Author Topic: motor from frontload automatic washer  (Read 1541 times)

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Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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motor from frontload automatic washer
« on: March 11, 2007, 07:41:41 AM »
When we moved to our California townhouse some years back we purchased a new Maytag Neptune frontloading washer and the corresponding drier.  This was back when the model was first introduced.  Unfortunately, there were some serious design flaws with that model and the one we bought finally went beyond repair a couple months back.


It had an electronically-controlled variable-speed motor which was still working fine.  So before shipping it off for recycling I decided to snag the motor for a small mill.  ("Free" is the right price.  B-)  )


I cut the cables a foot or so away.  (It has snap-in connectors so this gives me a place to splice.)


It's labled as a three-phase switched-reluctance motor and clearly has no magnets:  There is no output when spun, no braking when the coils are shorted.  Three independent coils are fed by six wires on one end, a three-wire connection to an optic encoder on the other.  (The encoder has a single optic pickup and a code wheel that seems to involve a pseudo-random code sequence so it only needs one sensor.)


I fed it power from a ni-cad from a power screwdriver, through some very thin test jumpers (which also served as limiting resistors).  This made it step (with very low torque - no doubt due to its high-voltage winding and the low current fed to it).  It takes eight sets of three steps to go a full circle, which I take to indicate that it's an eight-pole.


Nameplate info:


PN 6 2702230

Model H55BMBJA-1820

Switched Reluctance

Autowasher Motor

Impedence Protected

Use only with controller

P/N 6 2702240 Ref 294901



  1. V        Var speed
  2. 5A 3PH    50(degrees) C


Duty Cycle  Max Ambient


  1. min on   Ins. Class B
  2. min off


Haven't had it apart yet.  (Need to clear the workbench first.)  I expect conversion will consist of cutting away alternate poles and mounting magnets there same-pole-up, or cutting away all poles and mounting 8 rows of magnets in alternate up/down configuarion (with maybe a bit of twist to decog).


I figure with 8 poles and a 120V winding it should have a pretty low cutin (though the fact that it can be made to do a centrifugal extraction on the fast end of maybe a 20:1 belt drive might bode ill for that).


I also figure the wind will cool it enough that the duty cycle won't be an issue, so it would be good for about 4 amps in delta (or jerryrig) as wound, but that might be multiplied by a factor of two, four, or maybe even eight by cutting the coils apart and rewiring them in parallel or series-parallel combo for lower voltage and higher current.


So maybe 50W to a couple hundred if I'm lucky.


Thought about using a variant of the controller to excite it unmodified by feeding it magnetization power deliberately slow, so it would generate as it is overdriven by applied torque.  Decided that would work but would have the same energy issues as exciting an alternator (such as excitation power consumption being highest when wind is lowest) so conversion was a need-to-do.


The motor mounts on two pivot pins molded into its end caps which go into holes on the washer guts' body (with rubber or plastic bushings) and one screw through the guts' body to hold it in place and position it to tension the belt.  I salvaged the rubber bushings so I should be able to drill holes in the eventual mill, insert the bushings and mount the motor.


The pins are pointed the wrong way to resist wind force if it's built into an upwind mill without reversing the rotor and its shaft, leaving the holddown screw as the only support against the wind.   I'll look into what can be done about that when tearing it down.  (Has a pressed-on pulley for the drive belt so reversing it is problematic.)  Might fix the issue by putting a block behind it to hold the motor forward when it's in positon.


Also salvaged the belt and enormous pulley, in case I want to do a VAWT.


Having done that, I realized that the guts of a front-load washer are almost all the guts of a belt-drive VAWT just sitting right there:  Big mainshaft and bearing with a waterproof seal, suitable for considerable side-force (designed to support a basket full of wet laundry).  High-ratio belt drive, motor mounted appropriately.  Cut off the water tank, replace the basket with a set of turbine blades, add magnets to the motor, paint the molded plastic to protect it from the wind, put a water shield "umbrella" over the back of the motor and a sun-shade fingerguard around the belt, and you have a VAWT ready to stick on a platform.  The pulleys and belt will be on the underside of the mounting plate, protected from wind, rain, and sun.  The motor will stick up from the plate and block a little of the wind, but not all that much.


So if I get the chance before the junkman gets here I may pull the mechanical guts out of the washer and see if it's suitable.

« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 07:41:41 AM by (unknown) »

outback

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2007, 04:05:03 AM »
While sitting here reading this I couldn't help wonder when the dryer would be ready for salvage.And does the washer have a stainless tub?
« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 04:05:03 AM by outback »

dalibor

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2007, 06:06:00 AM »
here at Serbia front loading washing machines are used in more than 90 %, so i guess there is a greet source of old motors from them.

a colleague of mine is very good in repairing them - doing it as a extra job for more than 20 years. from one chat with him i have learned that there are various motors in them - depends what manufacturer had in mind while constructing it.


if you do something with your motor, please post pictures as much as you can.

« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 06:06:00 AM by dalibor »

vawtman

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2007, 07:53:44 AM »
Ungrounded dont know much about the motor but converting a washing machine into a vawt sound like fun.You could cut up the cabinet to make the blades and attach them to the outside of the drum.


 fun fun

« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 07:53:44 AM by vawtman »

tecker

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2007, 08:06:46 AM »
Should have an inner and outer tub the gage wire on those motor is fairly good size and a lot of it as it's a high torque 120 motor .Ohm them out any winding over 10 ohms is good for 20 plus volts.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 08:06:46 AM by tecker »

tecker

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2007, 08:08:04 AM »
That's at VAWT speed.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 08:08:04 AM by tecker »

RP

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2007, 12:22:07 PM »
I've got one of those motors new in the box from a warranty repair (needed the driver board and they sent a motor with it).  


