Author Topic: Greenhouse anyone?  (Read 48487 times)

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Hephaestus

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #60 on: April 13, 2012, 04:52:33 PM »
Is there a turbine in town I haven't noticed?  :o


David HK

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #61 on: April 13, 2012, 05:46:50 PM »
What an interesting structure.

It has the appearance of a medieval church. I am astonished to observe that the structure sports what I take to be the Canadian national flag. I presume the purpose of this stately symbol is similar to that of an aerodrome wind sock - wind direction in anticipation of a wind turbine yet to be built?

David in Hong Kong




SparWeb

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #62 on: April 13, 2012, 10:52:50 PM »
Is there a turbine in town I haven't noticed?  :o

Nah you'd never see mine, I keep it hidden in tall trees   ;)   I'm a few sections east of Keoma.
I guess you live in one points of the K-I-K triangle, or maybe the outer suburbs of metro-Beiseker?
Send me a private message if you need one of those books.

Does that shed have a foundation?  Or is it on skids?  I have a couple of sheds that size on skids that I've moved once or twice. 
Maybe you don't have to leave it pointed N-S if you want sun on the sloped roof?


David,
You'll just have to get used to it.  There are Canadians everywhere.  Probably, there are some in your home town right now...
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it.  Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.

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Hephaestus

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #63 on: April 13, 2012, 11:25:25 PM »
I'm a short stumble from beefsteaks... I can hear the karaoke as I type  8)

Its on skids, but has the 15amp & Nat gas so less moveable...

What does David have against Canucks? 2 of my great uncles are buried in hk, royal navy circa '42...

David HK

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #64 on: April 13, 2012, 11:55:05 PM »
I don't have anything against Canadians at all.

I took great care to write in a humorous vein.

By the way I am British (Hong Kong Police retired) in case you thought I may be Chinese.

David in HK


Hephaestus

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #65 on: April 14, 2012, 08:17:34 AM »
heh, no - I assume everyone is alien until they prove otherwise  :P

I couldn't do HK, heck I could barely survive life in calgary (and I think it's way too crowded). :)

seilertechco

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #66 on: April 15, 2012, 06:39:47 AM »
I built two greenhouses onto the south side of my basement.  A porch is in the middle.  They protrude 8' and are each 16' wide.  I fabricated the frame out of steel, primered and painted, then used silicone and fasteners with 3/8 poycarbonate twinwall.  The greenhouses are the most enjoyable part of our house and they light the entire basement plus heat. 

I use one to start my garden plants in the spring (have tomatoes, peppers, etc, going right now).  Found a stainless cabinet that fit inside one from end to end (set it in with a crane before building the cover). 

We use them for living space and cannot imagine a better way to build for multiple use.  One must plan for cover in the summer to control overheating. 

Toby

ghurd

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #67 on: April 15, 2012, 03:48:42 PM »
What do I (not David) have against Canuks?
Snowed here 2 days ago.
They need to keep that crap up in Canukia where it belongs!

Then today was almost 80F, which is 26.7 in Canukian.
G-
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Hephaestus

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #68 on: April 15, 2012, 07:53:20 PM »
Only if you keep those snowstorms down in montana from when'st they come lately :) Was in the 70s, then montana goes and sends us snow... It's all that Californian hot air y'know ;)

Found the inside glass for that screen door today, tossed together a quick arduino project, 3 DS18b20's (1wire temp sensors), one inside (floor) inside (Ceiling) and outside (about 3' off the ground). See if we can't get a little baseline data (and curious if I can kick some of the strawberries and sunflowers out of my kitchen  ;) )


SparWeb

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #69 on: April 16, 2012, 01:02:54 PM »
At the UFA (Airdrie) on the weekend and I noticed they're building a greenhouse like yours in their back-lot. 
A little wider, less roof slope, but otherwise same basic idea.  Your GH may be a kit.

Uh-oh, here comes aduino data....
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it.  Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.

System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, regulated by Xantrex C40, DIY 8ft diameter wind turbine, regulated by Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024

Hephaestus

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #70 on: April 16, 2012, 04:47:07 PM »
Yeah, heard a rumor it's actually a 198*'s Acme farm & Building kit :)

I wont torture ya's with data :) Thats what blogs are for

jhnpldng

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #71 on: April 17, 2012, 06:57:01 AM »
Here's my favorite. http://aes.missouri.edu/swcenter/research/Solar-heated%20greenhouse.pdf

Size is 12'x24 and 11' tall at peak, 22- 55gal drums of water for 1100gal thermal storage, in 10 years of testing the lowest outside temp was -13F and inside stayed above freezing, all kinds of cool weather crops have been grown in it, winter soil temps between 40-56F.

I plan on building something similar on the south side of our cabin. Double duty as solar heating. The one above is freestanding.

