Author Topic: How do you make a dam work?  (Read 17292 times)

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pyrocasto

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How do you make a dam work?
« on: April 07, 2005, 01:54:34 AM »
On our property, I've built a 3 foot wide, 1.5 ft tall, about 8" thick dam. It's just to hold the water still and have a little more height. Only problem is I have a couple feet layer of top soil, on top of clay. When we first built the damn it worked as it should have, for around 6 months. But I look at it one day, and it suddenly has a leek. 4 leeks actually, where the water is going into the walls, and coming out below the dam. After hours of diggin I found out that a big ole craw dad was my problem the whole time. The big salemanders didnt help out either. :| Now I get something else to fill with cement.


I was told there is a soil substance you dump in ponds when they get small leaks, or to prevent it. Is there anything I can dump on the banks of the body of water, to help stop water from crawling around my dam? I'm almost ready to dig it out better, and throw down a layer of poly plastic...

« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 01:54:34 AM by (unknown) »

rotornuts

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2005, 08:12:30 PM »
Pyro, make it wider(thicker). I'd add material till the base is at least as wide as the dam is high plus the 8". Make sure you compact the fill as best you can and use clean clay with no organic matter such as sod. The clay should also be fairly fine, If it's clumpy it works like gravel. Use a rotortiller to break up your fill material.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2005, 08:12:30 PM by rotornuts »

Chiron

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2005, 08:44:35 PM »
I think what your asking about is called "Bentonite" and is used to seal basments, foundations and even put under landfills to stop water from moving through it.


You might want to check with local regs about putting it in a stream at your location first.

« Last Edit: April 06, 2005, 08:44:35 PM by Chiron »

scottsAI

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2005, 10:46:15 PM »
Dam Classic problem


Assumptions: Dam is made of concrete?

Earth filled Dam of 8” would not hold back 1.5' water.

Earth dilled dam should be three times thicker than the water is deep. Totally dependent on soil type.


Next how deep is the concrete?

The Dam must mass more than the water it holds back, based on depth. The Dam needs to be held in place by a structure or by its weight.

The foundation of the dam must be deep enough so the water does not seep under it, with the resulting leaks or the dam washing away - given time.


The critters are just doing what comes natural, digging under your dam wall.

The foundation must be deeper than the critters dig.

For how small your pond area is you would think some poly would fix it, Normally it would, but the critters will dig through anything thin...

Since your in a fix. Putt protection at the foot of the Dam in the water area. Make as wide as the critters can dig, and made of something they can't dig through.

Have fun.

« Last Edit: April 06, 2005, 10:46:15 PM by scottsAI »

Big All

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2005, 02:31:35 AM »
Yup, I ain't never heard of a crawfish breaking a beaver dam.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 02:31:35 AM by Big All »

nothing to lose

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2005, 02:42:49 AM »
 My little book on building dams :)


Dams are not hard to build at all. Smaller ones are easy, I needed a large one in a gully between two hills.

I did alot of studing on this before having two BOZOS come out and ruin the job. I knew what I wanted and how to build it but I had no dozer, no place here to rent one either. The morons had dozers and supposed to know what they were doing but too stupid to do what I wanted! 10' deep pond, ya right I stand in the lowest part and look over top the dam! I already spent about $600 (or more) for nothing and decided I will wait till I buy my own backhoe or dozer and do it myself. Good place to go 4 wheeling in the jeeps is all I have there!


Anyway to answer your questions.


First the water side does not have to have much taper, do it as you want as long as it does not fall back in, like straight up would fall when wet. It does not hurt to taper this side and does add strength, also make it easier to get out if an aninaml or person falls in (bigger dams) but you get that strength by thickness and does not matter what side it's on.


The back side of the dam needs to be very thick at the base, this is where the most water pressure/weight is. The dam can slope, bank to the top. Keep it thick all the way to the top. Remember that water only wants to go one direction, forward, and to get there it is trying to push the dam over backwards, so the top needs support as well. Taper up to the top and keep it thick. How thick depends on the on the size  of the pond, Like someone already said. Shape and width etc.. also come into effect.