One  other thing to consider:  The Neptunes have a liquid filled dynamic balancer on the front of the drum.  That's what makes the waterfall sound even when it's empty of water.  I wonder if that could be used for a VAWT as well.  I don't know if the liquid is water but if so it could probably be replaced with a glycol mix for winter use.


Also, the driver board has some decent parts on it too.

« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 12:22:07 PM by RP »

grasshopper

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2007, 09:41:08 PM »
Hi,


I just took apart one of these motors tonight and then found this diary.


This is what I found inside... There are 12 wound poles around the outside which are color codes with purplish, black, and plain wire. The armature is about 4 inches in diameter (I didn't measure it) and 2 inches wide with 8 poles. The slots are slightly less than 1/2 inch deep and about 1/2 inch wide at the bottom and wider on the top. It looks like a 2 x 1/2 x 1/4 magnet would fit right in there without any cutting. The pressed on pulley will fit through the bearing hole in the front of the housing so it doesn't have to be removed to get the motor apart. I have the board but it is said to be bad. The 6 pole connectors are there and would be handy for hookup. The position sensor assembly is on the back of the motor and connects with a 3 wire connector. Condition unknown...


It has pretty good looking bearings that seem to be in excellent condition.


Would gluing 8 magnets into the armature make this into an alternator? Of course rectifiers and maybe reconfiguring the wiring would be needed too.


grasshopper

« Last Edit: March 11, 2007, 09:41:08 PM by grasshopper »

alancorey

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2007, 11:32:18 AM »
If this is the motor I think it is (or the same series) take a look at people's luck with these variable/switched reluctance motors in these posts:


http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2006/12/28/153/72126

http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2005/3/15/143523/391

http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2005/7/14/42640/9511

http://www.fieldlines.com/story/2005/10/5/145655/736


I've got 2 of these, still haven't opened one up.  Clearing my workbench is out of the question.  I take things apart on the barbeque grill, because that gets cleared off and used every weekend.  Under that is the can for woodstove ashes so that also gets used frequently.


  Alan

« Last Edit: March 12, 2007, 11:32:18 AM by alancorey »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2007, 02:26:57 PM »
Yes, that third one looks like it - and the others releatives.  (Looks like I typoed one letter of the model number, turning an L into an A.)
« Last Edit: March 12, 2007, 02:26:57 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2007, 06:15:36 PM »
One  other thing to consider:  The Neptunes have a liquid filled dynamic balancer on the front of the drum.  That's what makes the waterfall sound even when it's empty of water.  I wonder if that could be used for a VAWT as well.


It should work if you leave some slop in the mill's support.


(On a HAWT it would be a disaster due to impeding startup.)


I don't know if the liquid is water but if so it could probably be replaced with a glycol mix for winter use.


You could try freezing it and see if it stops gurgling.  Work your way down on temperature so the ice doesn't crack the housing if it freezes.

« Last Edit: March 15, 2007, 06:15:36 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2007, 06:34:33 PM »
Thanks for the info.


It looks like a 2 x 1/2 x 1/4 magnet would fit right in there without any cutting. ... Would gluing 8 magnets into the armature make this into an alternator?


Ought to if the poles are alternate up and down.  The blades would "short" much of the flux, though.


I'm thinking of doing that after grinding down the rotor pole pieces, leaving stubs just long enough to position the magnets - then shimming them at opposite ends to get some skew.  That will get rid of the "magnetic short" while using the original geometry of the rotor to keep things aligned.  Then if it cogs too much I'll pull 'em back out and grind away angles on the ends of the pole stubs (probably with the Dremmel-knockoff) to get the skew I want.  (Should be able to mark it and do the poles evenly enough to keep the geometry symmetric.)


I've got a grinding wheel I purchased for sharpening the blades of my wood chipper.  (It was comparable in cost to a new set of blades or having the shop refurbish the old ones.  Sharpen 'em once and it's paid for itself.  Free grinder - what a deal!  B-)  )


I hope to be able to cover the bearings and make a wooden jig to let me spin the rotor and slide it along the shaft direction to do the final cut on the rotor poles.  That should keep it close to balanced.  (Approximating a surface grinder in lieu of using a lathe.  B-)  )  Alternatively I might grind flats on the ends of the stubs and mount some small magnets there to decog things.  (Will depend on how the stator poles are spaced.)

« Last Edit: March 15, 2007, 06:34:33 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »

Ungrounded Lightning Rod

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Re: motor from frontload automatic washer
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2007, 08:54:32 PM »
Now that I look at the pictures more closely, it looks like kinto455's suggestion to mount the magnets all N side up (using the existing pole pieces as consequent S poles) is dead on.  The poles have enough space between them that they shouldn't "short" the field with the Ns all up and they're lined up with the coils just right to turn this into a 16-pole 3-phase genny.


It may also require reversing the sense of alternate coils of each phase.  (Have to check that once I get it apart.)


But if it means no machining, just a little wire cutting and splicing, hot DAMN!

« Last Edit: March 15, 2007, 08:54:32 PM by Ungrounded Lightning Rod »