SparWeb

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #72 on: April 17, 2012, 12:21:19 PM »
Quote
Yeah, heard a rumor it's actually a 198*'s Acme farm & Building kit

Lasted a lot longer than the usual kits ordered by Wile E. Coyote from the Acme Company.
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it.  Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.

System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, regulated by Xantrex C40, DIY 8ft diameter wind turbine, regulated by Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024

Hephaestus

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #73 on: April 17, 2012, 01:30:22 PM »
 ::)

Temp only went down to 3c overnight, that's a good start (-10 outside), guess we're not clearing the plants out quite yet...


petect

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #74 on: January 27, 2013, 09:20:18 AM »
Hilltopgrange

Thank you for taking the time to share the construction details of your greenhouse. Could you explain your water collection / storage system? I would guess that it's buried under or along side the greenhouse? How is the water pumped up? Does it cause much additional condensation, if under?

Thanks in advance.
Pete

TXWolfie

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #75 on: May 21, 2013, 06:29:42 PM »
My buddy's house had a green house attached to it. Upon his dad retiring he got a green thumb big time. The house had a basement which was half above/below ground. The basement also had a back door like all basements should that led to the side of the house. All he did was simply dig out the sides of ground to if I remember 8wide by 12 long. From there he used cinder block and made 2 rows high with a doorway. Simply framed out with 2x4 and used double paned windows for walls and roof which he got free from a house remodel. It actually produced enuff organic heat to heat his entire house in winter and during the summer opened up the door and the front door and made cross ventilation.

GaryGary

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #76 on: May 22, 2013, 08:08:29 AM »
Hi,
I've been working on getting our greenhouse into a four season one.

It started as this sort of test space for low thermal mass sunspace for space heating: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Sunspace/LowMassSunspace/TestsLowMassSunspace.htm

I've added some sand and concrete pavers over the floor insulation, added some 55 gallon plastic barrels along the north wall for thermal mass,  painting most of the inside surfaces white.  Also got an air to water heat exchanger (similar to a car radiator) and plan to mount it in the peak of the GH to heat water in the barrels to store more of the daytime solar heat in the barrels for use at night.  Thinking about some kind of night time insulating system for the glazing -- any ideas?

Mine is also modeled after the U of Missouri GH mentioned above.

For the rest of the summer, the big issue is going to be getting enough ventilation -- I've added a 14 inch solar vent fan at the peak in the east wall, and and AC fan powered vent fan in the west wall (using the 10 inch Grainger fan that does 600 cfm for 27 watts).  Looks like it will still need some more venting or shade cloth.
Just putting in our first plants today -- based our our past record in growing things I'm not envying the plants.

Will be interested to see how the Calgary GH performs as I think you guys have a bit tougher winter than we do in Bozeman -- but, maybe more sun.


Gary



SparWeb

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #77 on: May 22, 2013, 01:18:54 PM »
Hi Gary,
I enjoyed reading  through your sunspace experiment pages when I discovered them a few months ago.  Hope it works as greenhouse for you.

How well will shadecloth work to insulate the glazings overnight?  If stretched continuously across the entire glazing, the shadecloth would create a barrier to both convection and radiation.  Make one sheet large enough, or for starters you could cut several pieces to size and hang them over the windows at night.  Pull them tight to stay close to the slope of the glazings.

...But I'm sure you are ACTUALLY asking about how to AUTOMATE the covering of the windows at night.  That's trickier...

I'm thinking it should be light-activated, not temperature activated.  Since the morning sun is the source of heat that will warm it up for the day, using a temperature differential would delay the opening of the blind.  Likewise, in the evening, the greenhouse will cool down before the blind closes if you use temp differentials to activate the closure.  So use a photocell.

Assuming you still like using shadecloth, it can roll up at the ceiling for the day, and unroll for the night.  Keeping it tight may take trial-and-error.  I don't have a magic-bullet suggestion.

There could be too much solar heat for the greenhouse to work, considering how thoroughly it's insulated.  By July, you will know if what you really need are venetian blinds partly closed all day!

My next-door neighbour is going to build a greenhouse this summer (supposedly).  If so, it will be my first chance to regularly see how one works in this climate.
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it.  Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.

System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, regulated by Xantrex C40, DIY 8ft diameter wind turbine, regulated by Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024

SparWeb

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #78 on: May 22, 2013, 01:22:31 PM »
Oh, I see you already have a pyranometer mounted on the building.  That will be more accurate than the photocell.  Though more complicated, because only a microcontroller or a computer can drive it, or know what to do with the readings it spits out.  It does not sound like that would daunt you at all, though.
No one believes the theory except the one who developed it.  Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.

