Need help from folks in Pennsylvania / sw New York

[petect]

Hi to all from someone who has been lurking & learning here for quite a while.
I'm starting to look for a place to retire. For me, retirement (hopefully) will be living a life that is as  self reliant as practical.  Living off the grid, and growing all of my food is a nice dream – living very efficiently and producing some of my energy and food is more realistic.

Pennsylvania ( possibly sw New York state) seems to offer the most promise, but the more time I spend reading, and on the internet, the more confused I get. It seems that land / water / mineral use laws, property taxes, etc.  vary widely between Counties, and Townships.

So I'm hoping that someone who is familiar especially with Pa. and sees the world the way I think most who visit this site do, will be kind enough to share his / her thoughts. I will be looking for several = acres where I can build my retirement “experiment.”  Here are some of the things I'm looking for, and want to avoid.

DESIRABLE:
6 hours or less, drive time to Hartford, ct.
HYDRO POTENTIAL
Potential for a large garden / greenhouses
45 min or less to stores, highway
Local zoning that will consider unconvential (container house?) housing / outbuildings – not visible from street or neighbors - all building codes will be met
Reasonable distance to lakes or ponds would be nice – I'm a bass fishing addict.

UNDESIRABLE:
Getting caught up in the gas exploration / drilling thing.
Anywhere where the traffic drowns out the sounds of birds.

 My email address is petect(@att.net) remove the ()'s, if it's better for you  to contact me directly.

Thanks in advance,
Pete

[defed]

i live in WNY, and i'd urge you to NOT move to NY.  taxes are insane, the state is bankrupt, they can't even pass a budget...and i suppose it will only get worse!  i know a guy who used to live in PA, gun laws there are easier (we have NYC to make sure we are all 'safe' from ourselves) if you have interest in them.

[ghurd]

taxes are insane

Just curious.
How much to NY plates cost for say a personal use little Toyota Tacoma pick-up truck?
I was a bit unsettled when OH charged me $58.

I stopped at Bass Pro in Auburn a couple days ago.  They told me the FN Five-Seven only holds 10. 
Hate to think how dangerous that 11th one must be.
G-

[defed]

i honestly forgot how much it was to get plates/registration for my ranger, registration is only due every 2 yrs.  they have so many fees added on.  a couple of years ago, they made everyone get new licenses....this year, they are making everyone get new plates...they are desperate for revenue.

[kurt]

$58 is cheap its $99 a year for a license plate sticker in IL.

[ghurd]

An 'X' said she paid like $650 for tags on a non-com Datson PU with a pine 2x4 bed.
(Yup.  Datsun.  Not Nissan.  The yung-uns will need to google 'Datsun')
That may have been in FL, but she's in NY now.

I sold my non-com, no sides, lightest cheapest class possible, utility trailer.
Paid like $7 or 10 a year at my folks mailing address.
My current mailing address was like $60 a year.
Seems like quite a jump because of a 5 mile change in the geography of where its parked 364 days a year.
And I never had it here for more than 12 hours!

[Fused]

We dont need trailer tags at all here in SC, but we have to pay yearly TAX on the value of our vehicles then there is the sticker price and every 4 years a new tag price. Get had coming and going.

Fused

[defed]

i've heard of ppl who live in other states who have no state income tax, low property tax etc...but they always seem to make up for it in other places.  i guess we don't pay as much for licenses here in NY (it's less than $99/yr), but i guarantee i make up for it somewhere else!

i think it was my sister, who lives in texas, pays no state income tax, but their property tax is out of this world...even worse than mine in NY.

[Tritium]

i think it was my sister, who lives in texas, pays no state income tax, but their property tax is out of this world...even worse than mine in NY.

I am in Texas. No income tax. No building inspectors or permits, Low Property Tax as well. A little over $1200 a year for 800 Acres with barns and house. The key is not to live near ANY big city or a county that contains a population over 5000 persons but of course you need to learn to do without restaurants, movie theaters, malls and the like that are readily available in the city and you need to be able to cope with wild pigs and rattlesnakes, severe thunderstorms, tornadoes, occasional large hail and lots of wind and blowing dust.

Thurmond

[taylorp035]

Erie County Pennsylvania meets most of your requirements, as you can be anywhere in the city in 45 minutes ( more like 20, and I live in the sticks ).  The fishing is amazing, as people from all around the world come here.  You can even go ice fishing in the winter ( 100's of people are on the bay every day ).  Presque Isle is an excellent place, as it has about 7 miles of perfect beaches, walking paths, boat launches, and much more.  It has about 4 million visitors a year!

We have tax free clothing in PA, so therefore we have a large shopping mall that many Canadians utilize thoroughly.  Traffic is unheard of.  Maybe 2 minutes on a busy Saturday on upper peach street.

As for gardening, we get plenty of rainfall (45 inches/year).  Snow fall ranges from 100-300" a year, depending on location.  We have excellent access to I-90 and I-79 + I-86.  I-80 is only an hour away.  Cleveland, Buffalo, and Pittsburgh are only 2 hr's away.