For instance it takes a much smaller dam to make a large pond if your only damming up a 2' wide outlet than it would to dam up a 10' wide outlet for the same size pond. In otherwords your only holding back that 2' of water and the natural bank of the land is holding back the other 8' with that small dam, where as with a 10' wide dam your holding it all back with only the dam.


Think of that part like a board or a steel beam. 2' wide a 2x4 may be great for a heavy load, 10' wide it won't support much so you need alot more. Basically same with dams.


When building your dam use the most solid earth you have. Clay is the best. The rest of your pond is going to be natural earth that is already there right, the dam can be also. The more solid the earth will pack the better your dam will be and the smaller it can be also. Top soil good for planting in is probably the worst for a dam! If you use enough it will work also, but what a pain I think.


Packing your dam is about the most important thing there is. And probably where the most people mess up and have a leaking dam also. If using heavy equipment like a dozer on a large dam like mine should have been, then drive over it often, alot! Lay some clay a few feet thick, drive over it and pack tight as posible, build up more, drive more. The better you get this packed the less chance of pinhole leaks and larger leaks too. Also the harder it is packed the harder it is to dig into, many critters may choose a softer location if it is too tight.


"I've built a 3 foot wide, 1.5 ft tall, about 8" thick dam."


So here's what I would do for a great dam.

Your building a small 3' dam, if you can drive a riding mower or 4 wheel drive jeep, car, or what ever you have over the dam alot it helps!! Toss on a layer of clay, all the way across the width and length, drive over it about 4-6 times packing it all, toss on more clay drive etc..  The heavier the vehicle the thicker the layer can be, but the thinner each layer the tighter it packs, so your choice on that. Also moist but not wet clay would be the best for packing. Think of packing a mold to press into a brick. Dry clay will crumble, soupy clay would squirt out under pressure, moist clay pack tight and stays. About the same for a dam.

Since your only going 1 1/2' high I would do 3 6" layers and drive a car over it well each layer. I would go for about 2'-3' thick dam at the base at least and 1' at the top. The thicker the better but that should work for a small one.


Also I would go about 6" higher than I want the water if you have any running water into that area that will rise the pond sometimes. Make a small scoop into the top like laying in a 6" pipe, or better yet actaully lay in a small section of pipe. This will prevent the top of the dam from washing away durring high water levels if it over flows. It just runs through the pipe and no errosion.  


To seal your pond or dam plain old wood ash from the wood burner is great. Dump it into the water at the dam so it just spreads out like a dust fog in the water. This lets the water carry the tiny ash particals into any tiny leaks that you may have. It may not work for a 1/2" tunnel of a crawdad very well, but it might if the water runs slow enough, but anyway it works great for tiny leaks you may have now and helps seal future ones as they occure sometimes too like at the base where it settles eventually. If you think latter you have a tiny leak again, toss in another bucket of ash.


For people building a compleate new pond, pigs are great for packing the new pond tight also, pen them up and let them run the pond. Those tiny little hoofed feet and heavy weight really does some good packing. Dig a new pond and run pigs all year till the get too market hog size and your pond should not leak, if it ever does leak, run hogs again :)


DUCKS, those are good for sealling ponds and dams also. Grab a duck by the neck and beat the ground down tight :(

 Duh, no that's not right, DON'T  DO THAT, it was a joke!

Ducks are good seriously though. Most people don't know a duck will try to preserve it's habbitat and can find those little leaks. Sometimes when you see ducks diving under they may be feeding, but alot of the time they swim to the bottom and pack a little leak to trying to stop it, it works. If you like ducks and have a pond it's a good combination.


