Poncelet Wheel Design

[frogvalley]

I am looking for plans to build a metal Poncelet style undershot wheel to connect to an axial flux type alternator. Anybody got plans or diagrams? Approximately 4 feet x 12 or 18". I have all the common sketches and pics that you can google for, looking for more. Being a blacksmith and machinist I want an iron one, not wood or plastic.

Any help? Point me in the right direction.

[Kwazai]

just some general info here- search the page for wheel...

http://sleekfreak.ath.cx:81/3wdev/CD3WD/INDEX.HTM

L8r

Mike

[Nando]

The Poncelot size depends on the power you need, can you define your requirements or is just for a "show" build ?.

What is the water volume and the head?.

Poncelot is a mechanical heavy (I called a nightmare) -- too complicated.

If still interested send me a direct mail to send to you the article about it.

Nando

[frogvalley]

Nando,

Definitely not for show and not too complicated. I can fabricate just about anything. I have built 7 foot tall power hammers and other complicated machinery. Laying pipe and more for a turbine seems more trouble than an undershot wheel anyway. I really hate digging, besides the hillside that the stream runs against doesn't allow that.

As to power needed, well I'll take what I can get, it will supplement the solar and wind. Head is about 2 feet , could be made  to have more. Flow is maybe 400 gallons per minute at peak flow time and half that in summer.

My intention is to up the RPM's through belting or gearing and use a Piggott style alternator. The next generation of the Wind Genny that I have in progress. Sized to suit the actual power available.

[Zigge]

Looking for plans to build a Poncelet wheel? Me to!

Here are some links...

http://mve.energetika.cz/vodnikolaDD/poncelet.htm

http://clients.newel.net/particulier/amader/endessous.htm

http://www.mike.munro.cwc.net/alt_e/publ/l428-433.pdf

http://www.mike.munro.cwc.net/alt_e/publ/lineham.htm

http://www.mike.munro.cwc.net/alt_e/publ/frizell.htm

http://www.waterwheelfactory.com/Stratton.htm

...and here is a picture of my water wheel. The head is only 9" and it runs without a load at about 35-40 rpm. Next summer I hope for 100 watts, maybe from a new wheel with Poncelet's design.

[frogvalley]

Is that a floating frame or is it anchored? I have too many questions about it so if you wouldn't mind telling me about EVERYTHING! LOL. How many watts are you getting now?

That is very cool.Tell me more please!

[Zigge]

The frame is only anchored by stones. One of my neighbors built this water wheel, and she belted it to a car alternator, but it didn't work so she gave it to me.

On the picture above the water wheel runs without a load at about 35 rpm. The blades, bolted on two plastic bicycle wheels, are made of aluminium (not a good chose, se more pictures). The diameter of the water wheel is 0,95 m (3'), and the blades are 0.55 x 0.55 m (22" x 6").

I am going to use a washing machine motor as generator, and I hope for 50-100 watts next summer when it's all finished.

Here are some more pictures and video clips (QuickTime)

http://hem.passagen.se/publikmagneten

[Nando]

WITH the values you present at best you may get about 90 watts LESS the losses due to the RPM multiplier.

You could do much better with a Banki, in full flow mode driving a Hugh generator directly ( no multiplier) and as well much smaller and easier to do.

This way you may obtain around 80-85 watts and increasing the head by one foot to obtain 50 % higher power that can be done by piping the water from higher grounds.

This what I am suggesting was done in Argentina with a 100 feet pipe the power was upped by 250 % at less than half the cost if compare with the Poncelot he was planning to build, 650 watts directly and normal seasonal water levels.

Nando

[Nando]

Interesting !!

By just looking at the photo, it is clear that the wheel will not be able to produce 100 watts, for the blades are not conformed and, as well, the blades are not ended sealed.

http://www.mike.munro.cwc.net/alt_e/publ/l428-433.pdf

Carefully examine this article and calculate what you have and what you can attain.

Nando

[Zigge]

Yes Nando, I have to build new vanes to the wheel and a new frame.

I have read the article and I think I know how to do it. If it don't work, I can increase the head, and the flow.