Author Topic: Water water everywhere and all good to drink  (Read 10969 times)

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Frank S

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Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« on: July 16, 2013, 12:05:07 AM »
Getting a few things ready for the eventual move out to W. Texas I started rounding up items to make a slow biosand-filter.
  I have 10 or 15 of the 55 gallon ploy drums these things are useful for just about any liquid storage.
 they also make excellent vessels to convert into a slow filter .
 Also here is  some helpful information
http://www.biosandfilter.org/biosandfilter/index.php/ click in Biosand then look at the dropdown menu on the left
this is one I found on the web that I patterned my design after.

This is the design that I drew up and have seteled on using

 I probably won't be able to set up the filter system here because transport would be difficult
 but here are some pics of the components I have on hand and have started constructing
 making loops for the drip and collection tubes

Drilled holes in the 1" CTS

cleaning the drill burrs from the inside of the loops
 I used 1" sch 20 pvc for the bushing

assembeling the baffel loops the fittings will not be glued in-case clean out is ever necessary

approximately the position the loops will be placed 

Had a RE negative day today well not quite see it rained and I am never one to allow an opportunity pass if at all possible
 I placed about 20 5 gal buckets under the damaged roof to collect water

I started out filling several poly drums for dog and cat water after filling 6 drums I noticed how clean the water was so I filled one of my totes

 then cleaned out the 2nd one with my air operated pressure washer

 Crystal clear water

1 tote is full all the way to the top the other now has 150 gallons in it and it is still raining
 I hope to collect another 200 gallons tomorow

 
« Last Edit: July 16, 2013, 12:13:22 AM by Frank S »
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XeonPony

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2013, 06:29:23 AM »
basically all that is is a sand filter, they are a functional bio filter you, need aerated water, and. Bio filters are more for removing things such as particulates and cysts (Geardia and such) and to some degree bacteria of certain types, the bio film of bacteria capture these particles and occasionally will require back washing of the bed.

My I recommend for safeties sake put a 8gpm rated UV sterilizer on there? I can guarantee this will sterilize the water 100% at a 3 to 5 gpm flow.

I worked with a water treatment company for 4 years and the things are amazing at what they will do all for the cost of 50-60w from the inverter dc side!  The other thing is use a pump and a venturie and an ozone generator to circulate in your post filtered tank to keep the water sanitized

Other then that, excellent looking build, looking forward to seeing the finished product, and please send a water sample in for testing once it has run for a while, you can never be too safe, a whole family and even the dog all most died from bad water, and it looked crystal clear as well!
Ignorance is not bliss, You may not know there is a semie behind you but you'll still be a hood ornimant!

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dnix71

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2013, 08:10:14 AM »
I don't think that kind of filter will remove arsenic or nitrates. My sister and her husband are going back to Uganda to help them set up water purifiers like yours. Bacteria and parasites are the concern there. The tropical sun can be used for sterilization as well.

Otherwise, the only way to purify contaminated water is to set up a still.

Frank S

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2013, 10:42:02 AM »
 XeonPony; you hit the nail with the UV sterilizer I don't have 1 drawn in but had planned on using one.
  For circulation I have in mind a sail type windmill in mind powering an air compressor  the compressor I visualize would be set up to produce air much the same as the air used in scuba tanks but at very low volume and pressure  this air would be used in 2 places one to provide a constant ventilation for the top part of the sand filter to provide fresh air for the pond scum bio layer that will form in the drip area as this will have about 3 to 4 inches of water above the sand. the top drip loop is to be mounted so as the water level will always be above it.
 the second part of the compressed air will be to keep the water in slow circulation in the output tank.
  Using solar distillation is one good way to insure pathogens are killed  and may be incorporated to a limited extent however this could make what I term as dead water I spent 10 years living in an area where all of the water was processed by starting out as sea water then turned into steam to run the electrical generators then it had to have minerals re added to it that is fine for most uses but you wouldn't want to drink it all the time
   It is sad how the humans on this planet have lost much of their natural immunity to ward off many forms of bacteria
   As a kid growing up our water came from a 48 ft well pumped up to a redwood storage tank the piped directly into the house in a galvanized pipe on filters involved . Once a year the tank was allowed to become almost empty and we got inside to scrape the algae off the sided and clean of the 3 inch thick layer of pond scum  no one ever got sick from it and us kids would often just dip a tin cup in the cattle watering trough for a drink .
  I wouldn't even think of doing that today   
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XeonPony

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2013, 07:31:31 PM »
I grew up in the logging camps, we drank out of ditches streams and all sorts of things, worst I ever got was the runs perhaps once or twice and only for a day, watch a city slicker do that and they're in the ER for a month!
Ignorance is not bliss, You may not know there is a semie behind you but you'll still be a hood ornimant!

