Author Topic: Grounding an inverter  (Read 9712 times)

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solarengineer

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Grounding an inverter
« on: January 26, 2007, 12:10:35 AM »
I have a bunch of inverters ranging from 75w to 1000w with various manufacturers.

what is was wondering is,


is there a common method for grounding inverters to avoid shocks. i know most hydro panels have a ground rod and a neutral bonding strip to ground inside the panel. but inverter manufacturers say do not bond the neutral with ground.


so how do you ground an inverter to the house mains for safety? none of these are grid intertie and none have a ground screw.


thanks


jamie

« Last Edit: January 26, 2007, 12:10:35 AM by (unknown) »

kurt

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Re: Grounding an inverter
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2007, 05:26:23 PM »
you need to buy an inverter that is designed to work with house wiring. the ones you have are portable inverters and therefor are not designed to be grounded    
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 05:26:23 PM by (unknown) »

Tom in NH

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Re: Grounding an inverter
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2007, 09:46:09 PM »
Be careful with grounding. I once made the stoopid mistake of connecting an inverter ground to the negative battery terminal and I instantly fried the inverter. I've seen recommendations that frames and cases should be connected to an earth ground for lightning protection, but not for shock protection. --tom
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 09:46:09 PM by (unknown) »

coldspot

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Re: Grounding an inverter
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2007, 12:42:53 AM »
« Last Edit: January 26, 2007, 12:42:53 AM by (unknown) »
$0.02

maker of toys

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Re: Grounding an inverter
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2007, 12:49:54 AM »
TOM in NH:  good point, and good reminder.


the problem you report (blown inverter from improper grounding technique) is probably something that should wind up in the Newbies section. . . ?  Truly a case where being excessively safe is not a good thing.


for the rest of you. . . even in cases where you're using a permanent-installation type of inverter, DO NOT, under any circumstances, make a connection between the AC section and the (lower voltage, floating input) DC section.  DO Not even to ground the battery bank if the AC side is also grounded. . . those of you with lightning protection in your systems might want to check the resistance between the batteries and the grounding point for the lightning suppression unit before undertaking any grounding or permanent inverter installation project.


the exception, of course, would be if the manufacturer's installation manual explicitly calls for grounding both input and output.


defeating the isolation between the sections of your inverter, at the minimum, will make the inverter ineffient. . . other outcomes including electric shock or fire are possible depending on the exact details of the installation.


if you must ground the inverter, and if you have to choose one section of the inverter to ground, make it the AC side. . . subject to the above about grounded battery banks, and the below about 'floating' outputs.  Grounding some inverters could be less safe than not grounding them.  (grid tie and grid-charged UPS types are obviously designed for some form of grounding, and will be appropriately equipped.  Plus their manuals will have some advice on the subject)


to check to see if your inverter will benefit from grounding: with a meter, check to see that the case of the inverter is not connected to the battery terminal/s (should be 100s of Kilo-ohms at least, better if meg-ohms.; no reputable inverter I have encountered has failed this test.)


Also check to see that niether of the AC lines is connected to the case (meg-ohms again) and DO NOT USE an inverter that fails this test. . . .


Check also to see if the 'ground' prong of the outlet is tied to the case. in many situations it will be, and this is acceptable, even good.


If the inverter passes those tests, then you can tie the case to ground for peace of mind without damaging the equipment or yourself. But, unless the inverter case is factory equipped with a grounding screw or grounding stud, you will not gain much by tying it down.


with the common portable sort of 120VAC inverter, there is no 'true' neutral in the system;  instead each leg of the AC is about 60 VAC off the case potential, which  serves as sort of a psuedo-ground.


Grid-tied House wiring, however, is usually done with the neutral bus tied to ground in the service entry panel. . . so if you hook the common (portable) sort of inverter up as temporary power, one side of the (normally floating) AC output  becomes a ground reference. . . . which might lead to problems if there is a ground fault in a piece of equipment in your house and the inverter is grounded on the wrong AC leg, or if the isolation is defeated.  (problems, in this case, being defined as short circuits and ground faults of varying severity. . . anywhere from 'tingle' to 'smoke.')


If you are designing/building  a off-grid house from the get-go, your grounding arrangements will (obviously) have to be whatever makes your building inspector happy, and may involve some compromises in the inverter installation. . . . just be sure that you don't wind up with a floating AC output terminal and the inverter case both tied to the same bus.  


hope that helps more than it hinders!


-Dan

« Last Edit: January 26, 2007, 12:49:54 AM by (unknown) »

maker of toys

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Re: Grounding an inverter
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2007, 01:04:31 AM »
OK, so I goofed.  if you have an inverter that is capable of dual-voltage output (e.g. 120& 240) then you may encounter a situation where the case IS seemingly tied to the output legs. . . . and the appropriate thing to do here is check the manual or with the manufacturer; it's possible that the center tap of the output transformer is connected to the ground for the system.


(I personally wouldn't do this; the center-tap isn't always the zero-potential point, especially if the transformer sees a highly asymmetrical load. but I don't build inverters for sale, either. . . there may be some other concern I'm overlooking.)

-D

« Last Edit: January 26, 2007, 01:04:31 AM by (unknown) »