Well that's my little book on building dams. I have built smaller dams for both streams to create small ponds, and normally standing water to rise the levels with rain runoff. Only problem I have really had I could not fix is that big 10' deep pond I wanted and only because I have no equipment to do it myself. That's MORE than a ton of dirt, Big area! Maybe 50' -70' or more acrossed the dam, I never messured it, but I think I could sit my 70' trailer house on top of it. For sure we make nice loose circles driving the jeep in that area, round and round and round. Well at least I don't have to worry about running over any fish since I don't have any :(

« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 02:42:49 AM by nothing to lose »

Gary D

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2005, 08:30:59 AM »
You could try rubber roofing material. Many outlets sell scrap(unused excess) for lilly ponds and reflecting pools, etc. As for the sidewall thickness others have good thoughts. Good luck, not sure how any Governmental/environmental groops would see this material tho....
« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 08:30:59 AM by Gary D »

ghurd

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2005, 08:49:33 AM »
I don't know what the stuff is. But I have seen it.

It is a white powder. Maybe calcium? Maybe powdered milk? I said I don't know.

They spread it around the bottom of ponds before the water gets in. It seals the ground some. It doesn't take much, only looks like frost when they are done, and sure doesn't look like it would do any good.

I bet you could call one of the on-line pond supply places and ask.

Then go buy 5 pounds at the feed store.

G-
« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 08:49:33 AM by ghurd »
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scottsAI

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2005, 09:00:45 AM »
Of course not. Beaver dams are huge, much beyond the critter factor.

We are talking about an 8” little tinny Dam thing. Well within the critter factor as evidenced by it's occurrence!

Have Fun!
« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 09:00:45 AM by scottsAI »

pyrocasto

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2005, 10:53:43 AM »
Well, I made the damn to the clay. The critters cant get under it, but they can go around it. Even if it goes through 10ft of ground to get around it.I think I found a week spot where I can dump a little crete and stop the critters.

« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 10:53:43 AM by pyrocasto »

pyrocasto

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2005, 11:16:21 AM »
Lots of good info there. I wish try the as thing, since I have some extra of that so it couldnt hurt. And yes, it's concrete. If I had a tractor it would be soil, but it would also be about 6' high and about 20' thick. :)
« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 11:16:21 AM by pyrocasto »

elvin1949

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2005, 07:20:27 PM »
lime

later

elvin
« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 07:20:27 PM by elvin1949 »

nothing to lose

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2005, 09:21:25 PM »
" Beaver dams are huge, "


Perhaps that's why the farmers and such used to blow them up with Dynomite :)


I think I even heard of one Beaver Dam so huge it has a power plant inside :O)

« Last Edit: April 07, 2005, 09:21:25 PM by nothing to lose »

rotornuts

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2005, 12:40:51 AM »
I could be wrong but I believe the lime is to adjust the ph not seal the pond.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2005, 12:40:51 AM by rotornuts »

pyrocasto

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2005, 04:28:53 AM »
Advanced critters arent they?
« Last Edit: April 08, 2005, 04:28:53 AM by pyrocasto »

finnsawyer

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2005, 09:58:48 AM »
Well drillers use bentonite to stop leaks in wells.  Check with them.  Try googling "bentonite" to get info on how to use it.  I put in a pond, but didn't have enough clay to seal it, particularly where a natural underground seep ran under the dam face.  I spread bentonite as best I could from the bank as the water dried up during the summer.  It seemed to help.  The stuff, which is a mixture of clay and cement, comes in bags.  It cost me about $9.00 per bag.  The seep or spring inlet is still there on the opposite or house side and does help to keep water in the pond.  
« Last Edit: April 08, 2005, 09:58:48 AM by finnsawyer »

nothing to lose

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2005, 09:12:28 PM »
Yes, nature actually has all the answers, we just have to look for them and stop thinking we are so darned smart and superior.


Humans are nothing more than animals that can use tools, and we are about the only ones that ruin our own inviroment also. How smart is that??


I been in some mighty nice caves, the cave men had the right idea all along, just not enough to go around :(

« Last Edit: April 08, 2005, 09:12:28 PM by nothing to lose »

ghurd

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Re: How do you make a dam work?
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2005, 11:58:55 PM »
Explosives slow them down.

For a while.

Not long.


A single bullet to the...


But I digress.

G-

« Last Edit: April 09, 2005, 11:58:55 PM by ghurd »
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