Nothing fails like prayer, Two hands clasped in work will achieve more in a minute then a billion will in a melenia in prayer. In other words go out and do some real good by helping!

MaryAlana

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #5 on: July 17, 2013, 01:47:16 PM »
Drank water from the shallow well at the farm growing up, raw milk from my grandpas dairy cows, ate lunch out in the field with filthy hands... I survived just fine.

Frank S

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #6 on: July 17, 2013, 06:39:35 PM »
Drank water from the shallow well at the farm growing up, raw milk from my grandpas dairy cows, ate lunch out in the field with filthy hands... I survived just fine.
  Are you one of my cousins? if you tell me you also used to ride on the head lamp of the old 39 pickup when you were like 10 years old with a .410/22 over under spotlighting rabbits in the fields I know you must be a distant cousin LOL
I live so far outside of the box, when I die they will stretch my carcass over the coffin

Frank S

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2013, 06:46:05 PM »
Back to the water I now have 2 totes filled to the top and 10 55 gallon poly drums full of rain water  at least I have enough water to keep the dogs and cats from going thirsty for the rest of the summer LOL
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tanner0441

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #8 on: July 18, 2013, 12:53:48 PM »
Hi

I recently bought a UV sterilizer for my motor home. I looked at the commercial ones in a stainless housing and they were over 200 or 300 GBP for anything worth having, I then found a 35W unit for 30 the only difference was it was in an ABS housing and designed for a pond. I stripped and cleaned it out flushed it with a chlorine solution then fresh water and plumbed it in. I now don't worry so much if I fill the holding tank from taps on camp sites we use.

On my house I have a point of use filter consisting of a 1 micron ceramic filter followed by a carbon block filter, (I hate the taste and smell of chlorine) this goes to a separate outlet. When there was contamination of the drinking water with farm run off we had been drinking water through the filter for two days before we were told we should be boiling it, so we carried on.

Brian

12AX7

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2013, 03:56:37 PM »
There's been a number of articles and shows talking about wells in Texas (and a number of other states)  being contaminated with a number of dangerous chemicals as a result of fracking. 

I've not heard of simple "pass thru"  filters removing these chemicals,  or is it your intention to treat just rain water?


MaryAlana

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2013, 03:58:05 PM »
Rode the tractor while combining to hunt pheasants but always kept a slug handy in case a deer popped up  ;D

Frank S

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2013, 08:50:11 PM »
I'm not going to carry my own thread off into oblivion by starting up a discussion on fracking but fracturing of the oil or gas bearing strata has b een going on since the days  just after spindle-top. either by the use of explosive chemicals or high pressure salt water injection .
 in the late 70s I had worked about every position on a drill platform there was from worm to daylight Driller. Then to design building them All I'll say on that subject based on personal experiences only  all of our wells had from 2 to 400 ft of surface casing cemented in then after the well TD'd casing was cemented in by pumping cement down then pumped until it came back to the surface . If it were to be put directly into production however much cement that happened to be in the bottom would be drilled to a predetermined depth usually a few feet before TD then the lower casing was perforated.
 in the case of more than 1 pay zone the one with the highest projected yield would be where the casing was shot full of holes then brine was pressure  pumped in until the strata fractured .
 I doubt very seriously if any of the aquifers we drilled through were ever contaminated by this .

 Now back to water out in WTX where we will eventually be moving brackish water can usually be located from 200 to 400 ft but the main aquifers are down around 900 to 1000 . the filter that I am gathering parts for will process that brackish water enough for the aquaponics operation I plan to set up. I will set up a cistern for catching run off evn though it only rains about 10" per year out there     
« Last Edit: July 18, 2013, 09:07:05 PM by Frank S »
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Harold in CR

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2013, 12:05:13 PM »

 I went to the link you provided in an earlier post. When it came to what size sand particles it mentioned, it was pretty tough to visualize what equipment they were talking about, to investigate the sizes of grains od sand.

 What will you use, in WTX as the sand medium ?  Water here is rather inexpensive at $6.00 per month, on a limited quantity, that we hardly ever go over. As I read and pay attention, I can see a problem with water availability in the near future. Down here, it is wasted. REALLY a great amount per day, and, the gutters of the roads in the city are still running with the WATER from septic systems. ? We live in the country, and, have plenty or rainfall and a spring that runs across our place, that the uphill neighbors used for runoff of washing down the dairy barn. I put a screeching halt to that, recently. Now, we have clear although biologically not drinking capable water running again.

 Would the filter you are designing be of any use to us, IF we had to revert to drinking that spring water ?  I had thought about running a pipe up inside the spring a ways, so a back flow of rain runoff would not contaminate the interior of the spring, BUT, the damn neighbors have concreted all around the spring, making a tank, that is not accessible to shove a pipe into the spring.