System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, regulated by Xantrex C40, DIY 8ft diameter wind turbine, regulated by Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024

GaryGary

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #79 on: May 22, 2013, 02:44:17 PM »
Oh, I see you already have a pyranometer mounted on the building.  That will be more accurate than the photocell.  Though more complicated, because only a microcontroller or a computer can drive it, or know what to do with the readings it spits out.  It does not sound like that would daunt you at all, though.

Hi,
Its an Apogee pyranometer -- pretty easy to use.  It puts out 0.002 volts per watt/sm.   I use it with a Hobo logger that scales the pyranometer volts into watts/sm and logs the watts/sm readings.  The plots are from the Hobo software.


Gary

GaryGary

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #80 on: May 23, 2013, 08:49:10 AM »
Hi Gary,
I enjoyed reading  through your sunspace experiment pages when I discovered them a few months ago.  Hope it works as greenhouse for you.

How well will shadecloth work to insulate the glazings overnight?  If stretched continuously across the entire glazing, the shadecloth would create a barrier to both convection and radiation.  Make one sheet large enough, or for starters you could cut several pieces to size and hang them over the windows at night.  Pull them tight to stay close to the slope of the glazings.

...But I'm sure you are ACTUALLY asking about how to AUTOMATE the covering of the windows at night.  That's trickier...

I'm thinking it should be light-activated, not temperature activated.  Since the morning sun is the source of heat that will warm it up for the day, using a temperature differential would delay the opening of the blind.  Likewise, in the evening, the greenhouse will cool down before the blind closes if you use temp differentials to activate the closure.  So use a photocell.

Assuming you still like using shadecloth, it can roll up at the ceiling for the day, and unroll for the night.  Keeping it tight may take trial-and-error.  I don't have a magic-bullet suggestion.

There could be too much solar heat for the greenhouse to work, considering how thoroughly it's insulated.  By July, you will know if what you really need are venetian blinds partly closed all day!

My next-door neighbour is going to build a greenhouse this summer (supposedly).  If so, it will be my first chance to regularly see how one works in this climate.

Hi,
Interesting idea on the shade cloth.  It does seem like it should have some effective R value.

A nice side effect would be that it might be used to provide some partial  shading in the daytime for plants that don't want the full sunlight?

Gary





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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #81 on: May 23, 2013, 01:23:28 PM »
Try looking at the variety of blinds/shutters made for skylights for ideas, since your windows are inclined.  If the shadecloth doesn't work.

No one believes the theory except the one who developed it.  Everyone believes the experiment except the one who ran it.

System spec: 135w BP multicrystalline panels, regulated by Xantrex C40, DIY 8ft diameter wind turbine, regulated by Tri-Star TS60, 800AH x 24V AGM Battery, Xantrex SW4024

Harold in CR

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #82 on: December 17, 2013, 07:35:34 AM »

 Just tried to contribute to this thread and the server times out. The server on Fieldlines is always slow to connect for me,compared to other sites I go to. Might have been a photo upload thing ??

 Anyway, I will try the text and maybe add the photos another time ?

 I live in Costa Rica and have put together a small green house Aquaponics system. We built the wooden frame and covered it with 7 mil plastic sheeting.
We also built the fish tank with wood and lined it with the same 7 mil plastic sheeting. All the grow beds are wood with the 7 mil plastic sheeting.
We have a portable sawmill and lots of trees, so, we are stocked up with lumber. We pulled shade coth over the roof to help take the suns rays from wilting the plants. Now, we have it off.
Soon, the rains will taper off and the sun will get stronger so, we will need to put the shade cloth up again.

 The system is powered by a large car battery and a small computer UPS battery for the 2 air pumps that are located in the fish tank.
The water is pumped to the grow beds using a boat bilge pump, submerged in the fish tank. We have trouble with the power company and have burned up 2 computers and several light bulbs,
from the constant outages and surges as the system comes back online. This is why we use the 12V battery system. Right now, I keep the batteries charged with the power company and 2 battery chargers.
Works very well. Pumps are reasonable and easiy obtained. Soon, we will have more Sun and 3 solar panels,once I get them built. Then, I will start upgrading to better batteries.
We have a string of LED lights over the grow beds on one side of the green house. Tha has made a big difference in growth rates. They are on all night and off during the day.

 Cleaning the fish tank involves using another pump as a vacuum cleaner, and dragging a hose around the bottom of the tank, pumping the solids into a bucket, then, using that water on fruit trees, etc. I also use a whole house cartridge filter, with a pup, to run aabout 4-5 hours every 8-10 days, to filter the water.
That cartridge is washed off and all that residue is used on outside plants. 

