ok.

 Still have not bought myself a camera, have to use the one I gave my daughter.

 I think the problem with that camera is it has to be about 4-6' away to focus correct. Most things I need pictures of are too small and need closeups to show any details and are blurry, far enough away to be clear and the items are too small to see.

 

[nothing to lose]

Well I had lots of things keeping me tied up and slowed down.

Here's a couple pics of the Old 66 Chevy I am working on.

Had to take off the rear add on section so I can put a hitch on it. Only 2' square tubing from the body to the bumper. I would not trust just that for towing a trailer and car. Once I rebuild the rear section the propane tank goes back in and that's where the batteries will be for a 24V system. As I rebuild the rear I will also run 2" tubing or 2" pipe across the back at the lower body for tower base mounts. I have a couple things in mind, not certain which way I will build it yet. I also plan a pipe rack on top for storage and hauling extra stuff. I will fly 2 small gennies on the rear.