 Sorry it;s such a long post  ::) ::)

Frank S

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2013, 08:55:26 PM »
Thanks for the reply Harold.
 I like long posts LOL
 OK first off I am not a biologist,  I do have many hours of research in hydrology , aquaculture and know enough chemistry to understand ways to control Ammonia (NH3 & NH4) , nitrite( N02) , Carbon dioxide (CO2),  Hydrogen sulfide (H2S),and PH   for the feasibility of my proposed aquaponics experiment .
  The main reason for the slow sand filter will be for replenishment of water from outside sources in particular water from the local wells which is inherently brackish or from my own well that I might eventually drill. I own an old drill rig but it would cost me almost as much to get it running as it would to hire a well drilled.
 To answer your question the set up I have described has been a proven system for 100s of years. Millions of people in undeveloped and poor countries use these as their only means to clean the water for limited use in many areas they use it as their only source of drinking water.
  That being said we who live in countries where the municipal water supplies are processed in huge treatment facilities to such strict standards; our natural immune systems can no longer tolerate most of the natural pathogens. Heck many cannot even tolerate the beneficial bacterium anymore.
 For that reason I have shown additional filtration sequences to the system plus as was pointed out a UV sterilizer should be added. 
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XeonPony

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2013, 06:56:43 AM »
well it is a good thing to have in place if there are nasties in the water ;) like I said I grew up drinking in streams and such with nothing! but we are lucky that most our ditch water is cleaner then most towns potable water!

But if a deer decides that spot it is standing in the stream is a great place to pull out a news paper, hello ecolie! or a logging company decides to rip up a stream, (Had that happen)

So like any thing it is a good all round fail safe, running 24/7 the bulb lasts a year and they are pretty solid units any 40w balast will do but nive to have ones that measure tube health.

Ozon injection systems are another excellent option, I been slowely building a unit at a glacial pace using silent arc discharge (Coronal) using an ignition coil, 555 timer, mosfet, an old quartze sleave and a masiInjecter (Venturie) and a small 12v pump (An MCP655 swiftech)

it just pumps water in circles drawing in the ozon being generated and circulates it in the tank,  using both you will have dead steryle well oxigenated water.
Ignorance is not bliss, You may not know there is a semie behind you but you'll still be a hood ornimant!

Nothing fails like prayer, Two hands clasped in work will achieve more in a minute then a billion will in a melenia in prayer. In other words go out and do some real good by helping!

MaryAlana

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2013, 01:19:13 PM »
How about a Berkey style water filter instead of UV? Drip system, uses no power other what it takes to fill the top reservoir.  Can buy the filters only here http://www.everylifewaterfilters.com/Products_s/51.htm

Frank S

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2013, 03:42:17 PM »
How about a Berkey style water filter instead of UV? Drip system, uses no power other what it takes to fill the top reservoir.  Can buy the filters only here http://www.everylifewaterfilters.com/Products_s/51.htm
I know several people out in the area we will be setteling who swear by their Berkleys one person has 10 of them installed for their livestock water  they also have a 7 stage small commercial filtration system with a Berkley installed inline to their refrigerator for their ice maker and drinking tap.
 He replaces the elements by the case on a yearly basis.
 Its just one of the things you do to survive and have the comforts of those who live in the city who spend needless $1000s per year for bottled drinking water.
Ultimately I plan on having the whole system tied into cascading aeration heating /cooling systems mounted on the north and south sides of the eventual house shop combination 





 
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XeonPony

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Re: Water water everywhere and all good to drink
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2013, 09:13:07 AM »
UV, 40W outpute, 45 to 50w inpute: 8Gpm flow rate  at 30mJ per cubic centimeter

Ceramic filter with silver, proven to rarely do squate to stop bacteria growing on filter, will remove a great many nasties due to mechanical filtration, slow as mud, and well host of other issues, I've had them befor !

I tossed them all in the garbage and moved to a 4 stage mechanical filter system and then use Ozon and UV if there are knowen nasties, the uv only runs if I get the runs for a couple days, other then that it is just the ozone system to keep the bult storage tank water "fresh" tasting and to keep algea down, and by using a batch system the buld lasts even longer!

most cists are removed by the time you hit 5 microns, I go to 1 micron right befor the UV system, I can pump water from a cattle slew and have perfect safe water at a flow high enough for a shower and rare I need to replace cartiges thanks to the centrifugal seperating filter with a back wash ability that I use.

Carbon blocks remove most the herbicides pesticides and other nasty man made problems poisening the water.
Ignorance is not bliss, You may not know there is a semie behind you but you'll still be a hood ornimant!

Nothing fails like prayer, Two hands clasped in work will achieve more in a minute then a billion will in a melenia in prayer. In other words go out and do some real good by helping!