As for wind, you are best to be by the lake, as the edge has class 3 and 4 wind sites.  The lake itself is at least a class 5.  The I-90 ridges sits a good 500-700 feet above the lake, so the wind is decent.  Some areas have restrictions, but the county as a whole does not.  Several 10kw Bergey windmills are running around the region (at least 3 that I know of).  Solar power is disappointing, as we average about 1.5-2 hrs of full sunlight a day ( basically zero from November to March).  But a hybrid system would work very well here ( Summer averages about 5hr's a day ).  The 10kw bergey on Presque Isle does 17k Kwh's a year.  

The 6 hr drive to CT is pushing it.  It takes 6 hrs to get to Philly, maybe 8-9 to NYC (I think).

As for land, there is plenty of options that are cheap.  A 10-20 acre plot is very easily attainable, some even larger.
  

[TomW]

i think it was my sister, who lives in texas, pays no state income tax, but their property tax is out of this world...even worse than mine in NY.

I am in Texas. No income tax. No building inspectors or permits, Low Property Tax as well. A little over $1200 a year for 800 Acres with barns and house. The key is not to live near ANY big city or a county that contains a population over 5000 persons but of course you need to learn to do without restaurants, movie theaters, malls and the like that are readily available in the city and you need to be able to cope with wild pigs and rattlesnakes, severe thunderstorms, tornadoes, occasional large hail and lots of wind and blowing dust.

Thurmond

Thurmond;

Hehe, sounds like my kind of place. I value not hearing the neighbor flush his crapper. :?D

Plenrty of backdrop for high speed lead to settle to earth safely.

The rattlers can make a fine meal done right.

Getting crowded hereabouts now.

What was the subject of the original thread again?

Sorry for the additional topic drift.

Tom

[harley1782000]

Well I live in pa, All I have to say is do some research on where you want to live to see what kind of rules they have for re.  I got in a battle with my area I live in.

Jim

Oh, Its a nice state.  Lots of open country to choose from.  If I had to choose where I could live in this state it would be in around Amish.  You know there not going to bug ya.

[Tritium]

Thurmond;
The rattlers can make a fine meal done right.
Tom

Tom here is the trick. Feed the snakes to the pigs and eat the pigs. Much better that way. (see the opening scenes of "Lonsome Dove")

Thurmond

[petect]

Guys   Thanks for the info.

Yes, as much as i like the area, I've pretty much crossed N.Y state off the list due to the taxes as confirmed here.

Jim  I've been to Amish country several times. I agree with you. It's pretty country, and the Amish lead a lifestyle I could live with. Your comment about being careful about choosing a place to move to is exactly the reason for my post. From the "research" I've done, it seems that a move of just a few miles to another Township can have a drastic impact on taxes, land use laws, etc.

Taylor  Thanks. I'll ad Erie County to my list of places to check out. And yes, I'm aware of the fishing.

When looking at maps, I find myself being drawn toward the central & eastern parts of the state. Potential for hydro is a major consideration for me, and I'm sure there is plenty available near the bases of the hills there. It also seems that quite a bit of that area is caught up in drilling for natural gas. That is something i really want to avoid.
 
If anyone has any other thoughts about counties / townships to look into, or avoid , please pass them along.

Thanks
Pete

[ghurd]

I liked Indiana, PA.
Spent some time there over the years.
Seemed like a nice place.
College town, but kind of tame (what I saw).
All the required stuff, but kind of a trek for something not available in a mid-sized town.

'Christmas Tree Capitol of the World',
plus a lot of coal strip mined land, which I would expect is pretty reasonably priced.
A lot of vacant/abandoned houses in the outlying areas.
Pretty sure gas wells are abundant.  If there is gas, can be sure someone is drilling for it, or they will be before long.

A few miles out of town puts you in the boonies.

The area could have issues I am not aware of.
It just seemed nice when I was there.
G-

[TXWolfie]

Pete I lived in Pa for about 15 years and I loved it Hawley, Wayne county, Pennsylvania . People were awesome, very laid back and relaxed not alot of work mind ya but sometimes ya take good with bad. Nice hunting laws and fairly easy to get a gun permit think it was like 10$ for a CCW, If you buy enough property you can farm it with corn and use the deer management/pest clause and there is your meat and there is no limit. Same like anywhere else the closer your near a town the more money land will be but it is fairly cheap or at least was when I lived there, now it might not of changed Honesdale and Hawley are basically small towns streets roll up at 6 pm. You can dig your own pond and stock it with trout bought from the local bait shop (they use them to catch Stripers) but as long as there is no stream connecting to it you dont need a fishing license. The more you go west the cheaper it is, basically moving away from NY state. As far as oil rigs and mineral rites I dont think I ever seen anything like that in the areas I lived in. And in the Middleburg area funny as it sounds the soil/temp is great for a winery. Well I can probably go on for a while but I hope this helps a lil more to a decision any more questions just ask away