 We started the fish about 9 weeks ago. We bought 20 Tilapia from 50-65mm in length. We had put water in the tank and ran pumps for a little bit, each day, to keep the water from stagnating, then, we put the fish in.
The plants we had going were not doing very well, even after the fertilizer factories were introduced. The little fellers just didn't get the job done, in the beginning. After about a week, we started seeing the yellowish colored leaves start to show signs of greening up and new leaves were forming.
Lately, the plants are standing up and blooming. We have several long shape bell pepper plants with peppers from just past bloom, up to 60mm long. Other planys are doing well but, no blossoms.
Bees have not found the plants, so I hand pollenate for now, with a very soft small paint brush. Seems to be working, I guess.

 We have 8 grow beds wit 5 in use. We are having problems getting seeds to germinate, even several different varieties of lettuce? We are going to go back to using dirt and transplant once the small plants are strong enough. This has held us back quite a bit.
We tried cabbages, brussel sprouts, Broccoli, Radishes, etc. Tomatoes are no problem getting started. We have moved some plants outside the green house, since they were getting too tall and falling over.

 Our biggest problem, is mosquitos. The water from the beds goes directly into the fish tank. We know the fish are eating them, because lately, they clean up more feed. We only feed them what they clean up, but, several times a day. We have used 2 kilos of feed, so far.

 I have worn out the keyboard on this computer, trying to find something to kill the mosquitos on the walls and ceiling, without killing the fish. All i find is scientific babble. No laymans talk, at all. If anyone has any helpful advice, we would greatly appreciate it.
We live way out in the campo, so, it's difficult to find a lot of things we want, until the wife goes into San Jose.

 On the Internet, I see a lot of aquaponics systems out in the open. How do they keep the rains from diluting the fertilized water and the fish from jumping out of the overflowing tanks ? This is why we built the green house.

 Any advice as to our system is good or needs changes, we welcome. We are very new to this.

 Thanks,  Harold in CR

Frank S

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #83 on: December 17, 2013, 10:21:51 AM »
Harold thanks for the report I saved it to my computer because I am  wanting to do something similar in the future
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Harold in CR

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #84 on: December 17, 2013, 02:24:30 PM »

 Glad to help, Frank. I could not get the photos to post. Might try another post with a couple if you want a look, or, could email them to you.

 I read all your much earlier posts and learned a few things.

 Harold

Bruce S

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #85 on: December 17, 2013, 02:37:50 PM »
Harold CR;
 Posting can be confusing, took me 5 times and 1/2 hour of string at computer on my first tries.
1st: Make sure they are under the 100kb size, along with 640x480 max size.
Then select the Attachments ,etc, browse to pic, then most importantly change the end-of-post, to inline expandable to the right of browse .
After the first one press Preview, make sure it shows
"attach=" yours will not have quotes around it, but instead brackets and starting with number one after the equal sign
Then follow for more by selecting "more attachments"
You should be working then
Let us know if you're still having problems we can look into it from here.

Cheers
Bruce S
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Harold in CR

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #86 on: December 17, 2013, 06:57:06 PM »
 Bruce
 I checked all the photos but 1 for size. They were all under 640 X 480 and all were under 65K. The one I didn't check might have been oversized. Anyway, I checked them all again, and I did follow the instructions for the first post.

 Lets try this one more time with 7 photos. Well, not perfect but it did go this time.

 

Frank S

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #87 on: December 18, 2013, 12:29:20 AM »
your fish should be about half way to harvest size assuming you harvest them at a little over 1 lb each
 I like them to go a little longer to reach nearly 2lbs but it takes nearly twice as long to add the 2nd lb as it does to reach the first lb and a full year to reach 3 lbs in most Tilapia species  or this is what I found while helping a friend increase the size of his farming operation in Romania
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Harold in CR

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #88 on: December 18, 2013, 07:52:39 AM »

 You are close enough on your estimates, Frank. I assume Romania has a cold climate, like snow and freezing temps ??   We don't have that here.  ;D ;D  Right now, they are about to cover my open hand from wrist to finger tips. They eat like Piranhas when I throw some pellets at them.  :o ;D They should grow faster, here.

 I just found out, a local guy gets $9.00/lb or $20.00 Kilo, so, I almost have the 2nd tank frames ready to install. I could use more colonnes ($).
 The 2nd tank will go in the center of the green house, providing walk around space all around.  Right now, we are having rain day and night for the past 9 days. very little Sun, and, it's chilly here. Wind is blowing nearly all the time and, does slow down during the night, sometimes.

 Here is a photo of the fish tank and rats nest wiring or the pumps.

 

Bruce S

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Re: Greenhouse anyone?
« Reply #89 on: December 18, 2013, 02:42:50 PM »
Harold;
Glad to see the pics!
I gotta ask though  8) what do you consider chilly  :o.
IF you begin to see wilting on the larger plants, try getting some of the RED LED light strings already set for 12Vdc, they come pretty cheap on ebay, even by the roll.
The red will help in Cloro uptake.
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