Simple River Hydro

[aususer]

Christmas is coming, and in the US you all rug up... in Australia - we go BUSH for Dust, flys and waterskiing!

I am looking at spending a week with that family and friends in a very remote area next to the murray river (lots of water moving about "walking pace" with HEAPS of current a few meters from the bank).

I'm doing solar to 4x 25Ah 12V batteries in parallel... but I've been thinking that there is heaps of water moving there.. 24hours a day - how about using it to generate some juice?

My thoughts: a prop (like a boat prop or similar - maybe something we build) sitting at (say) a 60o angle) to a longish propshaft (get it down deep where the good current is), direct to a generator (of some sort... probably something like a 100W/300W Perm Mag motor), sitting on top of a "floating" housing, fitted with outriggers to handle the wake from the waterskiing we will be doing.

The whole thing tethered to the bank..

Fashioning my ideas on a boat-type towed generator I saw on the 'net which was completely submerssed.. (I doubt I could make that happen - I could make it water resistnt however)

I put it to you... A waste of time? It seems like its feasible (in our inebreated minds at least)..

[wdyasq]

Take a look at the props from 'HPV' - Human Powered Vehicles - boats for prop design or the 'Gorlov' Helical turbine for ideas.

Good luck,

Ron

[Turbulent]

Sounds good but a boat prop would have tobe a big one, the current speed of that river would not turn that prop fast enough even with gearing it would have to be even bigger as it would load the prop down.

The other problem with the murray is a lot of debris (dead trees, logs and other stuff) is very common and pulled with the current under the water surface and could damage or take off with or even pull it under, at the locks on the river the operators are for ever removing this stuff so the locks can remain in operation.

Not saying it is a bad idea I think it is good, I used to live next to the murray near Renmark SA and I even thought about it too, just before I moved to suburbia. I lost two boats due to debris floating under the water surface near the river bank.

Maybe a paddle wheel design? Maybe not to big might get unwanted attention.

Good luck with what you try with the right design it will work but watch out for those holiday house boat drivers they seem to take any thing out including jetties and gennies.

Turbulent.

[Nando]

Your thoughts are so spread and non informative that is difficult to give you suggestions.

In many parts of the world ( Africa and South America) people are generating electrical power with in-river-hydro systems.

What is the speed of the water, the depth in the area of interest -- then with the information a calculation can be done to see how many watts per square meters can be produced.

Indeed, it is a practical system for generation of power levels of around 100 watts up .

Nando

[finnsawyer]

So we all 'rug up' in the US in the winter.  Around here they rev up the snowmobiles from Nov. 15th to April 15th and head for the trails or ice fishing or hunting.  That's five months, mate.  I just wanted to set the record straight.

[disaray1]

  I dont know what "rug up" means. In florida here, during winter, people put on the swim trunks and ride around in convertibles with hot blond chicks and enjoy the global warming UVs. Summer's a bitch cause the chicks all go back north to get facelifts. Oh, and speaking of Bush, a genuine Thanks for accepting our Pres. Bush into your country for a while. The longer he stays gone, the longer we dont have to hear about "how well THINGS are going",  and "terrerists". Fear, fear, fear. Sheesh.  Back to the question.

 Here's a idea thats been aah,   floating   around,   () for a while (1500 years)

  http://www.grunweb.org.uk/page30.html

 and all you need is a barge (and a cow catcher to go underneath the front for the debris) and an undershot wheel. What could be more fun than having your own barge?

 Seriously, scale it to a longboard size (3m)catamaran and a big anchor? I've got no experience with Hydro. Grain of salt kinda thing.

 I saw a fly here today that was well over an inch long. Jet black. How big are your flies? You got croc's in that river? Gators and crocs make waterskiing interesting. Especially when the skier falls often.

 Happy vacation!

 David

[aususer]

Yea yea yea... thanks for the flames. Me an my big trap. sigh

I know not ALL of the US suffer from "cold"... and yes, a lot of Aussies suffer from heat exhsution in temp >15oC... We are expecting temps in the order of 30oC to 45oC during summer where i live (melbourne).

We head towards water when hot.

To answer some actual questions:

I can't tell you how fast the river runs - I live 300+Km's from the river. I was there on the weekend and didn't measure it.

If I can find out - I will post it.. for now I can only offer "walking speed".

yes, the debris/snages/etc could be a problem... but I don't care if this "thing" gets damaged - we are not living off of it - it is simply supplimenting our 12V needs. I always have solar. All care no responsibility etc.

I am hoping to put this on a bend near the bank - we rarely have a problem with snags that close to the bank. But you make a good point. thanks

Point taken about the prop, i will look at other alternatives, and I think the locals will frown on a waterwheel - no matter how temporary or "how small". Noise is a factor too. I saw an interesting idea involving a "trolling motor" - worth it?

We are building a pontoon/jetty for the skiboats - I wonder if maybe I can build something on that??!! A thought...

I simply wanted to know if there is a way to do this/anyone has done this.

Sounds like a lot of negatives...

Oh yea, and for those who don't know much about aussies: we have 'roos delivering the mail (e-mail?); "the bush" is one big tree in the middle of the desert; don't look up into trees for all the "drop bears"; "rooting" means something VERY different here - as does "fanny" (Can you tell we get asked alot about this).

The Crocs are not much of a problem in fresh water BTW - it is the "salties" that will eat you, and they are all up "north" (Darwin, Queensland etc). It woud make me a better skiier.. and i know someone who did it in darwin (yes.. an idiot)

And.... you can have YOUR Bush back... I can't believe that he could shut down a whole city (Sydney CBD) when he visits. You lot must get so pissed when he visits your towns!

Thanks to all for posting - I know you all mean well <grin>

Mike

[ignesandros]

I posted a year or two ago about a screw-type submerged turbine. I've since experimented with washing machine motor conversions and they seem to work for temporary power, at least worth the materials and effort.

I like the pontoon/barge idea. Based on "walking pace" I'd say even an undershot paddle wheel won't make much sound except a tad bit of slapping (unless you don't grease the bearing - squeak!).

Yes, Bush shuts down our cities - hell, even the vice-president shut down downtown Louisville when he visited here twice last year. It's paranoia, I guess.

Ha, drop bears... I heard about those in a game called Escape Velocity.

[fungus]

'Ha, drop bears... I heard about those in a game called Escape Velocity.'

Didnt think there was anyone else who played that game.. lol

Its a bit of an aussie myth (though they wont admit it...)

[aususer]

Oohh.. the more I ready about Gorlov Turbines... the more I like!

Has anyone had any experiance in "Gorlov" Turbines and sizing them?

From the designs I have seen - they were in the 5-10meter lengths (at least one video I found did anyway). So I am not sure where to go from here..

Can anyone expand on this at all?

I envisage one unit - about 1 meter in "hight" that I submerge to the bottom of the river. I want to build it "colapisble" ie. I can bolt/unbolt using stainless locknits) so I can ship it in my trailer.

I am visualising that there would be a fair amount of torque on this so using some type of gearing system to a "generator" (probably something like a PM or treadmill type thing) that has been splashproofed.

I only need it to work for a week to two..

out of the realm of possibility?

Anyone built one?

Any ideas on building one?

[DBuller]

Greetings, you are looking for "Run of the River" hydro. This is still a developing field. Some interesting things going on, incuding what I am doing. Please take a look at my "contact" page where all my lnks are. Look under the "Run of the River" sites.

  http://www.wildwaterpower.com/contactus.html

Sincerely,

Dennis

[pepa]

[ wander what a top load washing machine agitator would do mounted on a shaft and let down into a strong current. might be fun to try. pepa