Now these are the sort of batteries I'd like!

[DamonHD]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/08/15/lithium_ion_batteries_quick_charge/

"South Korean boffins say they have found a way to cut battery charging times for electric cars from hours down to just minutes."

Rgds

Damon

BTW Have started discussions with a supplier into possibly taking whole house off grid in summer (except to export excess generation from our PV), but with boring old fashioned Li battery chemistry.

[bob g]

in order to recharge at the rates needed to fully utilize the technology
and get the exceptionally low recharge time, it would appear to me that if one were thinking of doing it with a wind generator, he might be needing to look for a 50ft rotor and some good wind speed.

current technology requires a 220-240volt service plug (here in the states) which tells me the draw is akin to a electric dryer at least, now consider something that can be recharged in 1/30 to 1/120 of the time?

that means a minimum of 30 times the input current to as much as 120 times the input current?

that should be fun! 

i can see it now, drive into your garage, directly into the charging dock (because the cables needed to connect would be very large) and then get out, hit the button on the wall, and shazam... the whole neighborhood browns out!

i am thinking that at 220volts charging current technology, the amperage is probably around 30amps for what they call fast charge today, so in order to do it in 1/30 of the time?  lets see here  30 x30amps= 900amps at 220vac input!

can anyone spell thermonuclear meltdown!

i don't see this technology being something that could be fully utilized given the state of our grid, and the safety issues involved.

let alone liability issues for the oem's

bob g

[taylorp035]

The battery technology is certainly already here to charge the cars fast.... I would comfortably say 10 minute charge time for a 98% charge from empty should be possible.

I think it will be doable on a Chevy Volt... say about 10 kwh after you factor in the charging losses.... so 6C rate equals 60 kW... not that crazy for a store or highway rest plaza.  Of course if you try filling your new Model S with it's 85 kwh battery, the practicality might not look so good.

I believe they already have a few Level 3 chargers for the Nissan Leaf in Japan.  They are rated at 480V @ 125 amps or 60 kW.  But according to the people who have used them, the batteries only charge that fast for the first few percent and then it gets progressively slower....  I don't blame it since there isn't any cooling for the leaf's batteries and that 60 kW would represent about a 3-4 C charge rate...   The same thing happened with my supermileage car batteries.  They are advertised at 12C charge rate, which would mean a 5 minute charge, but in reality it takes about 10 minutes by the time the amperage is ramped down for the last 20% or so.  But I don't think anyone would complain with a 10 min charge.  The batteries don't even get warm after than.  Of course the cycle life is probably not the greatest when you push the cells that hard.

[DamonHD]

Fast charging is mast useful for dedicated top-up points at places that in the past may have quaintly sold gasoline/petrol.  I think the effective power for a gas/petrol top-up is is of the order of MW (megawatts) and if this took a similar time then (a) a local substation could be provided to manage/supply that intermittently and (b) an argument against electric cars on convenience grounds would fall away.

BTW, some enterprising person might build a stack of these in at the recharging station to provide grid support (that power can flow both ways)!  If nothing else a big battery at the recharging station could supply the energy for the car batteries at times when the grid is too congested.

But anyway, I want these for solar, so I need not worry about current limiting under any normal conditions, eg on a day with intermittent bright sunshine.

Rgds

Damon

[bob g]

don't get me wrong Damon, i can see the attraction for solar/wind or other AE use, but we need them in cars to drive the price down to something realistic...

in my opinion the charging capability is at least 20years away, unless the green folks will let up on their stranglehold on approval of nuke plants, and clean coal technologies.

otherwise you have the government picking winners and losers again, which filling station will get the chargers and why, which won't and why?

i am thinking that a substation would certainly be needed, because for this to really work out well the topping/filling station would need to service up to 12 or more cars at the same time, now we are talking some pretty serious power... this isn't likely to be reality for a very long time in fly over country... in bigger metro area's maybe, but not in the vast majority of places all of which are needed to make the technology really take off in the mainstream.

also, i am really concerned with safety issues relating to this sort of fast charge, something able to deliver 60 kwatts or more is not something i would want just anyone making the connections too, even if it had multiple layers of safety interlocks, i am picturing dirty or damage connectors and some bozo not knowing a light bulb from a door knob connecting a dirty connector and then punching the charge button... lots of heat, lots of flames and probably lots of calamity.

maybe best deployed in city and government vehicles, police cars, taxi's where they can be maintained, charged, monitored and proven by trained professionals for a few years. that time lag could be put to use building the needed infrastructure to support these things.

bob g