What type of well pump do I need?

[dave123]

I have city water, but am trying to set up a backup water supply from an existing well, assuming it can still be operational.  This is for emergency use.  There was a well pump with tank here, but it has been removed.  Is this a jet pump?  There is a 1.5" pipe that goes straight into the ground, and the 3/4" pipe sticking out of the side of the wall.  This is in a cubbyhole protruding from the side of my basement wall, I am assuming it was a well house previously, before the house was added on over this section; ground floor only.

You can see the hand pump (Guzzler 500) in the picture, I attached this to the vertical pipe but it would not pull anything other than a serious vacuum.  The water table is fairly low around here, we are surrounded by lakes, but I don't know exactly what it is.

I thought jet pumps ran the "jet" portion down into the same well casing as the lift portion?  I have no idea where this side pipe goes.  

Any ideas as to what type of pump I can use?  And to that effect, any recommendations on an inverter?  I understand pure sine wave is good for motors, but a pure sine large enough to run a pump would be pricey.  I would get the smallest pump I can find that will do the job, and it will only be used in batch service to fill existing storage containers when needed.  

[kenputer]

to give a proper answer would have to know the lift.Single line would suggest shollow well, max 30' lift so jet or piston pump would work.

ken

[mixerman]

Maybe he could try filling the pipe up with water first! See if the bleeds off. If hand pump has a check valve fill it again through that, then pump. The point might be rusted or cloged up. Just a few thoughts

[electrak]

where is the well? is it straight under the pipe coming up? if so likely a driven well, if not, the up pipe comes out of the well then the jet feed goes down after going though the pump, that would be the side pipe. Or does that go to some shut down line?  Just my best guess.

Where does that valve in the lower right go?  Is that where the pump discharge was cut for city water?

[dave123]

Thanks for the replies.  The valve in the picture is where city water is coming in through the floor.  I will try to fill the 1.5" pipe with water and see what it does.  I thought that 3/4" side pipe was tied into the well pump but do not know for sure.  I just wasn't sure how that side pipe could be tied into the well, if it were for jet pump use, as I thought that wells using jet pumps ran the jet portion into the same casing.

[ghurd]

City water means city sewer too?

Might be a little bit careful about what is connected where/when/how.

They will not appreciate an unmetered water supply feeding the sewage system.

Look into Windy Dankoff's pumps.

Expensive in a way, but they would not need an inverter.

G-

[dave123]

City sewer as well, but the purpose of this is for emergency use only, in case the water supply is inop or compromised in some way.  The new water supply would not be tied into the existing system, it would only be operated now and then to fill containers as needed.

I filled the well pipe with water and it doesn't leak down, well VERY little, like 1" per hour.  Would there be a check valve at the bottom of the well?

[mixerman]

Yes it could have a check valve at the bottom. If there is it should not leak back down though! It may not have the valve and the point is choked up accounting for the slow leak back. In your case you will have to re-prime the pump to use it the way it is now. If the hand pump you have has a check valve in it hook it up and try it, if not get one and give it a go. Thats good water for a garden. Let us know how it works out.

I once replaced one of these and I will never forget doing it, what a job!!!!

[SteveCH]

1. I hadn't heard that well pumps preferred sine wave inverters...our Grunfos pump runs great off our old Trace mod. sine wave. Head is probably 130 ft.
   
2. We have the "Dankoff" Flowlight...for household pressurization. Great pumps, ours is 12 v. and they come in 24 v. I think and 120 v. [Or they used to, not sure about today]. WIndy sold the co. some time ago, though many people still refer to them as Dankoff. I just replaced our pump head after over 20 yr. of use, so they are great. However, at least in our version the head they'll pull is not a lot.
   

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

Can't seem to post...

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

OK, now it's working.  (Had to get the "noscript" settings right so I could do the captcha.  I thought that wasn't necessary for logged-in users.)

Anyway:  Here's the one I composed yesterday but couldn't post because the changeover was in progress by the time I was done:

= = = =

Serious vacuum just means the water is more than 30 feet down.  No big deal.

I'd pull everything off/out-of the hypothetical well pipe then lower a weight on a string.  Then pull it up and see how far down the water level is.  Also how far down the well goes (though you might want to rerun that test after you've cleaned it out.)

You can do a flow test by running an air hose down the pipe and blowing some compressed air down.  The bubbles will lift up the water (not too efficiently, which is why you don't want to do this as the normal operating procedure) and you can see how much you can get and what quality it is.  (Expect it to be pretty dirty at first.)

A submersible pump is good for a couple hundred feet easy.  (You want it near the bottom of the well, because the water level will drop as it's being pumped due to infiltration resistance.)

There are well drillers who specialize in resuscitating old wells.  (However, using one will bring the well to the attention of the local water authorities.)

If you own a property with an old well you may find that you have water rights you didn't know about.  And you may need to defend them or lose them, depending on where you are and the legal regime in place there.  (It varies from state to state within the US, too.  And it's a REALLY BIG DEAL legally.  Like real estate only more so, because water rights can make the difference between nearly-worthless desert and a bonanza farm or subdivision.)

Curiosity:  Where are you at?  Is it likely the well was just retired when the city water came in?

Once you get it working you'll want to run it a little every few weeks to clean it out and keep it clean.

Once it's cleaned out and flowing you'll need to sanitize it and to check that it is pulling good water, not some contaminated crud.

Don't be surprised if it's a cistern - a big underground tank to store rain water collected from the roof - though the vacuum argues for a well.  (If it IS a cistern there are cute, no-moving-parts-but-the-water, plumbing arrangements to automatically dump the first few gallons of downspout water from each storm, along with the dirt they wash off the roof, then capture the rest.)

[Ungrounded Lightning Rod]

Hmmm...  Not sure whether the compressed-air thing works directly or if you need a compressed-air-powered pump to get it to happen.